What style coach does this team need?

[I-90 W]

I’m thinking a hard nosed, call players out, sit them on the bench type of coach. My personal opinion is that this franchise has had three primary problems the last decade plus; poor drafting, soft play and lack of accountability. The coach can’t fix the drafting but the other two issues he can influence. 

[Thorner]

One the Pegula's know knows more about NHL hockey than they do 

That's evergreen BTW for all organizational hires

[jad1]

Fix the defensive zone coverage.

Fix the transition game.

Create lineups that make sense.

Define roles and expectations for each player.  

Inject energy into practices and the locker room.

 

[Kruppstahl]

"Style" is meaningless IMO.

What they need is an experienced NHL coach who knows how to win and has won in many different situations.

It's why I love Boudreau for the job, but Gallant or Julien would be fine too.

The fact that none of those 3 have been named HC as of today tells me they aren't going to be hired.

So I assume we will hire the wrong guy again.  Probably a college coach.

 

[steveoath]

Someone who will hold individuals accountable,  and pla the best available players.

[Gatorman0519]

[Weave]

Style is unimportant.  The players need to be all in for a change.  A coach that commands respect through his accomplishments and record is needed.

No more benefit of the doubt for this group of core players.  You've had 3 swings.  OK, maybe we call Ralph a foul ball.  Bottom line, it's time to stop blaming coaching.

[Marvin]

I mentioned somewhere else that the coach needs to get the players to execute the prerequisites to hockey 101 (attention to detail, accountability, execution of fundamentals).  If that doesn't happen, then nothing else matters.

I actually have a preferred system for the current line-up, but because I have less hockey knowledge than Kim Pegula, I will refrain from expounding on it here.

[sweetlou]

Gallant or Torts?

[Stoner]

Take a step back. How should it work? Think of the most successful sports franchises? Are they swimming around looking for a philosophy or a style? Or has the philosophy been long established and everything fits that philosophy? Terry and Kim clearly aren't equipped to construct the wellspring from which everything else flows. That's why you need a hockey czar. Don't like that idea and want the GM to be it? Fine, but then GMKA's "What is a Sabre?" was a mish mash of pish posh. Where does that leave us?

The players fit the coach. The coach fits the GM. The GM fits the philosophy, which has staying power despite the people who come and go.

Examples? The Pittsburgh Steelers are a good one, I think. Blitzburgh. Run and stop the run?

[Thorner]

18 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Take a step back. How should it work? Think of the most successful sports franchises? Are they swimming around looking for a philosophy or a style? Or has the philosophy been long established and everything fits that philosophy? Terry and Kim clearly aren't equipped to construct the wellspring from which everything else flows. That's why you need a hockey czar. Don't like that idea and want the GM to be it? Fine, but then GMKA's "What is a Sabre?" was a mish mash of pish posh. Where does that leave us?

The players fit the coach. The coach fits the GM. The GM fits the philosophy, which has staying power despite the people who come and go.

Examples? The Pittsburgh Steelers are a good one, I think. Blitzburgh. Run and stop the run?

How much of a team having an "identity" is accepted narrative, allowed to exist seemingly eternally so long as the team is successful overall? I've long suspected the only "true" lasting identity is success. After that, you can claim whatever "intangible" you want as a franchise, because the wins simply justify whatever "this is just the way we do it" claim said organization wants to make, in the eyes of the consumer/fan at large.

The Steelers were last in rushing yards this year, bottom 4 the year before - haven't been running it well for a while, to be honest. But Tomlin is there, they always have a winning record, so the Pittsburgh Steelers remain the PITTSBURGH STEELERS. 

Don't really have much to go on here, just a long held theory. What's the Patriots' identity? "Just do your job?" Groundbreaking. I think their identity was really having the best coach QB combo of all time. 

Edited May 9, 2021 by Thorny

[Curt]

44 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Take a step back. How should it work? Think of the most successful sports franchises? Are they swimming around looking for a philosophy or a style? Or has the philosophy been long established and everything fits that philosophy? Terry and Kim clearly aren't equipped to construct the wellspring from which everything else flows. That's why you need a hockey czar. Don't like that idea and want the GM to be it? Fine, but then GMKA's "What is a Sabre?" was a mish mash of pish posh. Where does that leave us?

The players fit the coach. The coach fits the GM. The GM fits the philosophy, which has staying power despite the people who come and go.

Examples? The Pittsburgh Steelers are a good one, I think. Blitzburgh. Run and stop the run?

Pittsburgh Steelers, last in the NFL in rushing yards and bottom 4 in the league in each of the past three seasons.  It’s a nostalgic narrative that you are presenting.

Teams go through different variations in strategy based on coaching and personnel.

I don’t see anything wrong with Adams’ written vision for what a Sabre is.  Hardworking on and off ice, self-driven, competitive, team oriented.  Seems right.

You can’t base a team philosophy around only  player skill sets because you need a wide range of skill sets to fill out a team, and sometimes just through random variance you are just going to end up with more players who are good at one skill or another.

[Thorner]

14 minutes ago, Curt said:

Pittsburgh Steelers, last in the NFL in rushing yards and bottom 4 in the league in each of the past three seasons.  It’s a nostalgic narrative that you are presenting.

Teams go through different variations in strategy based on coaching and personnel.

I don’t see anything wrong with Adams’ written vision for what a Sabre is.  Hardworking on and off ice, self-driven, competitive, team oriented.  Seems right.

You can’t base a team philosophy around only  player skill sets because you need a wide range of skill sets to fill out a team, and sometimes just through random variance you are just going to end up with more players who are good at one skill or another.

We should be clear it's not PA's "narrative", there's no agenda, it's just the one that's commonly accepted basically universally where the Steelers are concerned

I don't have a problem with KA's written vision or whatever, it's just meaningless. 

- - - 

Winning gives a team's Creed value. Having a Creed doesn't create wins. 

Edited May 9, 2021 by Thorny

[Thorner]

"Weak minded, selfish individuals with no desire to improve or win a championship, who wilt at the first sign of adversity, need not apply"

Thanks, Kevyn. 

Edited May 9, 2021 by Thorny

[Curt]

3 minutes ago, Thorny said:

We should be clear it's not PA's "narrative", there's no agenda, it's just the one that's commonly accepted basically universally where the Steelers are concerned

I don't have a problem with KA's written vision or whatever, it's just meaningless. 

- - - 

Winning gives a team's Creed value. Having a Creed doesn't create wins. 

Agreed regarding the narrative.

A piece of paper with some words doesn’t make one bit of difference.  However, the idea is to have a set of guiding principles, then execute good decisions based upon those principles.  

[Thorner]

3 minutes ago, Curt said:

Agreed regarding the narrative.

A piece of paper with some words doesn’t make one bit of difference.  However, the idea is to have a set of guiding principles, then execute good decisions based upon those principles.  

Just noticed the picture in your profile, that's pretty sweet

[Kristian]

Likely, someone the Pegula’s are too stupid to hire.

[Stoner]

7 minutes ago, Curt said:

Agreed regarding the narrative.

A piece of paper with some words doesn’t make one bit of difference.  However, the idea is to have a set of guiding principles, then execute good decisions based upon those principles.  

What are the principles though? That was Kevyn's chance to elucidate them.

[Stoner]

10 minutes ago, Thorny said:

"Weak minded, selfish individuals with no desire to improve or win a championship, who wilt at the first sign of adversity, need not apply"

Thanks, Kevyn. 

That's getting closer. What Kevyn needs to figure out is how to get the right guys for the situation the franchise is in. Do they give any thought to pyschologically profiling prospective players? Who wants to be part of rebuilding a historically bad hockey team in a small Rust Belt city, with bad weather etc.? It's a rare breed of cat. Cozens sure seems to fit the bill.

[Stoner]

To both of you: does winning just happen accidentally then? Then you're golden, for awhile anyway?

More specifically to the topic at hand, do you want to hire a coach who fits the current players' styles and personalities? Mittelstadt might have openly lobbied for Granato after the game yesterday. Great, but then what happens when Mitts and others like the coach until they don't (again)? The tail can't wag the dog.

[Curt]

9 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

What are the principles though? That was Kevyn's chance to elucidate them.

6 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

That's getting closer. What Kevyn needs to figure out is how to get the right guys for the situation the franchise is in. Do they give any thought to pyschologically profiling prospective players? Who wants to be part of rebuilding a historically bad hockey team in a small Rust Belt city, with bad weather etc.? It's a rare breed of cat. Cozens sure seems to fit the bill.

I think the written statement pretty much outlines the type of person who might willingly undertake such an endeavor.

 

[dudacek]

I believe the word that embodies Kevyn’s philosophy is “relentless”

Quinn and Peterka seem to have that element. Bjork and Caggiula are jags, but you can see it in their game. It’s why I think they are targeting Beniers.

I don’t believe this philosophy powered last off-season, which I think was about Kevyn filling in the boxes of Ralph’s checklist.

It will be interesting to see how it manifests itself in his moves this summer.

Edited May 9, 2021 by dudacek

[Stoner]

10 minutes ago, Curt said:

I think the written statement pretty much outlines the type of person who might willingly undertake such an endeavor.

 

I guess I'd be more overt and honest about it. Just lay it out.

[Curt]

4 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

To both of you: does winning just happen accidentally then? Then you're golden, for awhile anyway?

More specifically to the topic at hand, do you want to hire a coach who fits the current players' styles and personalities? Mittelstadt might have openly lobbied for Granato after the game yesterday. Great, but then what happens when Mitts and others like the coach until they don't (again)? The tail can't wag the dog.

I think a good coach has a certain amount of flexibility to work with, not every player, but a very wide range of players.  You can’t pick a coach because the players like him (didn’t we just see that?).  However picking a coach based upon what is right for the players you have?  That can be a good idea.  Especially when a team has a well established group of “core” players, which Buffalo doesn’t really have anyway.

3 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

I guess I'd be more overt and honest about it. Just lay it out.

I guess I don’t see how the statement is vague.  I think it’s quite clear.

How would you make it more clear?

[Stoner]

51 minutes ago, Curt said:

I think a good coach has a certain amount of flexibility to work with, not every player, but a very wide range of players.  You can’t pick a coach because the players like him (didn’t we just see that?).  However picking a coach based upon what is right for the players you have?  That can be a good idea.  Especially when a team has a well established group of “core” players, which Buffalo doesn’t really have anyway.

I guess I don’t see how the statement is vague.  I think it’s quite clear.

How would you make it more clear?

It's not my main criticism, but it's so poorly worded. How does one "improve on" challenges, for example?