2021 NHL Draft Rankings

[PerreaultForever]

5 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I think Eklund is the best player in this draft. 

Also BPA is a misnomer because it varies by what you are looking for. Beniers has a non stop motor that Powers doesn't, something that elevates him over Powers. 

I've noticed you're smitten with Eklund, and I won't argue that he is potentially a good player, but I've not seen him ranked #1 anywhere. he usually comes in around #5 give or take. Power on the other hand is usually ranked #1 to #3 depending on who it is. 

[Brawndo]

10 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

You figure out a way to trade for Seth Jarvis and I will be all on board the Brandt Clarke train. 

Simple way to acquire Jarvis. 
 

With the 8th Pick in the 2020 NHL Entry Draft the Buffalo Sabres are proud to select from the WHL Portland Winterhawks Forward Seth Jarvis 

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

Simple way to acquire Jarvis. 
 

With the 8th Pick in the 2020 NHL Entry Draft the Buffalo Sabres are proud to select from the WHL Portland Winterhawks Forward Seth Jarvis 

We weren't smart enough for that. Which brings me to this...

 

6 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I've noticed you're smitten with Eklund, and I won't argue that he is potentially a good player, but I've not seen him ranked #1 anywhere. he usually comes in around #5 give or take. Power on the other hand is usually ranked #1 to #3 depending on who it is. 

I don't care where the ranks have them. Powers is ranked 1-3 for the most part... he's also got a 9 and 6 ranking. Further the first tier of this draft is about 5-6 guys so dissecting them and figuring out where to pick them is very important. If I read 1 more scouting report about Powers being 6'5" I might slap someone mainly because that doesn't mean a lot. 

Seth Jarvis was ranked 18th in the consolidated rankings. It make absolutely no sense as he was clearly a top 10 player including Cole Perfetti and our own Jack Quinn. Fast forward one year and the guy who was scoring at the same rate as Cozens last year in the WHL dropped 11 points in 9 AHL games. The rankings don't mean much to me anymore and I won't rely on them for anything other than a general list of names. 

I think Brandt Clarke is the best defender in this draft. Eklund is the best forward, Beniers is the best 200ft player. Powers for me falls outside of this group, I think Michigan limited him somewhat as to the style they play but I also think if he were 6'3" he would drop 2-3 spots as there are those rankings totally enamored with his size. I think Powers has a really high ceiling but I have no faith in Buffalo being able to get him to that ceiling. Eklund, Beniers, and Clarke are more finished products who need less from the Sabres. In Beniers case, his on ice work ethic is what makes me most excited, he has that non stop motor this team desperately needs. 

I like Powers, but he's not tops on my list. 

[LGR4GM]

This is from December when no one had really started back up yet. I want you to think about how much the rankings influence the future. 

Quote

Four of our 10 scouts have Power at No. 1. Perhaps more telling, though, is that none of our 10 scouts ranked him any lower than fourth overall.

So while three other players — Swedish defenceman Simon Edvinsson; Edmonton Oil Kings forward Dylan Guenther; and Finnish centre Aatu Raty — each got two votes as the top prospect, those players’ other rankings were more all over the map, including some rankings outside of the Top 10.

As far as I can tell, McKenzie has not released any updated list. I am noting this because reading this demonstrates the issue with rankings, they get done early and than as long as player meets expectations, they tend to stay at or close the spot of their first ranking. 

Edited March 22, 2021 by LGR4GM

[LGR4GM]

Owen Powers highlights.

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

On 3/21/2021 at 9:49 PM, LGR4GM said:

I think Eklund is the best player in this draft. 

Also BPA is a misnomer because it varies by what you are looking for. Beniers has a non stop motor that Powers doesn't, something that elevates him over Powers. 

Wow, 3rd time in a week you have come over to the dark side.  Finally you agree that there is no such thing  as BPA.  It doesn't exist and never has as each team, each GM, each scout is looking for something different, similar maybe but different.  

I also agree that Beniers is the pick.

Doesn't really matter who we draft anyway.  Our development record is atrocious. 

I went and looked at how bad we are at drafting and developing centers as centers.

Here are the centers we are drafted in the 1st 2 rounds in the last 25 years

1) Erik Rasmussen 1996 1st 7th overall - Depth center

2) Mike Zigomanis 1999 2-64, faxgate - semi bust depth player

3) Jiri Novotny 2001 1-22, bust

4) Derek Roy - 2001 2-32, 2/3 line center - 524 pts in 738 games

5) Marek Zagrapan - 2005 1-13 - complete bust zero NHL games

6) Tyler Ennis LW/C - 2008 1-26 - solid pick but more LW then C

7) Grigorenko - 2012 1-12 - semi bust, just waived in his return to the NHL

8.) Girgensons -2012 1-14 - 4th line LW

9)  Compher - 2013 2-35 - Solid pick but traded, 3rd line C for Avs but struggling this season

10) Hurley - 2013 2-38 - complete bust

11) Reinhart - 2014 1-2 - 1st line RW

12) Eichel - 2015 1-2 - 1st line center

13) Asplund LW/C - 2016 2-33, LW still trying to break into the NHL full-time

14) Mittelstadt - 2017 1-8, 3rd line LW at this point.

15) Davidsson - 2017 2-37, bust

16) Cozens - 2019 1-7, already pushed to RW

Besides Eichel and Roy we haven't develop another top 6 center in 25 years.  Friggin awful.

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by GASabresIUFAN

[LGR4GM]

Which is why I think it is imperative to draft Beniers. We don't need to develop him, he's ready to plug and play. 

[WildCard]

19 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Wow, 3rd time in a week you have come over to the dark side.  Finally you agree that there is no such thing  as BPA.  It doesn't exist and never has as each team, each GM, each scout is looking for something different, similar maybe but different.  

It exists in the sense that you shouldn't take a player based on positional need. If you have two Centers you're choosing from and they have different qualities you like, then BPA is misleading. 

[LGR4GM]

This is Beniers on a PK. He just eats time while doing nothing stupid with the puck. Just calmly wasting 20 seconds. 

 

[GASabresIUFAN]

45 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Which is why I think it is imperative to draft Beniers. We don't need to develop him, he's ready to plug and play. 

I agree wholeheartedly.  

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, WildCard said:

It exists in the sense that you shouldn't take a player based on positional need. If you have two Centers you're choosing from and they have different qualities you like, then BPA is misleading. 

It doesn’t exist and it never has.  Positional need for the organization is in most competent teams check list otherwise you have times where we had no centers (Regier), no D (TM) or not enough forwards (JB).  It’s one of the reason we lack depth.  If you don’t draft centers you don’t have any to develop.  Also need by skill set is also an imperative.  Draft only small forwards and you end up not having anyone who can deliver a hit.  

Take this draft.  We have skilled forwards in the NHL and system, but we lack forwards who contribute at both ends.  That’s why Beniers is probably a better pick for us then say Powers.  Need is always a factor whether management admits it or not. 

Edited March 22, 2021 by GASabresIUFAN

[WildCard]

15 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

It doesn’t exist and it never has.  Positional need for the organization is in most competent teams check list otherwise you have time, like we have where we had no centers (Regier), no D (TM) or not enough forwards (JB).  It’s one of the reason we lack depth.  If you don’t draft centers you don’t have any to develop.  Also need by skill set is also an imperative.  Draft only small forwards and you end up not having anyone who can deliver a hit.  

Take this draft.  We have skilled forwards in the NHL and system, but we lack forwards who contribute at both ends.  That’s why Beniers is probably a better pick for us then say Powers.  Need is always a factor whether management admits it or not. 

It does exist and it always has. How realistic it is to follow and whether teams do it or not is an entirely different matter. Drafting the best prospect at your spot, an overwhelming better d prospect, instead of a center even though you're loaded with defense is taking BPA in spite of need. It's probably harder in hockey, but the Oilers drafted offense for years because that was the best available at the top, and more recently in the NFL Washington took Chase Young over an overwhelming need at the biggest position in sports, QB, because Young was the BPA. And it worked for them.

I'm not saying what we should/shouldn't do in a draft right now, but BPA is a concept that exists across all sports.

[GASabresIUFAN]

22 minutes ago, WildCard said:

It does exist and it always has. How realistic it is to follow and whether teams do it or not is an entirely different matter. Drafting the best prospect at your spot, an overwhelming better d prospect, instead of a center even though you're loaded with defense is taking BPA in spite of need. It's probably harder in hockey, but the Oilers drafted offense for years because that was the best available at the top, and more recently in the NFL Washington took Chase Young over an overwhelming need at the biggest position in sports, QB, because Young was the BPA. And it worked for them.

I'm not saying what we should/shouldn't do in a draft right now, but BPA is a concept that exists across all sports.

BPA is a utopian theory.  Every team has different criterion and therefore a different list and I can guarantee that teams use organization need in creating their lists.  At some point, probably early to mid 3rd round, and even if "need' isn't an original factor it has to come into play.  By the mid 3rd, the mathematical difference between Center X vs Defense Y, is probably on the third decimal point giving the players a bascially equal rating.  At that level it is smarter to make sure that you have a diversified group of prospects vs sticking mindlessly to a list.

Why do most teams commit to drafting a goalie every other year?  It because you have to have goalies in your system.

Edited March 22, 2021 by GASabresIUFAN

[WildCard]

Just now, GASabresIUFAN said:

BPA is a utopian theory.  Every team has different criterion and therefore a different list and I can guarantee that teams use organization need in creating their lists.  At some point, probably early to mid 3rd round, and even if "need' isn't an original factor it has to come into play.  By the mid 3rd, the mathematical difference between Center X vs Defense Y, is probably on the third decimal point giving the players a bascially equal rating.  At that level it is smarter to make sure that you have a diversified group of prospects vs sticking mindlessly to a list.

Sure it's an ideal thing, and I said I don't think it's all that common, but it does exist

[GASabresIUFAN]

2 minutes ago, WildCard said:

Sure it's an ideal thing, and I said I don't think it's all that common, but it does exist

You brought up the NFL earlier, and need drafting is a huge part of the NFL draft.  Beane expects his 1st 3 round picks to come in and contribute immediately.  Also just look at all the articles discussing team needs.  How many teams move up to grab QB's, even marginal ones, to get the next franchise guy.  I don't think Fields is the second best player in the draft.  Many think he is the barely in the top 15 talent wise, yet he could go 2nd overall.  That's the farthest thing from BPA.  Wash made the correct decision in drafting Young, but did the Giants when they took Jones a 6th in 2019?

The NBA, because it's only 2 rounds and the team's expect the 1st rd pick at least to step in and play immediately are often drafting for need.   Baseball has so many rounds that is probably the most likely place to find BPA but then confined only to a particular team.  The Braves are so pitching focused on their lists, it seems that is what the team develops more often then not.  

[WildCard]

1 minute ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

You brought up the NFL earlier, and need drafting is a huge part of the NFL draft.  Beane expects his 1st 3 round picks to come in and contribute immediately.  Also just look at all the articles discussing team needs.  How many teams move up to grab QB's, even marginal ones, to get the next franchise guy.  I don't think Fields is the second best player in the draft.  Many think he is the barely in the top 15 talent wise, yet he could go 2nd overall.  That's the farthest thing from BPA.  Wash made the correct decision in drafting Young, but did the Giants when they took Jones a 6th in 2019?

The NBA, because it's only 2 rounds and the team's expect the 1st rd pick at least to step in and play immediately are often drafting for need.   Baseball has so many rounds that is probably the most likely place to find BPA but then confined only to a particular team.  The Braves are so pitching focused on their lists, it seems that is what the team develops more often then not.  

I don't think you realize I'm agreeing with you for the most part. I agree that in most cases, by most teams, they will and do draft according to need, whether that is positional or the aspects the player at that position brings to the team. All of your last posts are just reiterating the same point, one that I get and agree with.

What I don't agree with is that it doesn't exist entirely. There are cases, Mario Williams, Chase Young, etc. where a team has a clear need at a more important position, but will take the better player. There is certainly the opposite, where you pass on Michael Jordan to take Sam Bowie because you need a Center. All I'm saying in there exists scenarios where at some point the better player will beat out a positional need if that gap is large enough. It certainly happens less in the NHL, where there are fewer different positions to make that decision, but it exists. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

By the way, they took Sam Bowie because they already had Clyde the Glide. 

[WildCard]

Just now, GASabresIUFAN said:

By the way, they took Sam Bowie because they already had Clyde the Glide. 

I mean that was my point lol

[LGR4GM]

#22 in White is Owen Powers

 

[Curt]

Here is another full game of Owen Power if anyone is interested.

 

[Scottysabres]

5 minutes ago, Curt said:

Here is another full game of Owen Power if anyone is interested.

 

Big kid.

[#freejame]

38 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

#22 in White is Owen Powers

 

Cream, Liger. Show those sweaters the respect they deserve. 

[Crusader1969]

6 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Which is why I think it is imperative to draft Beniers. We don't need to develop him, he's ready to plug and play. 

Exactly right.  Eklund is also thought to be near NHL ready.  Also both have late 2003 birthdays; so they are older prospects for this years draft.  
In 6 years you might be disappointed you didn’t draft Powers. However, this team simply can not afford to wait.

[LGR4GM]

15 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Exactly right.  Eklund is also thought to be near NHL ready.  Also both have late 2003 birthdays; so they are older prospects for this years draft.  
In 6 years you might be disappointed you didn’t draft Powers. However, this team simply can not afford to wait.

I like Powers, I just like others better. 

[inkman]

4 hours ago, #freejame said:

Cream, Liger. 

Said no one ever.  J/k @LGR4GM