NHL Season Start Date: January 13, 2021

[Weave]

29 minutes ago, dudacek said:

How is it being distributed there?

 

 

FOr starters, there won't be enough doses for everyone here until the hockey season is about complete.  Will the NHl get it about the same time other non at risk people get it?  I don't know, but given how things work here it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they pay to jump the line to make sure they are vaccinated well before they would have been otherwise.

I'm also quite certain that there will be many other  corporations within the US that buy doses before they are commonly available to make sure their employees jump the line too.  Frankly, I expect my employer to be one of them.

 

Edited December 12, 2020 by Weave

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

FOr starters, there won't be enough doses for everyone here until the hockey season is about complete.  Will the NHl get it about the same time other non at risk people get it?  I don't know, but given how things work here it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they pay to jump the line to make sure they are vaccinated well before they would have been otherwise.

I'm also quite certain that there will be many other  corporations within the US that buy doses before they are commonly available to make sure their employees jump the line too.  Frankly, I expect my employer to be one of them.

Pfizer will be trying to fulfill a pre-order of 100 million doses, enough for 50 million people. They are paid for. There are none to sell to the Arizona Coyotes. Am I missing something? But I think you're right about how long it's going to take before it's the turn of young, healthy people.

[Stoner]

2 hours ago, SwampD said:

You’re being obtuse. There are already plenty of doses to do both.

Of course, people in nursing homes and healthcare workers should get it first. I already said as much. But like Derrico said, mental health issues are a real thing. Hockey would help a lot of people.

I wonder if this is the hill you would be fighting on if it didn’t effect you personally.

Turn on the news. Pfizer is shipping out six million doses in the next several days. That's it. There might be 40 million doses by the end of the year.

Hill I'm fighting on? Isn't that a saying reserved for someone who's expressing a lonely, unpopular opinion?

You're muddying the waters because you got caught in an indefensible position.

[Stoner]

5 hours ago, Derrico said:

Take a look into suicide rates during Covid vs precovid and come back and talk to me.  Mental health is very real even if u poo poo the idea that watching a bunch of dumb jocks can increase ones mental health.

The purpose of the vaccines right now isn't to return our lives to pre-Covid normal. It's to almost immediately protect those who are most at risk.

Sorry — some hockey games might get postponed. Thoughts and prayers.

[Cal Naughton Jr]

I need Sabres hockey in my life. I don’t care how “selfish” I am. Suck it

[Eleven]

4 hours ago, dudacek said:

How is it being distributed there?

Depends on the state.  

[SwampD]

3 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Turn on the news. Pfizer is shipping out six million doses in the next several days. That's it. There might be 40 million doses by the end of the year.

Hill I'm fighting on? Isn't that a saying reserved for someone who's expressing a lonely, unpopular opinion?

You're muddying the waters because you got caught in an indefensible position.

It’s only indefensible if you ignore the fact that I said health care workers and long term care patients should get it first,... which you did.

You are acting like everyone that doesn’t get the vaccine will die and getting it is the only way to keep people safe. Those who can continue to wfh should and they don’t need the vaccine and can wait. I can go to work like I have every day, practicing all the same precautions that I have been, and I don’t need the vaccine and can wait.

I want to see hockey. They're not playing for a month. Plenty of time to get more doses. A couple of thousand doses isn’t going to bring this country to its knees while providing millions of man-hours of escape from BS

Edited December 13, 2020 by SwampD

[Brawndo]

With NBC and Other Broadcasting Entities around the World paying billions of dollars for the TV Rights particularly for the Olympics, you will probably see quite a few world class athletes getting vaccinated sooner rather than later. 
 

In addition there polling data to suggest that only 60% of the US Population would take the vaccine. I work with some HCWs who are hesitant to be in the first phase. Overcoming concerns about the vaccine and increasing the percentage of the population who receive it is paramount to its success in eliminating the pandemic. 

A marketing campaign paid for by the Four Major Sports and the USOC showing MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL and Olympic Hopefuls receiving the vaccine, might be beneficial to both sides. Those leagues paying a few million dollars for vaccines which could be used to fund delivery of the same to the uninsured population.  That’s how they could justify athletes being moved into a higher phase. 

[PerreaultForever]

48 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

A marketing campaign paid for by the Four Major Sports and the USOC showing MLB, NBA, NFL, NHL and Olympic Hopefuls receiving the vaccine, might be beneficial to both sides. Those leagues paying a few million dollars for vaccines which could be used to fund delivery of the same to the uninsured population.  That’s how they could justify athletes being moved into a higher phase. 

Nice idea but I haven't heard anything like it. I think Pfizer's just going to make more money with inflated private sales to whatever rich person (or sports league) wants it. 

[Weave]

6 hours ago, Brawndo said:

In addition there polling data to suggest that only 60% of the US Population would take the vaccine. I work with some HCWs who are hesitant to be in the first phase. Overcoming concerns about the vaccine and increasing the percentage of the population who receive it is paramount to its success in eliminating the pandemic. 

 

Threatening the head of the FDA if the vaccine isn't approved sure won't do anything to encourage trust in the vaccine.

[sabresouth]

CDC official covid-19 survival rates by age group. Age 0-19(99.997). Age 20-49(99.98). Age 50-69(99.5). Age 70+(94.6). This is not a deadly pandemic. There is only one age group that needs to take extra precautions. Absolutely vaccinate senior citizens, those with extenuating health risks, hospital workers, police and first responders. But after that it's really just a crap shoot. Everyone else has well over 99% survival rate. I'm over 50 and had covid myself. Yes it was worse than the flu for me by a bit, It kept me down for about 3 weeks. My Dad had it and he's in his 70s and his symptoms were about like a mild cold, lasted barely a week.  My point is we can do both. We can get the most vulnerable vaccinated relatively fast and work on everyone else while we get some HOCKEY.

 

[Eleven]

2 minutes ago, sabresouth said:

This is not a deadly pandemic.

3000 Americans--and that's just one country--daily, would love to disagree with you but cannot.

Here's France.  Deaths over the last 20 years.  Again, just one country.  

 

This is a deadly pandemic.  I'm not sure all of the precautions we are taking are necessary and/or helpful, but this is a deadly pandemic.

[Curt]

17 hours ago, SwampD said:

You’re being obtuse. There are already plenty of doses to do both.

Of course, people in nursing homes and healthcare workers should get it first. I already said as much. But like Derrico said, mental health issues are a real thing. Hockey would help a lot of people.

I wonder if this is the hill you would be fighting on if it didn’t effect you personally.

Actually there are not plenty of doses for everyone who is at risk right now.

You know what else might improve someone’s mental health?  Knowing that their high risk mother/father/grandparents/sister/brother/child has gotten the Covid vaccine.  

[Curt]

On 12/11/2020 at 11:22 AM, LGR4GM said:

And? He has what? 5 years of pro experience and one in the NHL. We know exactly what Olofsson is. He is a good shot pp specialist best suited for the 3rd maybe 2nd line who will get you 40-50 points a year where probably 2/3rds come on the PP. He's not young. 

*sorry 6 pro seasons

I tend to be more on the “Olofsson isn’t THAT good” side, but I don’t think we should get too sure of ourselves.  To act as though he can’t possibly get better at ES is silly.  He could, even if it’s less likely than for most rookies.  The NHL is still a different league which posed new challenges to him.  If he can find a way to get open a little more often at ES he has everything he needs to be a great goal scorer there as well.

Also, your 40-50 point projection was probably with him playing on a 2nd-3rd line?  Still comes off a little odd when considering the fact that in his rookie year he produced at over a 60 point pace.

[JohnC]

31 minutes ago, Curt said:

I tend to be more on the “Olofsson isn’t THAT good” side, but I don’t think we should get too sure of ourselves.  To act as though he can’t possibly get better at ES is silly.  He could, even if it’s less likely than for most rookies.  The NHL is still a different league which posed new challenges to him.  If he can find a way to get open a little more often at ES he has everything he needs to be a great goal scorer there as well.

Also, your 40-50 point projection was probably with him playing on a 2nd-3rd line?  Still comes off a little odd when considering the fact that in his rookie year he produced at over a 60 point pace.

@LGR4GMmade his response to a comment that I made that we need higher than expected contributions from some of our players. I listed Tage and Olofsson in this group. For me the issue isn't what line he plays on or whether he is considered a young player or not (he didn't believe so while I did based on his meager NHL experience)  as it is his production. If he is primarily a specialty PP player and scores on a pro rated full season basis at a 30 goal clip then I would be more than happy with his production. 30 goals is 30 goals whether they come from dirty goals tipped from the front of the net or from picturesque shots from the perimeter or mostly on the PPs.  While I see more potential for him to expand his game others don't. Whatever side of the equation one is on that issue is as far as I am concerned a reasonable take. 

[LGR4GM]

59 minutes ago, Curt said:

I tend to be more on the “Olofsson isn’t THAT good” side, but I don’t think we should get too sure of ourselves.  To act as though he can’t possibly get better at ES is silly.  He could, even if it’s less likely than for most rookies.  The NHL is still a different league which posed new challenges to him.  If he can find a way to get open a little more often at ES he has everything he needs to be a great goal scorer there as well.

Also, your 40-50 point projection was probably with him playing on a 2nd-3rd line?  Still comes off a little odd when considering the fact that in his rookie year he produced at over a 60 point pace.

I don't think he's a 60 point player unless getting force fed top pp time every night. 

[dudacek]

17 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't think he's a 60 point player unless getting force fed top pp time every night. 

This makes it sound like he’d be getting points he doesn’t deserve, or that are somehow worth less.

He is on the power play and getting those points because he is very good at it. He is inflating the assist totals of Eichel and Dahlin because he can bury their passes like no one else on the team can and few in the league.

[Curt]

35 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't think he's a 60 point player unless getting force fed top pp time every night. 

Well, he probably will get force fed top PP time, because he is an absolute weapon on the PP.  He probably will deserve that PP time.

[JohnC]

41 minutes ago, dudacek said:

This makes it sound like he’d be getting points he doesn’t deserve, or that are somehow worth less.

He is on the power play and getting those points because he is very good at it. He is inflating the assist totals of Eichel and Dahlin because he can bury their passes like no one else on the team can and few in the league.

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't a goal scored on a PP scored the same way as a goal scored at ES? If a player scores 30 goals in a season regardless how it is done it still equates to production. I would rather have a 40 goal scorer who scores 30 on PPs and 10 at ES than have a player score 20 at ES and 5 on the PP. Unless the concept of arithmetic has changed in this unusual world of alternate facts 40 is more than 25. 

[MODO Hockey]

2 hours ago, Eleven said:

3000 Americans--and that's just one country--daily, would love to disagree with you but cannot.

Here's France.  Deaths over the last 20 years.  Again, just one country.  

 

This is a deadly pandemic.  I'm not sure all of the precautions we are taking are necessary and/or helpful, but this is a deadly pandemic.

Isnt there a thread for this flue ? sigh
 

[LGR4GM]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't a goal scored on a PP scored the same way as a goal scored at ES? If a player scores 30 goals in a season regardless how it is done it still equates to production. I would rather have a 40 goal scorer who scores 30 on PPs and 10 at ES than have a player score 20 at ES and 5 on the PP. Unless the concept of arithmetic has changed in this unusual world of alternate facts 40 is more than 25. 

It isn't worth as much because that player is limited. Worth here meaning cap space and toi. Your argument would be fine if you then said, olofsson is a pp specialist who's a 3rd line forward. Instead what you and others have done is extrapolate and suggest olofsson can be effective 5v5 because he scores at 5v4. That's not correct. 

I keep reading olofsson should be with Jack because on the pp they are good so at 5v5 hall and jack can setup olofsson except that's not how it works. 

[LGR4GM]

3 hours ago, dudacek said:

This makes it sound like he’d be getting points he doesn’t deserve, or that are somehow worth less.

He is on the power play and getting those points because he is very good at it. He is inflating the assist totals of Eichel and Dahlin because he can bury their passes like no one else on the team can and few in the league.

Jack and Dahlin will adapt and get their points anyways. You make it sound like only olofsson had a good shot. 

[Curt]

2 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

Isnt there a thread for this flue ? sigh
 

It’s not a flu virus.  It’s a coronavirus. And, yes, there is.

[Eleven]

2 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

Isnt there a thread for this flue ? sigh
 

 

50 minutes ago, Curt said:

It’s not a flu virus.  It’s a coronavirus. And, yes, there is.

I'm hardly the one who brought it up here.

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

It isn't worth as much because that player is limited. Worth here meaning cap space and toi. Your argument would be fine if you then said, olofsson is a pp specialist who's a 3rd line forward. Instead what you and others have done is extrapolate and suggest olofsson can be effective 5v5 because he scores at 5v4. That's not correct. 

[b]I keep reading olofsson should be with Jack because on the pp they are good so at 5v5 hall and jack can setup olofsson except that's not how it works.[/b] 

As I previously stated I don't care what line he is on. I have not argued to put him on the first line with Jack. On the contrary I have argued to put Reinhart on the Jack line along with Hall. When all is said and done what matters are the goal totals whether they come from ES, the PP or even the PK. When you look at the scoreboard it shows the goals scored regardless how they are made. I would value a 30 to 40 goal scorer playing on a lower line over a first or second line defensive role player whose purpose is to balance out the line. 

You are creating a straw man with your extrapolation argument. When I am discussing the issue of Olofsson I'm focusing on the issue of value associated with his goal scoring ability regardless whether it comes from the PP or ES. That's the point. 

Edited December 13, 2020 by JohnC