Who should the Sabres target for a veteran defensemen?

[dudacek]

2 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

I would try Gustafsson , his 2017-2018 season was an outlier, but if he can put up 40 points again its a nice add at LHD we need.

We have a consistent 40-point guy, and two guys who have shown they are easily capable of hitting 30 — none of whom are going to get the PP time they need.

Because we have another guy who might hit 60 this year.

We don't need a PP specialist, we need a guy who can defend.

Edited September 28, 2020 by dudacek

[bob_sauve28]

2 hours ago, Curt said:

Ok, maybe not the most pressing need, but it’s what we were talking about.

And I gave my opinion. 

[sweetlou]

I still like Mark Borowiecki, 

[Curt]

7 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

And I gave my opinion. 

That’s fine, but “It’s not the team’s biggest problem.  They’ll figure it out.”  Isn’t really an opinion on what they should do to fill out the D group.

[apuszczalowski]

Get a better goalie, keep the D similar to last season and focus on upgrading the forward group.

[SHAAAUGHT!!!]

On 9/26/2020 at 3:24 PM, PerreaultForever said:

Why do you want to target a veteran D man? Is it based on an assumption that Montour and/or Risto are not on the roster? We need a third line first. 

Exactly.  I think we lose one one of the above, which further reduces our experience.  I've seen some proposals for younger defensemen, which I don't think helps unless we also bring in a vet to help Dahlin and Joker with their development.  Even if he is playing 3rd line minutes we need someone to mentor the younger guys, and I'm not sure there is anyone currently in the line-up that I'm thrilled with stepping into that role.  McCabe is the guy I see as the leader back there right now, but he has very little experience playing in meaningful NHL games....

[SHAAAUGHT!!!]

On 9/27/2020 at 8:17 AM, bob_sauve28 said:

How about letting our solid young defense just play and become veterans defenseman? If it’s looking good for us entering playoffs then we pick up some vets. 

I want someone back there that can provide feedback on players around the league and show them what to look for on faceoffs, I want someone who's been through battles against guys/teams for years and come out on top, I want someone back there our younger guys can be proud to emulate, I want someone to teach based on experience and accomplishments, not because they had an impressive junior career and were a high draft pick.  

It's about maximizing return on young players.  It's not just about putting in the time - ask 90% of the players in the AHL...

Edited September 28, 2020 by SHAAAUGHT!!!

[Sabres Fan in NS]

21 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

Has anyone watched Marc Staal play the last couple years?  Just because he is Eric’s brother doesn’t mean he would be a good fit.

 

18 hours ago, Thorny said:

Oh he's absolutely one of the worst players in the league. 

It was a bad joke seeing that Marc was just traded to Detroit.

And I believe that Thorny here had his best sarcastic grin on his mug when he typed his comment above.

[Torpedo Forecheck]

Brendan Dillon. Lefty, brings size, toughness, playoff experience and veteran presence. Plus his analytcs are pretty decent.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

5 hours ago, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:

I want someone back there that can provide feedback on players around the league and show them what to look for on faceoffs, I want someone who's been through battles against guys/teams for years and come out on top, I want someone back there our younger guys can be proud to emulate, I want someone to teach based on experience and accomplishments, not because they had an impressive junior career and were a high draft pick.  

It's about maximizing return on young players.  It's not just about putting in the time - ask 90% of the players in the AHL...

Sounds like you want Chara, Weber, or a Doughty at a cost of about $1.5M to play on 2nd/3rd pairing to teach the kids.

I like the Brendon Dillon suggestion someone made.

[bob_sauve28]

7 hours ago, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:

I want someone back there that can provide feedback on players around the league and show them what to look for on faceoffs, I want someone who's been through battles against guys/teams for years and come out on top, I want someone back there our younger guys can be proud to emulate, I want someone to teach based on experience and accomplishments, not because they had an impressive junior career and were a high draft pick.  

It's about maximizing return on young players.  It's not just about putting in the time - ask 90% of the players in the AHL...

Hard to disagree, except I want our young defenseman playing, not making room for an older guy, unless maybe it’s around playoff time. Isn’t Steve Smith an assistant coach on this team? 

 

And no way do I want to lose Risto or Montour 

[Broken Ankles]

1 hour ago, bob_sauve28 said:

 

And no way do I want to lose Risto or Montour 

Your right.  We should prefer to trade both.  
Neither can play first line minutes.  Pay for a true #1 on the right.   Borgen or Miller can handle third line minutes.  
 
  Whether by trade or UFA, young Rasmus needs a new partner.  Just get it done.  
 

[SHAAAUGHT!!!]

On 9/28/2020 at 1:46 PM, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

Sounds like you want Chara, Weber, or a Doughty at a cost of about $1.5M to play on 2nd/3rd pairing to teach the kids.

I like the Brendon Dillon suggestion someone made.

Yeah, I think that would help this blueline considerably.  The problem with Chara this year (if you can call it that) was the Bruins rode him WAY too much.  At this point in his career I would like to see him get something closer to 13-15min a night to get higher quality minutes out of him, instead of the 21min per night he had.   I would be thrilled with any of these guys at $1.5MM for 1-2 years.  They don't have to be the guy, they just need to help the team be better. 

On 9/28/2020 at 3:59 PM, bob_sauve28 said:

Hard to disagree, except I want our young defenseman playing, not making room for an older guy, unless maybe it’s around playoff time. Isn’t Steve Smith an assistant coach on this team? 

And no way do I want to lose Risto or Montour 

I imagine Joker and Dahlin will be getting their minutes this year, even if both Risto and Montour return.  Someone of the 3 (Risto/Montour/Miller)) will be moved this year.  At this point I think its all about which team has a player we want and which one of the three do they rank they highest...

[bob_sauve28]

1 hour ago, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:

Yeah, I think that would help this blueline considerably.  The problem with Chara this year (if you can call it that) was the Bruins rode him WAY too much.  At this point in his career I would like to see him get something closer to 13-15min a night to get higher quality minutes out of him, instead of the 21min per night he had.   I would be thrilled with any of these guys at $1.5MM for 1-2 years.  They don't have to be the guy, they just need to help the team be better. 

I imagine Joker and Dahlin will be getting their minutes this year, even if both Risto and Montour return.  Someone of the 3 (Risto/Montour/Miller)) will be moved this year.  At this point I think its all about which team has a player we want and which one of the three do they rank they highest...

The thought of Risto getting moved makes me nauseous 

But whatever is best for the team. They really have to have a good season, make the playoffs and hopefully win a series or two. 

[nfreeman]

The Athletic is reporting that Nick Leddy may be available due to an Islanders cap crunch. Leddy is a terrific skater, turns 30 next March, and has two years left on his contract at $5.5 million per year cap hit but a total of $13.5 million in cash. He played over 21 minutes per game this year for an excellent defensive team that made the final 4 and is a no-BS top 4 NHL LHD.

Due to his contract, he’ll probably be available for a song, and the Islanders might even retain part of his contract.

[klos1963]

On 9/26/2020 at 6:33 AM, SHAAAUGHT!!! said:

So I've been spending a lot of time looking at the Sabres roster to figure out what holes KA may be focusing on for a trade.  After moving Scandella and Bogosian last season the Sabres are fielding a very young blue line, and I see this as a new weakness that needs to be addressed.  We are all aware the Sabres need a LD, and may trade away one of our "older" RDs to get him or a forward, which further perpetuates the need to sign some experience on the backline.

I can't imagine the Sabres are looking to lock up a new Dman on a long-term contract with Dahlin and Joker in line for raises with significant term.  Is there anyone available out there that fits the mold of an experience LD that can be had for a season or 3?

Risto will be in his 8th season. That's pretty veteran, isn't it?

[Rasmus_]

1. Borowiecki is perfect for the bottom six.  He's nasty, should come in under $4,000,000, and you can sign him on a relatively low term 2 years per say.
2. Gustafsson, is perfect for an upgrade to the second pair and still in his mid twenties (27 turning 28).  He's also Swedish which further insulates Dahlin.  He's strong in both zones and is looking to test UFA.
3. Merrill/Forbort, play a similar game to Borowiecki and would add a solid upgrade on the bottom pairing. 
4. TRADE - who knows.   Move one of the excess: Montour / Miller for a young cost controlled NHL ready talent and a pick depending on "who".

Gustafsson is the biggest UFA that I considered, as he's coming off of a dip in production and possibly could see this team as somewhere he could fit in nicely.  I see Dillon going to a contender or staying in Washington, if they move out a contract.

Edited October 4, 2020 by TheCerebral1

[SabresFanInRochester]

Rasmus Ristolainen

[Rasmus_]

32 minutes ago, SabresFanInRochester said:

Rasmus Ristolainen

Needs to be moved.  It's time to move on from Ristolainen, and to some degree Zemgus Girgensons.  

[Thorner]

33 minutes ago, TheCerebral1 said:

Needs to be moved.  It's time to move on from Ristolainen, and to some degree Zemgus Girgensons.  

I tend to agree, but it's not going to happen. Our management group loves him. At this point it's easiest to accept he's here for at least the duration of the contract and mold things as good as possible around that fact. 

If he's no more than a 2nd pair d-man, I believe we could find success. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Thorny

[Trettioåtta]

Dahlin - ???

??? - Risto

McCabe - Joker

 

I think Risto brings something to the party that Montour and Miller dont. Obviously there is a top RD on the market this year. However, I think Mountour might be good enough - such that we end up with 1 top D-man and 5 top four d-men.

 

Maata would have been great, if we could have got a trade for Miller

Edited October 4, 2020 by Trettioåtta

[PerreaultForever]

Keep in mind none of these guys are Adams' guys so anybody could be traded. You know JBot was going to stand by his moves (Miller, Montour, etc.) but Adams could easily move them all. 

I just don't think there's a market for Montour out there. By the numbers/process he's going to command a salary level above what he's actually worth and in this climate and cap league situation nobody's going to pay that so why trade for him? Only way he moves is in a package deal. 

Having said that, while I don't think our D is as solid as some do, I do agree it's not the number one priority. We need forwards of all types. 

[Thorner]

13 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

Keep in mind none of these guys are Adams' guys so anybody could be traded. You know JBot was going to stand by his moves (Miller, Montour, etc.) but Adams could easily move them all. 

I just don't think there's a market for Montour out there. By the numbers/process he's going to command a salary level above what he's actually worth and in this climate and cap league situation nobody's going to pay that so why trade for him? Only way he moves is in a package deal. 

Having said that, while I don't think our D is as solid as some do, I do agree it's not the number one priority. We need forwards of all types. 

It may make sense to trade him if the cap space we have allotted to him is best used elsewhere. We shouldn't think of any individual trade as in a vacuum, but rather in combination with each other, and all moves, as an aid to team-building. 

Agree D is not the largest priority, but converting a RHD to a LHD this offseason is definitely on the "must" list. 

Assuming Joki, Risto are here - we'd be better off trading one of Montour or Miller for a 4th, and signing Fast, than we would be keeping both and having a surplus. Or trade one for a pick and grab a UFA LHD. There are probably going to be lots of options. 

Sometimes the assets need to be laundered into improvements in other areas rather than converted directly. 

Edited October 4, 2020 by Thorny

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, Thorny said:

It may make sense to trade him if the cap space we have allotted to him is best used elsewhere. We shouldn't think of any individual trade as in a vacuum, but rather in combination with each other, and all moves, as an aid to team-building. 

That's true, but what I'm saying is I don't see how other teams would want to take him on for their caps.  His contract situation will not be attractive to others .Unless of course he is willing to sign for a much lower number than you'd expect. 

The same mathematics apply to Reinhart and RFAs on other teams too. If their agents want business as usual contracts they might find themselves sitting out. Montour has less pull, but I am seriously worried about Reinhart pulling a similar hold him hostage move on Adams as Skinner did on JBot to get more than his worth in this climate, and if he is doing that, teams aren't going to line up to grab him unless they have an RFA of their own that's a problem. 

It'll be interesting to see what happens with UFAs too. I wouldn't want to be a guy like Torey Krug right now. You're coming into your peak payday moment and you want money and term and which team has that money or is going to do that for anybody right now? This free agency period I suspect will be very different from previous ones. 

[miles]

Maybe Minnesota will trade dumba for a 853 round pick in the year 2098