So #8

[Thorner]

10 minutes ago, Taro T said:

With a smidge of luck, that could be Nashville quality for a long time.

Nashville D with a true Superstar C would be..formidable. 

[thewookie1]

The big problem with using pick 8 is the loss of a major asset in acquiring a 2C which by far are most important need.

[jsb]

9 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

The big problem with using pick 8 is the loss of a major asset in acquiring a 2C which by far are most important need.

I don't think they're going to trade #8 unless it's a whopper deal. Too many teams needing cap relief. As an example Pittsburgh is probably going to lose Jarry or Murray, both RFAs and they can't afford both. 

As for Drysdale, I can't see them passing him up if he drops to them. 

Edited August 13, 2020 by jsb

[kas23]

3 minutes ago, jsb said:

I don't think they're going to trade #8 unless it's a whopper deal. Too many teams needing cap relief. As an example Pittsburgh is probably going to lose Jarry or Murray, both RFAs and they can't afford both. 

The fact that a lot of teams need cap relief makes #8 a lot more valuable. It’s an asset that doesn’t hit the cap. Given that, if we’re talking with teams, they’re going to try their best to pry that away from us. They may even demand it instead of demanding a certain player. 

[jsb]

1 minute ago, kas23 said:

The fact that a lot of teams need cap relief makes #8 a lot more valuable. It’s an asset that doesn’t hit the cap. Given that, if we’re talking with teams, they’re going to try their best to pry that away from us. They may even demand it instead of demanding a certain player. 

I agree but he better be damm good, better than Cirelli good also.

[Taro T]

9 hours ago, Thorny said:

Nashville D with a true Superstar C would be..formidable. 

Provided they find a goalie to fill the Rinne role.  Could Luukkonnen be that guy?

[bob_sauve28]

9 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

The big problem with using pick 8 is the loss of a major asset in acquiring a 2C which by far are most important need.

We need a goalie more than anything. Unless you trust Carter Hutton's eyes? 

[LGR4GM]

13 hours ago, Thorny said:

You have it after what, Byfield Lafreniere Stutzle Drysdale Rossi Perfetti Raymond and Holtz? So drop off after 8, into the Sanderson/Lundell tier? 

I have Jarvis firmly in that tier as well. 

[LGR4GM]

11 hours ago, jsb said:

I haven't seen it posted yet but Pronman's latest mock draft had Drysdale going 7th and us taking Rossi, if New Jersey were to take Rossi would we take a Dman 8th or does that put a possible premium on trading that pick?? I'm not sure I take any of the remaining forwards ahead of Drysdale. 

 

11 hours ago, Thorny said:

If Drysdale falls to 8 I think you just take him. Our D would probably be ridonkulous pretty quickly. Just make sure the top 6 additions this offseason are legit mainstays and not placeholders. 

I don't think Dysdale would be the pick even if there and I don't think he will be there. I can't think of a draft where no defender was taken until 8th overall. 

I don't love Drysdale personally because we have a group of defenders with similar skillsets. Also I think in this particular draft the forwards are better and Drysdale simply isn't elite enough to warrant passing over a guy like Jarvis for. 

[LGR4GM]

Also, there will be 1 surprise pick in the top 7 because there always is. Someone thinks they are clever and goes off book. Askarov, Sanderson, Quinn, or even Lundell could suddenly slide into one of those top 7 spots.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

9 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Also, there will be 1 surprise pick in the top 7 because there always is. Someone thinks they are clever and goes off book. Askarov, Sanderson, Quinn, or even Lundell could suddenly slide into one of those top 7 spots.

One thing I haven't seen talked about yet as far as using the #8 pick...

What are our options in getting a roster player that's been discussed (e.g. EHLERS, Copp, Staal, Galchenyuk, etc) in a deal that "swaps" picks? Minny, Winny, Nash, and Fla are very slight moves on the draft.

You could use it to get a good winger and try to sign Granlund as a UFA.

[thewookie1]

9 minutes ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

One thing I haven't seen talked about yet as far as using the #8 pick...

What are our options in getting a roster player that's been discussed (e.g. EHLERS, Copp, Staal, Galchenyuk, etc) in a deal that "swaps" picks? Minny, Winny, Nash, and Fla are very slight moves on the draft.

You could use it to get a good winger and try to sign Granlund as a UFA.

Tried that before.... no thanks.

[LGR4GM]

38 minutes ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

One thing I haven't seen talked about yet as far as using the #8 pick...

What are our options in getting a roster player that's been discussed (e.g. EHLERS, Copp, Staal, Galchenyuk, etc) in a deal that "swaps" picks? Minny, Winny, Nash, and Fla are very slight moves on the draft.

You could use it to get a good winger and try to sign Granlund as a UFA.

you mean like, hey we will give Winnipeg 8 if they give us 10 and Ehlers? I think you still have to include a player coming from us. 

You could do say 8 and Defender for 10 and Ehlers if they value Ehlers more. I think the NHL should do more trades like that but I feel like they don't. 

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

Also, there will be 1 surprise pick in the top 7 because there always is. Someone thinks they are clever and goes off book. Askarov, Sanderson, Quinn, or even Lundell could suddenly slide into one of those top 7 spots.

Maybe this year it will be the Sabres making that pick: someone you love like Jarvis; someone you don't, like Lundell. We are revising our scouting lens. Who knows what that leads to?

And Sanderson is ranked in the top 3 by at least a couple scouts and the top defenceman by more. Him going in the top 8 will not be a surprise.

I think @Crusader1969 has the right of it though: Holtz, Raymond, Rossi and Perfetti are all worthy of a top 8 pick. Drysdale and/or Sanderson goes in the top 7 and we will take one of those four forwards.

Edited August 13, 2020 by dudacek

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

I have Jarvis firmly in that tier as well. 

With Sanderson and Lundell? Or you have Jarvis in the top tier with those other 8 I mentioned? 

[dudacek]

6 minutes ago, Thorny said:

With Sanderson and Lundell? Or you have Jarvis in the top tier with those other 8 I mentioned? 

He said earlier he thinks Jarvis is legitimately good value at 8, on the tier ahead of Lundell.

[Thorner]

So he has a gap after the first 9 then. Good. So long at it's before the Jets pick at 10. 

Ha

Edited August 13, 2020 by Thorny

[IKnowPhysics]

Let 's get this thread moving.

Highlights from the NHL Central Scouting's top ten North American Skaters:

#1 Alex Lefreniere (LW)

Date of birth: Oct 11, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'1" / 192lbs
Born: Saint-Eustache, QC, CAN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 35G-77A-112P in 52GP for Rimouski Oceanic (QMJHL)

NHL equivalency: 50P

#2 Quinton Byfield (C)

 

Date of birth: Aug 19, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'4" / 214lbs
Born: Newmarket, ON, CAN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 32G-50A-82P in 45GP for Sudbury Wolves (OHL)

NHL equivalency: 48P

#3 Jamie Drysdale (D)

Date of birth: Apr 08, 2002
Height/Weight: 5'11" / 170lbs
Born: Toronto, ON, CAN
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 9G-38A-47P in 49GP for Erie Otters (OHL)

NHL equivalency: 25P

#4 Jake Sanderson (D)

 

Date of birth: Jul 08, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'1" / 185lbs
Born: Whitefish, MT, USA
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 7G-22A-29P in 47GP for US National U18 Team C (USDP) and 2G-12A-14P in 19GP for USNTDP Juniors

NHL equivalency (estimated): 12-20P

#5 Cole Perfetti (C)

 

Date of birth: Jan 01, 2002
Height/Weight: 5'10" / 185lbs
Born: Whitby, ON, CAN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 37G-74A-111P in 61GP for Sagniaw Spirit (OHL)

NHL equivalency: 48P

#6 Marco Rossi (C)

 

Date of birth: Sep 23, 2001
Height/Weight: 5'9" / 179lbs
Born: Feldkirch, AUT
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 39G-81A-120P in 56GP for Ottawa 67's (OHL)

NHL equivalency: 57P

 

 

#7 Jack Quinn (RW)

 

Date of birth: Sep 19, 2001
Height/Weight: 5'11" / 176lbs
Born: Cobden, ON, CAN
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 52G-37A-89P in 62GP for Ottawa 67's (OHL)

NHL equivalency: 38P

#8 Kaiden Guhle (D)

 

Date of birth: Jan 18, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'3" / 187lbs
Born: Sherwood Park, AB, CAN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 11G-29A-40P in 45GP for Prince Albert Raiders (WHL)

NHL equivalency: 17P

 

#9 Braden Schenider (D)

 

Date of birth: Sep 20, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'2" / 209lbs
Born: Prince Albert, SK, CAN
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 7G-35A-42P in 60GP for Sudbury Wolves (WHL)

NHL equivalency: 17P

 

#10 Dawson Mercer (RW)

 

Date of birth: Oct 27, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'0" / 179lbs
Born: Carbonear, NL, CAN
Shoots: R

2019-2020 combined regular season stats: 24G-36A-60P in 42GP for Drummondville and Chicoutimi (QMJHL)

NHL equivalency: 33P

 

 

[Thorner]

6 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I have Jarvis firmly in that tier as well. 

Do you rank him ahead of any of the other forwards in that tier? 

[IKnowPhysics]

And highlights from the NHL Central Scouting's top ten European Skaters:

#1 Tim Stutzle (LW)

Date of birth: Jan 15, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'0" / 187lbs
Born: Saint-Eustache, QC, CAN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 7G-27A-34P in 41GP for Adler Mannheim (DEL)

NHL equivalency: 42P

#2 Alexander Holtz (RW)

Date of birth: Jan 23, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'0" / 183lbs
Born: Saltsjö-Boo, SWE
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 9G-7A-16P in 35GP for Djurgardens IF (SHL)

NHL equivalency: 22P

#3 Anton Lundell (C)

Date of birth: Oct 03, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'1" / 187lbs
Born: Espoo, FIN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 10G-18A-28P in 44GP for HIFK (Liiga)

NHL equivalency: 37P

#4 Lucas Raymond (RW/LW)

Date of birth: Mar 28, 2002
Height/Weight: 5'10" / 183lbs
Born: Göteborg, SWE
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 4G-6A-10P in 33GP for Frolunda HC (SHL)

NHL equivalency (estimated): 15P

#5 Rodion Amirov (LW)

Date of birth: Oct 02, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'0" / 168lbs
Born: Salavat, RUS
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 10G-12A-22P in 17GP for Tolpar Ufa (MHL)

NHL equivalency: 48P

#6 Helge Grans (D)

Date of birth: May 10, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'3" / 192lbs
Ljungby, SWE
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 1G-2A-30P in 21GP for Malmo Redhawks (SHL) and 4G-23A-27P in 27GP for Malmo in SuperElit.

NHL equivalency: Unknown; maybe 7P, maybe 25P.

#7 John-Jason Peterka (LW)

Date of birth: Jan 14, 2002
Height/Weight: 5'11" / 192lbs
Born: München, GER
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 7G-4A-11P in 42GP for EHC Munchen (DEL)

NHL equivalency: 13P

#8 Topi Niemela (D)

Date of birth: Mar 25, 2002
Height/Weight: 6'0" / 163lbs
Born: Oulu, FIN
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 1G-6A-7P in 43GP for Karpat (Liiga)

NHL equivalency: 9P

#9 Noel Gunier (RW)

Date of birth: Oct 07, 2001
Height/Weight: 6'2" / 174lbs
Born: Luleå, SWE
Shoots: R

2019-2020 regular season stats: 4G-9A-13P in 45GP for Lulea (SHL)

NHL equivalency: 14P

#10 Roni Hirvonen (C)

Date of birth: Jan 10, 2002
Height/Weight: 5'9" / 163lbs
Born: Espoo, FIN
Shoots: L

2019-2020 regular season stats: 5G-11A-16P in 52GP for Assat (Liiga)

NHL equivalency: 18P

 

[Rasmus_]

• Lundell or Raymond (First round)  okay with Rossi, Quinn, Holtz, Perfetti
• If available Gunler (Second round), Grans

Still firmly in this camp.  I'm warmed up to Rossi, and watched a lot more tape.  However, I'm still high on Lundell.  He's what this team needs and it fits a high-end two way player.  Advanced stats are in his favor too.

Edited August 13, 2020 by TheCerebral1

[IKnowPhysics]

Composite rankings including the top 15 players from five different sources plus CSS, NHLe, and NHLe ranks for forwards and defensemen:

Disclosure edit: this chart is updated downthread.

Edited August 14, 2020 by IKnowPhysics

[sabresparaavida]

So Brendan Brisson had an NHLe of 58, highest in the draft, and he's not getting talked about in the top 15. I don't know anything about him, but he must have produced, what's the limitations to his game that's pushing him down? Is he an overager?

[IKnowPhysics]

6 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

So Brendan Brisson had an NHLe of 58, highest in the draft, and he's not getting talked about in the top 15. I don't know anything about him, but he must have produced, what's the limitations to his game that's pushing him down? Is he an overager?

Seems out-of-family.  A different calculator I'm using is giving me a different number.  Give me a couple hours and I'll doublecheck my math and the various conversion factors.

[LGR4GM]

4 hours ago, sabresparaavida said:

So Brendan Brisson had an NHLe of 58, highest in the draft, and he's not getting talked about in the top 15. I don't know anything about him, but he must have produced, what's the limitations to his game that's pushing him down? Is he an overager?

He plays in the USHL which means I few things. I don't believe his NHL e is that high. Ushl has like .29 multiplier. He's more like 28 points. 

 

10 hours ago, Thorny said:

So he has a gap after the first 9 then. Good. So long at it's before the Jets pick at 10. 

Ha

 

6 hours ago, Thorny said:

Do you rank him ahead of any of the other forwards in that tier? 

Seth Jarvis is ranked in that top 9 group. He is ranked higher than several other forwards for me. He's ranked nationally lower because Portland, size, and narratives that develop over a draft year like how awesome Raymond is because world juniors but Jarvis has a mediocre Helinka so scouts fade him.