2020-21 Trade Rumors and Speculation

[Flashsabre]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Insert Gif of Terry opening up his chequebook...

And another of Newport Sports rubbing their hands over how much the Sabres will help them get from Toronto.

Problem is Leafs have to dump a ton of payroll to sign him and no one is bailing anyone out this offseason with the pandemic realities.  If Dubass can’t dump the money they won’t sign him.  Leafs can’t be in a bidding war with anyone.

[Shootica]

Where did the rumor of Terry being enamored with Pietrangelo come from?

Edit: Found it!

 

Edited September 19, 2020 by Shootica

[bunomatic]

10 minutes ago, Shootica said:

Where did the rumor of Terry being enamored with Pietrangelo come from?

Edit: Found it!

 

Still not liking the idea of Terry or Kim being overly involved in the teambuilding process. They are the owners I get that but I’m not sure how many fanboys have built cup winners in the past. Let the gm and the scouts do that.

[Shootica]

10 minutes ago, bunomatic said:

Still not liking the idea of Terry or Kim being overly involved in the teambuilding process. They are the owners I get that but I’m not sure how many fanboys have built cup winners in the past. Let the gm and the scouts do that.

Agreed.

Although if they set an internal cap due to financial reasons but decide that they'd be willing to go over for a player like Pietrangelo, I can't fault them for that.  Because realistically, signing him would immediately put us well over any internal cap.

[Eleven]

3 hours ago, Thorny said:

Bold is all too likely. 

Boy, would I like to add him, especially after getting Staal for no financial cost. Is it financially possible? 

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1933005

Welcome to the playoffs.

 

Moulson-level mistake IMO.  If he wants 8 x 7, that does not fit the Sabres' schedule for moving forward.  

[7+6=13]

2 hours ago, bunomatic said:

Still not liking the idea of Terry or Kim being overly involved in the teambuilding process. They are the owners I get that but I’m not sure how many fanboys have built cup winners in the past. Let the gm and the scouts do that.

I think it's highly unlikely that post has any real credibility.  It's easily consumed because of the perceptions.

[Broken Ankles]

2 hours ago, Shootica said:

Where did the rumor of Terry being enamored with Pietrangelo come from?

Edit: Found it!

 

Which rumor should we believe?  This one where he’s willing to spend ungodly amounts of money to sign Pietrangelo or the rumor where he’s spending 10 million below the Cap?  And these are literally days apart.  They are contradictory.  Are they not? 

[thewookie1]

4 hours ago, Broken Ankles said:

Which rumor should we believe?  This one where he’s willing to spend ungodly amounts of money to sign Pietrangelo or the rumor where he’s spending 10 million below the Cap?  And these are literally days apart.  They are contradictory.  Are they not? 

Not necessarily, the Pegulas aren’t broke but, like many other teams, are trying to reduce their financial losses.

[Huckleberry]

15 hours ago, Shootica said:

Where did the rumor of Terry being enamored with Pietrangelo come from?

Edit: Found it!

 

If they sign him, then all the internal salary cap rumours were ***** 🙂 .  also better make room and trade risto and montour then.

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

If they sign him, then all the internal salary cap rumours were ***** 🙂 .  also better make room and trade risto and montour then.

I built a roster yesterday that came in around 75 mil, adding Pietrangelo, Copp, and Fast (and also 2 picks next year, after only having 5)

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1933005

Edited September 19, 2020 by Thorny

[Broken Ankles]

29 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I built a roster yesterday that came in around 75 mil, adding Pietrangelo, Copp, and Fast (and also 2 picks next year, after only having 5)

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1933005

If the 75m can get to $78m and you buyout Hutts and pick up Raanta  or Keumper ($4m cap type) and that is an impressive line up.  

[jsb]

59 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I built a roster yesterday that came in around 75 mil, adding Pietrangelo, Copp, and Fast (and also 2 picks next year, after only having 5)

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1933005

Did you decide to let Montour walk for nothing in return??

[steveoath]

Oof. Phil Kessel in buffalo? Probably not. 

https://www.nhltraderumors.me/2020/09/arizona-rejects-latest-trade-offer-from.html?m=1#more

Edited September 19, 2020 by steveoath

[Thorner]

19 minutes ago, jsb said:

Did you decide to let Montour walk for nothing in return??

In my mind I was dealing him for futures - I tend to forget him. That's good though - add another pick or two by dealing his rights. Some youth on the 3rd pair, right side is the price we pay to have that deep group of forwards, and a great D top 4. Picks replenished, as well, and its a budget team at 75. 

Edited September 19, 2020 by Thorny

[nfreeman]

2 hours ago, steveoath said:

Oof. Phil Kessel in buffalo? Probably not. 

https://www.nhltraderumors.me/2020/09/arizona-rejects-latest-trade-offer-from.html?m=1#more

So, I from time to time have entertained the idea of trading for Kessel.  I didn't watch him this year in AZ, and his #s this year were way down, but until this past season he's been a no-BS top-6 RW who is fast and can score in multiple ways.  He's also kinda nutty and moody like Skinner, so that would have to be considered.

In any case, though, he's a guy who will probably be available pretty cheaply, as AZ is looking to dump payroll, his production was down last year, he turns 33 next month and he makes $6MM cash (and a $6.8MM cap hit) per year, with 2 more years on his deal.  So the price to get him, the fit for the Sabres' need, the relatively short commitment and even the slight cash-to-cap discount all seem in line for this to be plausible.

A 2nd line of Skinner-Staal-Kessel would be very dangerous and entertaining.

Just sayin'.

[tom webster]

5 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

So, I from time to time have entertained the idea of trading for Kessel.  I didn't watch him this year in AZ, and his #s this year were way down, but until this past season he's been a no-BS top-6 RW who is fast and can score in multiple ways.  He's also kinda nutty and moody like Skinner, so that would have to be considered.

In any case, though, he's a guy who will probably be available pretty cheaply, as AZ is looking to dump payroll, his production was down last year, he turns 33 next month and he makes $6MM cash (and a $6.8MM cap hit) per year, with 2 more years on his deal.  So the price to get him, the fit for the Sabres' need, the relatively short commitment and even the slight cash-to-cap discount all seem in line for this to be plausible.

A 2nd line of Skinner-Staal-Kessel would be very dangerous and entertaining.

Just sayin'.

I think, like Freddy Andersen, he had a $5M bonus so he is actually only $1M cash this year and $6M next year.

[Thorner]

15 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

So, I from time to time have entertained the idea of trading for Kessel.  I didn't watch him this year in AZ, and his #s this year were way down, but until this past season he's been a no-BS top-6 RW who is fast and can score in multiple ways.  He's also kinda nutty and moody like Skinner, so that would have to be considered.

In any case, though, he's a guy who will probably be available pretty cheaply, as AZ is looking to dump payroll, his production was down last year, he turns 33 next month and he makes $6MM cash (and a $6.8MM cap hit) per year, with 2 more years on his deal.  So the price to get him, the fit for the Sabres' need, the relatively short commitment and even the slight cash-to-cap discount all seem in line for this to be plausible.

A 2nd line of Skinner-Staal-Kessel would be very dangerous and entertaining.

Just sayin'.

Jesper Fast will give you better even strength offensive production, twice the defensive responsibility, at half the cost. For the price of no assets. 

Trouble is he has to agree to come. But I hope they are planning on kicking tires. 

Edited September 19, 2020 by Thorny

[Broken Ankles]

2 minutes ago, tom webster said:

I think, like Freddy Andersen, he had a $5M bonus so he is actually only $1M cash this year and $6M next year.

Good observation.  Seems like a match made in heaven for the new Pegula plan to help "maintain their lifestyle".  Contract notwithstanding, our second round  + a solid prospect seems excessive for a cap dump, no?  I mean is he a PPG Phil or .5 PPG Phil? 

[tom webster]

1 minute ago, Broken Ankles said:

Good observation.  Seems like a match made in heaven for the new Pegula plan to help "maintain their lifestyle".  Contract notwithstanding, our second round  + a solid prospect seems excessive for a cap dump, no?  I mean is he a PPG Phil or .5 PPG Phil? 

I’ll ignore the lifestyle quote but I wouldn’t give up that for Kessel either.

[Weave]

15 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

So, I from time to time have entertained the idea of trading for Kessel.  I didn't watch him this year in AZ, and his #s this year were way down, but until this past season he's been a no-BS top-6 RW who is fast and can score in multiple ways.  He's also kinda nutty and moody like Skinner, so that would have to be considered.

In any case, though, he's a guy who will probably be available pretty cheaply, as AZ is looking to dump payroll, his production was down last year, he turns 33 next month and he makes $6MM cash (and a $6.8MM cap hit) per year, with 2 more years on his deal.  So the price to get him, the fit for the Sabres' need, the relatively short commitment and even the slight cash-to-cap discount all seem in line for this to be plausible.

A 2nd line of Skinner-Staal-Kessel would be very dangerous and entertaining.

Just sayin'.

Kessel’s game is gonna fall off a cliff when his time comes.  I don’t know that I’d want him for any more than a season at a time.

[nfreeman]

4 hours ago, Thorny said:

Jesper Fast will give you better even strength offensive production, twice the defensive responsibility, at half the cost. For the price of no assets. 

Trouble is he has to agree to come. But I hope they are planning on kicking tires. 

Whoa.

Fast, pts last 4 seasons:  21, 33, 20, 29

Kessel, pts last 4 seasons:  70, 92, 82, 38

I agree on defensive responsibility, but they are not comparable in scoring ability.

 

4 hours ago, Weave said:

Kessel’s game is gonna fall off a cliff when his time comes.  I don’t know that I’d want him for any more than a season at a time.

Now this is fair.  Taking the risk on the 2nd year is part of the price here.

[Thorner]

2 hours ago, nfreeman said:

Whoa.

Fast, pts last 4 seasons:  21, 33, 20, 29

Kessel, pts last 4 seasons:  70, 92, 82, 38

I agree on defensive responsibility, but they are not comparable in scoring ability.

 

Now this is fair.  Taking the risk on the 2nd year is part of the price here.

Fast scored more at even strength than Kessel did this season, 29-21. All of Fast's points were at ES. Now Kessel could bounce back, but considering you agree with the premise he could drop off at any time,  I'd be a bit surprised if you were expecting a "return to form" for Kessel. 

If it's a choice between this season's version of each player, the choice to me is easy. And that's before you factor in cost and contract. 

Edited September 20, 2020 by Thorny

[GASabresIUFAN]

Fast maybe; Kessel and Pietrangelo No!  Alex is already 30.  His contract becomes an albatross in 2-3 years and we didn't get his prime.  No just no.

Fast will be 29 soon and is basically a 30 pt player.  We already have a similar but more productive and younger player in Kahun.

KA did a great job of thinking out of the box and getting Staal.  He needs to continue to think that way to build a playoff team with a budget.  That likely means taking chances like going after a Puljujari (22), Galchenyuk (26), Saad (27) or similar.  Guys with talent but some warts.  I also want to see if we can convince one of the Lightning players (Johnson, Killorn, Palat or Gourde) to waive their NTC and come to Buffalo.  My guess is we can steal one for nothing more then a conditional pick and taking 75% the contract.

This has worked for us in the past.  Guys like Dumont (viewed as a failed 3rd overall pick when we got him - I also wish we had kept him), Hasek (unorthodox style made him available), Briere (we got him for Chris Gratton straight up - need I say more).  A diamond in the rough so to speak.  I'd also like to look at younger guys who might stay if it works out.  

https://www.nhltradetalk.com/brandon-saad-trade-blackhawks/

 

Edited September 20, 2020 by GASabresIUFAN

[Curt]

7 hours ago, Thorny said:

Jesper Fast will give you better even strength offensive production, twice the defensive responsibility, at half the cost. For the price of no assets. 

Trouble is he has to agree to come. But I hope they are planning on kicking tires. 

 

2 hours ago, nfreeman said:

Whoa.

Fast, pts last 4 seasons:  21, 33, 20, 29

Kessel, pts last 4 seasons:  70, 92, 82, 38

I agree on defensive responsibility, but they are not comparable in scoring ability.

Kessel is an odd duck of an NHL player.  I think for him so much of his game will be dependent upon his mindset.  If he is motivated and working hard, he has all the talent to remain good for a while longer, but if he isn’t things can/will go downhill quick.

Fast is a useful middle 6 player.  He fills a position of need for Buffalo.  All depends on salary and term though.

I could absolutely see Fast being a better investment than Kessel, especially at their price points.

I am down for like 3 years of Fast, ages 29, 30, 31, at around $3M.  Is that close to reasonable?

[nfreeman]

11 hours ago, Thorny said:

Fast scored more at even strength than Kessel did this season, 29-21. All of Fast's points were at ES. Now Kessel could bounce back, but considering you agree with the premise he could drop off at any time,  I'd be a bit surprised if you were expecting a "return to form" for Kessel. 

If it's a choice between this season's version of each player, the choice to me is easy. And that's before you factor in cost and contract. 

Well, I think there's a wide range between Kessel's production this past season and a return all the way to his peak.  I also think that, as @Curt notes upthread, if his heart is in it -- which very well may not be the case if he finds himself on the Sabres -- and if he's on a line with credible and skilled linemates, like Skinner and Staal, that 55-60 pts is entirely possible.  OTOH, we all know to a metaphysical certainty that Fast isn't going to deliver more than 30 pts as a Sabre.

The Sabres desperately need to score more.  Fast, while certainly possessing certain qualities that Kessel lacks, isn't going to solve that problem.  Kessel represents the kind of low-cost, high-upside opportunity that doesn't come along that often and that might pay off handsomely.