NHL Draft Moving Up to June 5&6th?

[matter2003]

What is the purpose of moving it up??

[SwampD]

1 minute ago, matter2003 said:

What is the purpose of moving it up??

To get it over with so teams can start preparing for the playoffs.

[shrader]

46 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

What is the purpose of moving it up??

An event that they can televise and generate some revenue.

[LGR4GM]

Hope to have my top 10 done by the end of the week.

Preview:

1. Lafrniere - bigger Patrick Kane with a more well rounded game
2. Byfield - if Malking and Getzlaf had a baby, oh he is a baby because he won't be 18 until August. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

Will this change our offseason game plan?  Will it make a trade for a 2c more or less likely?  Will this draft change effect cap strapped teams offseason game plans?

Here is what I’m thinking.  If we end up drafting 3rd for example does Jbot decide not to get a 2c if he thinks the kid is NHL ready?  

When the cap shrinks, does TB have zero choice but to trade Cirelli to get the better draft pick now?  Could you see a scenario that we trade for Cirelli and then he plays on the playoffs for TB but then comes to Buffalo in the fall.  Obviously the trade will be for assets to be named later but it will be pretty obvious who we acquired.  
 

[thewookie1]

To put it simple if they went 24 teams in the playoffs and this lottery we would literally be the only team screwed royally as we’d be unable to get Pick 1 or a playoff spot.

 

Nothing new there 

[Thorner]

5 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Will this change our offseason game plan?  Will it make a trade for a 2c more or less likely?  Will this draft change effect cap strapped teams offseason game plans?

Here is what I’m thinking.  If we end up drafting 3rd for example does Jbot decide not to get a 2c if he thinks the kid is NHL ready?  

When the cap shrinks, does TB have zero choice but to trade Cirelli to get the better draft pick now?  Could you see a scenario that we trade for Cirelli and then he plays on the playoffs for TB but then comes to Buffalo in the fall.  Obviously the trade will be for assets to be named later but it will be pretty obvious who we acquired.  
 

Trades at the draft will be inherently more difficult to complete, if deals are being made for NHL players at all. I'm fascinated to see how it plays out, if teams really do start moving picks for "future considerations" and there's a bunch of handshake deals. 

More likely, we'll see the total amount of transactions go significantly down, and therefore necessarily our chances to acquire a 2C would be less likely. I'm interested to see if the NHL opens up a designated "trading" period before next season starts - perhaps that would make up for the lost deals at draft time, one of a GM's biggest annual opportunities to make movies. 

Could you image trading our 7th overall for "future considerations" (Cirelli) and he goes and blows his knee out in the playoffs? What happens then?

Edited May 4, 2020 by Thorny

[Taro T]

14 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Trades at the draft will be inherently more difficult to complete, if deals are being made for NHL players at all. I'm fascinated to see how it plays out, if teams really do start moving picks for "future considerations" and there's a bunch of handshake deals. 

More likely, we'll see the total amount of transactions go significantly down, and therefore necessarily our chances to acquire a 2C would be less likely. I'm interested to see if the NHL opens up a designated "trading" period before next season starts - perhaps that would make up for the lost deals at draft time, one of a GM's biggest annual opportunities to make movies. 

Could you image trading our 7th overall for "future considerations" (Cirelli) and he goes and blows his knee out in the playoffs? What happens then?

Even with a second "trade period" this summer, there still likely will be fewer trades than normal as the team trading to move up in the draft has a particular player in mind that they want at that slot.  Now, they have to deal with the team that actually selected the guy they want to grab a particular draftee and there is no guarantee the drafting team will rather have what's being offered as it may be a forward that's being offered but they need D or vice versa.

Or, if they're willing to give up a player to get a package including picks, each of those picks needs to be 1 round higher (technically, lower) than they'd have to have been if the pick were in this year's draft to account for the lost year of near term value that eventually drafted player will bring.

[Thorner]

6 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Even with a second "trade period" this summer, there still likely will be fewer trades than normal as the team trading to move up in the draft has a particular player in mind that they want at that slot.  Now, they have to deal with the team that actually selected the guy they want to grab a particular draftee and there is no guarantee the drafting team will rather have what's being offered as it may be a forward that's being offered but they need D or vice versa.

Or, if they're willing to give up a player to get a package including picks, each of those picks needs to be 1 round higher (technically, lower) than they'd have to have been if the pick were in this year's draft to account for the lost year of near term value that eventually drafted player will bring.

So, if we were gonna get Cirelli for 7th OA, perhaps the deal is now a first next year, UNprotected. And yes, that’s a deal I see as less likely, from 1 or both team’s perspectives. 

Edited May 4, 2020 by Thorny

[GASabresIUFAN]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

Trades at the draft will be inherently more difficult to complete, if deals are being made for NHL players at all. I'm fascinated to see how it plays out, if teams really do start moving picks for "future considerations" and there's a bunch of handshake deals. 

More likely, we'll see the total amount of transactions go significantly down, and therefore necessarily our chances to acquire a 2C would be less likely. I'm interested to see if the NHL opens up a designated "trading" period before next season starts - perhaps that would make up for the lost deals at draft time, one of a GM's biggest annual opportunities to make movies. 

Could you image trading our 7th overall for "future considerations" (Cirelli) and he goes and blows his knee out in the playoffs? What happens then?

Insurance

[shrader]

Those early round picks haven’t been getting moved around in the lead up to the draft in exchange for players in recent years. The first round picks moved for players, those all happen in season. Other than the obvious exception of the Vegas expansion draft deals, there hasn’t even been a handful of players moved for early picks over the last 3-4 drafts (too lazy to go back further) in the days leading up to the draft. The lack of a lottery is not going to have any impact on the trade market this time around. 

[LGR4GM]

20 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Hope to have my top 10 done by the end of the week.

Preview:

1. Lafrniere - bigger Patrick Kane with a more well rounded game
2. Byfield - if Malking and Getzlaf had a baby, oh he is a baby because he won't be 18 until August. 

1. Lafreniere, wont be a Sabre but is great in all aspects of the game. Silky smooth operator with loads of talent. 

2. Byfield, August birthday yet he is destroying the OHL. He is a big guy that skates really well, plays with some physicality, is always working hard. I like almost every aspect of his game and the only thing is, you could see if you watch some early stuff versus later stuff, his age is currently an issue as he does make the odd mistake here and there.

3. Rossi, this was hard but the motor and work ethic sold me. I have some questions about him being older and also inflated points against bad teams but he is really good. He is Marchand like in his tenacity and sometimes goes over the line, he has attitude. 

4. Raymond, probably a surprise for some but there is just something about him. Works hard, has good skating, vision, and hands. Very complete player who only got limited SHL ice time last season but would have lit up the OHL. I keep coming back to him because he is just good. He's a battler. 

5. Stutzle, I like but don't love him which is how he ends up my #5. Great skating and good work ethic but his defensive play from all I have been able to watch and read is questionable. He has the skills but sometimes he just doesn't simplify the game enough. 

That's my top 5. I spent a lot of time debating on Rossi, Raymond, Stutzle but in the end I decided it based on tenacity, all around game, and then potential. Raymond and Rossi have the real possibility of sliding to 7. If Buffalo drafts 3rd.... I hope someone takes Stutzle 2nd and Byfield slides. Now it gets a lot harder. These 4 (and Lafreniere who I watched and read a lot less on because we weren't getting him) are the 4 I know the most about. Usually now is the time I start looking at draft guides and digging up highlights, games if possible, and just reading and listening to anything about guys. Unfortunately this timeline will be drastically shortened with an early June draft. 

Some guys to pay attention too that might slide around... Brendan Brisson, Seth Jarvis (love this guy), and Jacob Perrault. 

[Crusader1969]

21 hours ago, Thorny said:

So, if we were gonna get Cirelli for 7th OA, perhaps the deal is now a first next year, UNprotected. And yes, that’s a deal I see as less likely, from 1 or both team’s perspectives. 

why would you not want the pick lottery protected? its a gross over-payment if it is not protected

I can not imagine trading a 7th overall pick in a draft that is compared favorably to the 2015 draft in terms of talent.  

Anthony Cerelli? He's a 40 point player on an extremely talented club.   not to say I wouldnt mind getting him but the 7th overall? no way

 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Crusader1969

[Randall Flagg]

30 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

why would you not want the pick lottery protected? its a gross over-payment if it is not protected

I can not imagine trading a 7th overall pick in a draft that is compared favorably to the 2015 draft in terms of talent.  

Anthony Cerelli? He's a 40 point player on an extremely talented club.   not to say I wouldnt mind getting him but the 7th overall? no way

 

40 points in a shortened season. He was pacing for 55 pointing a shutdown role of a team where all major offensive opportunities are split between two lines, neither of which Cirelli is on. It's his second full season and he's likely going to be a Selke finalist. His scoring rates track consistently compared to Point, who was a 60 point player playing with Kucherov, until he was a 90 point player a year later.

 

Yeah, id take a guy who can be a Selke finalist while pacing for 55 points getting just offensive scraps compared to the lines above him, all of this in just his second full pro season, over a chance to draft the next grab bag of Mittses, Nylanders, and Cozenses

Edited May 5, 2020 by Randall Flagg

[Randall Flagg]

https://thehockeynews.com/news/article/lightnings-anthony-cirelli-is-playing-his-way-into-small-club-of-selke-trophy-candidates

[Crusader1969]

2 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

40 points in a shortened season. He was pacing for 55 pointing a shutdown role of a team where all major offensive opportunities are split between two lines, neither of which Cirelli is on. It's his second full season and he's likely going to be a Selke finalist. His scoring rates track favorably compared to Point, who was a 60 point player playing with Kucherov, until he was a 90 point player a year later.

 

Yeah, id take a guy who can be a Selke finalist while pacing for 55 points getting just offensive scraps compared to the lines above him, all of this in just his second full pro season, over a chance to draft the next grab bag of Mittses, Nylanders, and Cozenses

if they are that strapped to have to give him up, you don't need to trade away the 7th overall. Its an overpayment. 

2021 lottery protected pick, no problem

1 minute ago, Randall Flagg said:

https://thehockeynews.com/news/article/lightnings-anthony-cirelli-is-playing-his-way-into-small-club-of-selke-trophy-candidates

i understand, he's a very good hockey player.   Think you can do the trade and not give away the pick.

[Randall Flagg]

23 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

if they are that strapped to have to give him up, you don't need to trade away the 7th overall. Its an overpayment. 

2021 lottery protected pick, no problem

i understand, he's a very good hockey player.   Think you can do the trade and not give away the pick.

It is not an overpayment. You'd think that our last decade of garbage teams and underwhelming high-but-not-top-2 picks would have lessened your vice grip on those picks. 7OA has real value, but will likely never impact the Sabres the way Cirelli or dozens and dozens of NHL players could. Those players have more value than the pick

If we had the player, you would laugh at other fans suggesting you'd give him up for 7OA

Edited May 5, 2020 by Randall Flagg

[thewookie1]

I’d want contract assurances before I’d deal the 7th pick. 

[Taro T]

58 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

if they are that strapped to have to give him up, you don't need to trade away the 7th overall. Its an overpayment.

2021 lottery protected pick, no problem

i understand, he's a very good hockey player.   Think you can do the trade and not give away the pick.

If the Sabres are the only team bidding for him, putting together a bid that is acceptable to TB and doesn't include 7OA might be possible.  What are the odds the Sabres are the only squad looking to pick up a young quality 2C with years remaining as an RFA?

What package do the Sabres put together that doesn't include this season's 1st that beats the 2nd best offer the Bolts receive for him?

[Crusader1969]

25 minutes ago, Taro T said:

If the Sabres are the only team bidding for him, putting together a bid that is acceptable to TB and doesn't include 7OA might be possible.  What are the odds the Sabres are the only squad looking to pick up a young quality 2C with years remaining as an RFA?

What package do the Sabres put together that doesn't include this season's 1st that beats the 2nd best offer the Bolts receive for him?

Next years top 10 protected pick plus D prospect or 2   
If the draft happens in June it’s a mute point anyways 

 

 

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, Crusader1969 said:

Next years top 10 protected pick plus D prospect or 2   
If the draft happens in June it’s a mute point anyways 

 

 

What D prospects?  If you're TB, wouldn't you expect somebody to come up with a package better than a pick in the teens / 20's and Borgen + Johnson/Samuelsson?  Can't see anyway that gets a Cirelli trade done.

[Weave]

I don't think Crusader is in the this to watch a winning team.  I think he's in it to watch a winning draft.

[Weave]

In a re-draft does Cirelli go in the top 7?  Top 10?  I think that's worth a 7 in the upcoming draft.  You'd be getting what you would've gotten anyway without the inherent risk or developmnet time.

[Eleven]

2 hours ago, thewookie1 said:

I’d want contract assurances before I’d deal the 7th pick. 

 

1 hour ago, Crusader1969 said:

Next years top 10 protected pick plus D prospect or 2   
If the draft happens in June it’s a mute point anyways 

 

 

At some point,  either (1) potential energy turns into kinetic energy or (2) the machine is worthless.

Not even an engineer.

[dudacek]

In a fair market, Cirelli gets more than pick 7.

In a market where Tampa has to trade him and not take contract back, pick 7 might be the best offer they get. But you can be sure there are other bidders. Montreal has cap space and pick 8, for example. What will they add and can Buffalo beat it.

Pretty sure they will figure out a plan that doesn’t involve trading him. We’ve certainly seen that movie before.

Edited May 5, 2020 by dudacek