Ultimate 8: The best Sabres team.

[Eleven]

We need something to do right now.

So here's what I'm thinking.  Let's name the best eight Sabres teams that we can, put them into a bracket, and have a playoff that we vote on (and explain the reasons for our votes, because, again, we need something to do.)

Nominations are hereby solicited; please post nominations in this thread.  A "thumbs up"  response means that you like the selection and think that it belongs in the bracket, so please respond to nominations.  The bracket will be seeded by thumbs ups.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Eleven

[Hank]

I like the idea, but I find it difficult to compare teams from different eras. I'd be hard pressed to think or a team that could beat prime Hasek and twenty guys named Peca. 

[Taro T]

'74-'75

Made it to the Finals.  Tied with Moe-ray-all & Filly for most points in the regular season.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'79-'80

1st Bowman led team.  Played very strong down the stretch.  Long wait to play eventual champs cost them dearly.

[Taro T]

'92-'93

Team lost to eventual champs in Adams Final after sweeping Bah-stan.  Had Muckler been smart enough to play healthy Hasek rather than injured Fuhr & had LaFontaine stayed healthy ...

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'97-'98

Team got hosed by Frasier in game 2.  If Bondra's illegal goal hadn't stood in game 2, Sabres very well might have swept Caps.  Would've been crushed by the Wings, but might have stolen a game or 2.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'98-'99

Still waiting for faceoff at blue line to Hasek's left.  Pretty sure they've got this. ?

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'00-'01

Horrible luck in game 6.  Horrible officiating in game 7 coupled with Gilmour quitting made overcoming having no value from Peca insurmountable.  Peca or Iginla would've put that team over the top.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'05-'06

Down 1 Connelly and 4 D and still were less than 20 minutes from facing a much weaker Eulers squad.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Taro T

[Taro T]

'06-'07

Presidents Trophy winners.  But seemed flawed down the stretch.

[Hank]

2 minutes ago, Taro T said:

'05-'06

Down 1 Connelly and 4 D and still were less than 20 minutes from facing a much weaker Eulers squad.

I think this is the best team. Hard to bet against prime Hasek though. 

That D was very underrated in my opinion. 

[Taro T]

3 minutes ago, Hank said:

I think this is the best team. Hard to bet against prime Hasek though. 

That D was very underrated in my opinion. 

A very strong case can be made for this team and the '00-'01 squad as well.  Slightly weaker for '92-'93 & '79-'80.  ('74-'75 and '98-'99 will obviously get a lot of deserved love.)

'10-'11 could sneak into the top 8, but IMHO '97-'98 just edges them out.

[Hank]

1 minute ago, Taro T said:

A very strong case can be made for this team and the '00-'01 squad as well.  Slightly weaker for '92-'93 & '79-'80.  ('74-'75 and '98-'99 will obviously get a lot of deserved love.)

The difficulty I have with comparing different eras is that players are bigger, faster, stronger than previous generations. Add in the focus on health, diet, not having to work a second job to make ends meet, year round training. It makes it difficult for me to believe that the 74-75 team could compete with teams from decades later. 

[Taro T]

Pretty sure that it has to be evaluated in the context of how good those teams were relative to their opponents and with special attention to how they fared / should've fared in the playoffs.

[Hank]

21 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Pretty sure that it has to be evaluated in the context of how good those teams were relative to their opponents and with special attention to how they fared / should've fared in the playoffs.

Oh, so we're not trying to say who we think would win if they played each other? I misunderstood, thanks for clarifying, carry on...

[Eleven]

Taro is a one man nominating machine!

[Marvin]

This is a hard one.  I have so many candidates.

1974-5 had two fatal flaws: goaltending and coaching.  In spite of that, if the Sabres had been 1st OA, they draw the Islanders in the Semi-Finals and the Flyers would have got the Habs.   Assuming they get to the Finals, they either had home ice against Philly or, more likely, face the Habs, whom the Flyers couldn't handle.  You can quote John Greenleaf Whittier's "Maud Muller" here. ("For of all sad words of tongue or pen / The saddest are these: 'What might have been.'")

As several commentators such as Dick Irvin, Tom Mees, and the 1999 staff of The Hockey News called the 1974-86 Sabres things like "the Sabres' analogue of the 1988-99 Bills", I am giving them a long look.

The three teams 1975-8 suffered because of the division we were in with that first round bye, just as the Flyers and Islanders hurt each other.  Trading away Peter McNab to the Bruins hurt a LOT.  The 1977-8 team had far better goaltending than 1974-5.  One wonders if Gerry Desjardins's eye injury is the difference in 1977.  Several Islanders players still can't figure out how they beat us in 1976.  I can make the case that all 3 of these teams plus the next 2 I mention were better than 1974-5 overall.

The 1979-80 and 1982-3 teams were both very good.  The long layoff in 1980 killed us.  I still hate Brad Park, but to this day, I wonder more about how quickly that team regressed instead of improved.

After the rebuild post-Bowman we have some interesting entries.

1989-90 cemented my hatred of divisional playoffs.  #3 vs. #4 or some such in round 1?  Argh!  I think they are a step below every other team I mention, but boy, they deserved better.

1992-3 and 2005-6 are the two unluckiest Sabres teams.  Key injuries killed them both.  If we can ponder the hypothetical of Hasek in 1993, can I get some love for the hypothetical of LaFontaine in 1994?  Also, can someone explain to me why 1995 was so much worse than I thought it should have been?

1998-9 needed a bit more offence, but that's hard when you are outspent 2-1.  And I guess since the NHL stopped enforcing rules in the DPE, the tainted result makes sense.  To add insult to injury, several Dallass players said they were so hurt that the Sabres could have run them over in a game 7.

2000-1 angers me the most.  Gilmour's quitting barely registers because the total stupidity of the Mike Peca situation bugs me to this day.  If he's in the line-up, this team could get my vote.

2009-10 and 2010-11 both have arguments for them because of key injuries even with the Centre issues.  Heck, a healthy Jochen Hecht in round 1 could push those teams a long way.

If I have to pick one, I am going with 2005-6.  Game 7 against Carolina was the first time I had cried over them losing since Brad Park.  Depending on hypotheticals, I could choose 1993-4 or 2000-1.

Edited March 15, 2020 by E4 ... Ke2
Quote added.

[The Big Lebowski]

3 hours ago, Taro T said:

'92-'93

Team lost to eventual champs in Adams Final after sweeping Bah-stan.  Had Muckler been smart enough to play healthy Hasek rather than injured Fuhr & had LaFontaine stayed healthy ...

I agree. Plus, we only lost by one goal (with 3 games going into OT) when getting swept by Montreal. I always think about if Muckler realized what he had in Hasek, he never would've traded away Andreychuk for Fuhr. It would've been the first time in NHL history all three members of a line (Andreychuk, LaFontaine, Mogilny)  had 50 goals in a season.

When I met Dale Hawerchuk at an autograph signing years ago, he told me of all the teams he played on, he felt the 1992-93 Sabres had the best chance to win the cup.

 

[Neo]

7 hours ago, FiXCzeR said:

I agree. Plus, we only lost by one goal (with 3 games going into OT) when getting swept by Montreal. I always think about if Muckler realized what he had in Hasek, he never would've traded away Andreychuk for Fuhr. It would've been the first time in NHL history all three members of a line (Andreychuk, LaFontaine, Mogilny)  had 50 goals in a season.

When I met Dale Hawerchuk at an autograph signing years ago, he told me of all the teams he played on, he felt the 1992-93 Sabres had the best chance to win the cup.

 

Quote, and @Taro T..

What a fun team to remember.  There’s the obvious, LaFontaine and Mogilny.  Then there’s the subtle, Andreychuk and Fuhr.  Hasek was still unconventional.  Another word was weird.  His GAA was greater than three, not crazy in that era, but not evidence of all world talent.  He was 11/10 in won/lost (no Sabres goalie won more than 11 games that year; 3 goalies won exactly 11 games).  I hated the Andreychuk trade, believing Buffalo’s “hit him with your purse, Dave” ridicule was among our least informed player jabs of all time.

Both series were sweeps and the most entertaining eight game stretch I remember.  Eight games, six OTs, and arch rivals in the old Adams Division.  My deepest impressions at the time:

Howerchuk, an all time great, still is in his 12th season. He is a talent AND a gamer.

Doug Bodger is a beast.  I had no idea.

Patrick Roy won ten consecutive OT games.

Thanks to @Eleven and @Taro T.

[Pimlach]

You need some luck to win.  Almost every championship team has some good fortune along the way.  Reading these posts reinforces what I always thought, we just needed a break.   
 

i think we were better than Philly in 75, and better than Dallas in 93, and better than the Canes too.   Yet there are no Cups on the shelf. 
 

 

[Eleven]

Let's give it two more days for nominations.  I'll close nominations on Wednesday.