COVID-19

[triumph_communes]

2 hours ago, JujuFish said:

Regarding the discussion of COVID-19 death count:

 

Regardless of whether it was over or undercounted, there were an estimated 600,000 excess deaths.  Maybe they're directly due to COVID-19.  Maybe they're people who had other problems and COVID-19 pushed it over the edge.  Maybe they're people who were too afraid to go to the hospital during a pandemic and something that was treatable if caught early never got caught.

Whatever the case may be, the effect is clear and serious.  ~600,000 more Americans died than expected.

100% true. But how many of those would’ve died with another regular flu surge like in 2018?  As more and more boomers are getting to critical ages?  Likely a good chunk

[Weave]

9 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

100% true. But how many of those would’ve died with another regular flu surge like in 2018?  As more and more boomers are getting to critical ages?  Likely a good chunk

The scale is 10x.  A good chunk doesn’t create similarity.  The difference in scale is immense.

[LGR4GM]

51 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

100% true. But how many of those would’ve died with another regular flu surge like in 2018?  As more and more boomers are getting to critical ages?  Likely a good chunk

So your working hypothesis is that the 60k influenza deaths in 2017/18 is comparable to the 600k Covid deaths in 2020?

[Doohicksie]

5 hours ago, JujuFish said:

Regarding the discussion of COVID-19 death count:

 

Regardless of whether it was over or undercounted, there were an estimated 600,000 excess deaths.  Maybe they're directly due to COVID-19.  Maybe they're people who had other problems and COVID-19 pushed it over the edge.  Maybe they're people who were too afraid to go to the hospital during a pandemic and something that was treatable if caught early never got caught.

Whatever the case may be, the effect is clear and serious.  ~600,000 more Americans died than expected.

It's actually more than 600k, and this is in a year when the flu was way down.

[JujuFish]

4 hours ago, triumph_communes said:

100% true. But how many of those would’ve died with another regular flu surge like in 2018?  As more and more boomers are getting to critical ages?  Likely a good chunk

Hundreds of thousands fewer, no doubt.

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

It's actually more than 600k, and this is in a year when the flu was way down.

The number I saw was 540-660, so I chose the middle, since it was a nice round number.

[Weave]

8 hours ago, triumph_communes said:

Ooh nice straw man. Gr8 job m8

 

Lets see the points I was trying to make:  scientists who all along we’re making judgement calls on risks: 1) were dead wrong on how to treat covid from the onset and got many more killed than necessary 2) argued against nearly harmless prophylactics because it differed from their approach in #1, 3) feds waited until there was an absurdly expensive option only the select few could approach, and otherwise held out until a vaccine was available. The vaccine does nothing to stop the spread and has clearly not gone through the normal rigor, but they pushed it anyway in historical fashion. Putting any fat person who comes in on dexamethasone is going to save more than it’ll hurt and could have been done on day 1 if they weren’t so arrogant. 
 

No centralized conspiracy here beyond what Fauci controlled. There were many moving players, many mistakes made, and many who admitted to their faults. But the narrative ignored all of that and doubled down on dividing people and pitting people against each other as if they are the reason normalcy can’t return. 
 

Your retort is somehow I’m being a hypocrite?  I’m vaccinated I can weigh risks myself. No young female should touch the vaccine with a 10ft pole IMO, there are serious side effects in the ovaries that has been squashed and silenced thanks to useful idiots like you.  They didn’t even test vaccines on women for decades because hormonal swings complicated the testing procedures.  The methods essentially are written now to exclude all hormonal swings from the observations about vaccine studies to overcompensate for this and now we have a sham of a system that hurts women at the end of the day. And most scientists are little sheeplings like you and only understand their little nipple of knowledge and are unable to put the big picture all together. They just want to take this opportunity to lash back out at the people who made fun of them their whole lives. They just want to believe they’re smarter than the guy waving a flag. Science has turned into a religious cult and cults don’t discriminate based on IQ.  The media has effectively emotionalized all issues and this nonsense you post is exactly the consequence of it- you’ve been trained to paint anyone who doesn’t pay your back with pointless straw man arguments to dehumanize me. Congrats dude, well played. 
 

 

Im not sitting in any corner that they are intentionally hurting people with a dangerous vaccine. But it’s fact there were plenty of alternatives with extremely well known side effects they actively discouraged and ignored. And the person leading that cause has been in bed with vaccine makers for decades. And once they had a solution he switched gears and accelerated the damn things in I prevented fashion. At Trumps request no doubt. It’s concerning you’d dare call that a conspiracy to point out that conflict of interest.  I have nothing against vaccines, just transparency and action. And many people died because they got greedy. They wanted a sure fire solution only their friends had a monopoly on. 
 

And now real data is coming out about severe hormonal swings because the LNPs don’t stay in the arm like claimed. You have sham scientists making assumptions on studies that clearly showed non containment. They are sham scientists no matter their credentials. They threw out their abundance of caution to make a buck or make fame.

 

So, American doctors, researchers, scientists, and a variety of alphabet soup gov't agencies through some combination of ineptness and corruption chose to not implement a policy of horse dewormers, malaria meds, and anti-inflammatories because they were paid off to do so, had too much pride to ignore existing meds, and wanted to be rockstars? And the boots on the ground medical community is so devoid of critical thinkers that they just followed along without question? Is that the assertion?

Given that the US took a very similar path as the rest of the world in fighting this disease it should stand to reason that the EU, Japan, S Korea, Russia, China, WHO, countless other alphabet soup agencies around the world (some of whom have a vested interest in making the US look stupid), and all of the scientists, researchers, and doctors involved were all too stupid to see the missing link with horse wormers, anti-infammatories, and anti-malarials or too paid off or too conflicted to raise the issue that there was no need to throw millions (billions?) of dollars at J&J, Pfizer, and Moderna. It is that big of a socio-medical *****? Is that our New World Order?

I love how governments and medical agencies are at once too inept to see an obvious, inexpensive treatment yet are devious and crafty enough to pull off the grandest of conspiracies.

And they would have pulled it off if it weren't for those meddling kids.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, Doohickie said:

It's actually more than 600k, and this is in a year when the flu was way down.

According to the CDC's provisional stats for 2020, in the US there were ~375,000 covid deaths.  Linky 1

Total deaths in the US were, again according to CDC's provisional stats, 3,358,814 in 2020.   Linky 2   Which would be an increase from 2019 when there were 2,854,838 deaths.

Not diving deeply into their data there seems to be something slightly amiss as they say the death rate in '19 per 100k was 869.7 but on the page where they estimate 2020 deaths they state the rate per 100k increased from 715.2 to 828.7.

[SwampD]

38 minutes ago, Taro T said:

According to the CDC's provisional stats for 2020, in the US there were ~375,000 covid deaths.  Linky 1

Total deaths in the US were, again according to CDC's provisional stats, 3,358,814 in 2020.   Linky 2   Which would be an increase from 2019 when there were 2,854,838 deaths.

Not diving deeply into their data there seems to be something slightly amiss as they say the death rate in '19 per 100k was 869.7 but on the page where they estimate 2020 deaths they state the rate per 100k increased from 715.2 to 828.7.

I don’t think it’s amiss. I read somewhere else that the death for 2020 was just about on par with every other year.

What I can’t stand is when some people then use that fact to bark about Covid being overblown and not that big of a deal. But I don’t see how they are comparable, since one happened under a complete lockdown. We don’t have the “luxury” of seeing what the death rate would have been in a non lockdown control group, I mean, unless you look at the tristate area pre lockdown.

I believe we would have seen mass graves.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, SwampD said:

I don’t think it’s amiss. I read somewhere else that the death for 2020 was just about on par with every other year.

What I can’t stand is when some people then use that fact to bark about Covid being overblown and not that big of a deal. But I don’t see how they are comparable, since one happened under a complete lockdown. We don’t have the “luxury” of seeing what the death rate would have been in a non lockdown control group, I mean, unless you look at the tristate area pre lockdown.

I believe we would have seen mass graves.

What's amiss is the page with the final data for 2019 quotes the death rate for that year as 867.9/100k and the other with the estimated '20 data says the deathrate that year was 715.2/100k.  Those 2 technically should be identical as they are measuring the same item but they are significantly different.  So, something seems to be amiss.  Didn't look at the underlying data sets to find the source of those discrepancies.

As to the comparison of apples & oranges, not going there personally.  But 1 item to consider moving forward is treatment protocols for patients is dramatically different & more successful than it was 16 months ago.

[triumph_communes]

3 hours ago, Weave said:

 

So, American doctors, researchers, scientists, and a variety of alphabet soup gov't agencies through some combination of ineptness and corruption chose to not implement a policy of horse dewormers, malaria meds, and anti-inflammatories because they were paid off to do so, had too much pride to ignore existing meds, and wanted to be rockstars? And the boots on the ground medical community is so devoid of critical thinkers that they just followed along without question? Is that the assertion?

Given that the US took a very similar path as the rest of the world in fighting this disease it should stand to reason that the EU, Japan, S Korea, Russia, China, WHO, countless other alphabet soup agencies around the world (some of whom have a vested interest in making the US look stupid), and all of the scientists, researchers, and doctors involved were all too stupid to see the missing link with horse wormers, anti-infammatories, and anti-malarials or too paid off or too conflicted to raise the issue that there was no need to throw millions (billions?) of dollars at J&J, Pfizer, and Moderna. It is that big of a socio-medical *****? Is that our New World Order?

I love how governments and medical agencies are at once too inept to see an obvious, inexpensive treatment yet are devious and crafty enough to pull off the grandest of conspiracies.

And they would have pulled it off if it weren't for those meddling kids.

There were plenty of doctors who followed the science and not the WHO and CDC *****. Remember the WHO who specifically stated it’s not contagious or other nonsense?  There were plenty of good doctors who looked at lack of deaths in asthmatics for a respiratory disease and put the corticosteroid link together really quick. The problem is we have a whole generation of doctors who don’t prognose anything anymore- they just spit out the recommendations the computer built by the insurance company says and then try to regurgitate the nonsense to you without you realizing they’re reading a script. And those standard protocols were just wrong. No conspiracy early on, they had to make a guess the first couple of months and did what they thought was conservative. The cover up and corruption was what came later. When they tried to change course. Or they refused to change course. Or the nonsense you see here where they were too busy telling everyone they were heroes and didnt want to admit they screwed up or were clueless.

Again, I’m not against vaccines. I’m just not buying the narrative it’s been BS all along and you’re lapping it up.  Y’all called us conspiracy when we said last February the level 4 lab in wuhan had an escape was the source. Faucis highest paid recipient of virus funding research then wrote an article published by Nature that purposefully misled everyone to believe that couldn’t have been the case, only for us to find out over a year later not only was it all true but the gain of function research itself was US funded.  Seems like conspiracy was right all along. And yes those esteemed alphabets and journals got swindled. Oops. 

[Doohicksie]

[nfreeman]

Remember when a bunch of people here were sure Florida’s covid books were cooked but for some reason trusted NY’s numbers?

NY has now revised its death count upward by 28%.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/25/state-health-department-reports-nys-true-covid-death-toll/

 

 

 

[SwampD]

34 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

NY has now revised its death count upward by 28%.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/25/state-health-department-reports-nys-true-covid-death-toll/

 

Wow. It's kinda crazy that it's that much higher.

 

 

[bg17]

37 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Remember when a bunch of people here were sure Florida’s covid books were cooked but for some reason trusted NY’s numbers?

NY has now revised its death count upward by 28%.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/25/state-health-department-reports-nys-true-covid-death-toll/

 

 

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/18/fauci-holds-up-new-york-as-model-for-fighting-coronavirus-they-did-it-correctly.html

Did they? Probably too soon to say. 

[darksabre]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

Remember when a bunch of people here were sure Florida’s covid books were cooked but for some reason trusted NY’s numbers?

NY has now revised its death count upward by 28%.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/25/state-health-department-reports-nys-true-covid-death-toll/

 

 

 

As though this somehow proves Florida's numbers weren't fudged too? 

Not sure anyone here is going to be surprised that craven politicians did craven politician things.

Edited August 25, 2021 by darksabre

[JujuFish]

1 hour ago, nfreeman said:

Remember when a bunch of people here were sure Florida’s covid books were cooked but for some reason trusted NY’s numbers?

NY has now revised its death count upward by 28%.

https://nypost.com/2021/08/25/state-health-department-reports-nys-true-covid-death-toll/
 

You've posted this in the wrong thread.

https://www.sabrespace.com/community/topic/27730-covid-19-discussion/

[drnkirishone]

31 minutes ago, darksabre said:

As though this somehow proves Florida's numbers weren't fudged too? 

Not sure anyone here is going to be surprised that craven politicians did craven politician things.

you are flying close to the "DANGER ZONE"

[darksabre]

57 minutes ago, drnkirishone said:

you are flying close to the "DANGER ZONE"

[calti]

According to the inventor of PCR--The test is not to be used and is not effective for testing live virus.

Just happens they are eliminating PCR testing and Big Pharma along with Bill Gates are gonna come up with another

test as they slowly and quietly back away from PCR. No excess deaths were noted by the CDC in 2020. 2018,2019 2020 Normal and stable amt of deaths in USA.

Come 2021 --upon massive use of the mRNA vaccine there was a steep excess death count in the USA.

The 600k or so 'deaths' by  covid were actually deaths with covid. 95% of this figure is those with severe chronic disease and'or those with influenza.

Amazingly flu vanished from the planet around april '20..But was still listed as present in 55% of supposed covid deaths....They couldnt have poached these

causes of death away from flu/heart/respiratory/cancer etc deaths and called them covid deaths in order that the facilities could benefit financially..nahhh. After all--the entire excess death count in the USA at this time was approx zero

Now the deaths are piling up a bit and some are being reported to vaers and 10 other reporting agencies. But that isnt getting publicized much

The publicity is going to those who are either vaccinated or non vaccinated.And 'surprisingly' those who die within 2 weeks after  being vaccinated are being

categorized as deaths of the unvaccinated.

There is so much more ..But I dont want to put anyone to sleep.

 

[Cascade Youth]

1 hour ago, calti said:

According to the inventor of PCR--The test is not to be used and is not effective for testing live virus.

Just happens they are eliminating PCR testing and Big Pharma along with Bill Gates are gonna come up with another

test as they slowly and quietly back away from PCR. No excess deaths were noted by the CDC in 2020. 2018,2019 2020 Normal and stable amt of deaths in USA.

Come 2021 --upon massive use of the mRNA vaccine there was a steep excess death count in the USA.

The 600k or so 'deaths' by  covid were actually deaths with covid. 95% of this figure is those with severe chronic disease and'or those with influenza.

Amazingly flu vanished from the planet around april '20..But was still listed as present in 55% of supposed covid deaths....They couldnt have poached these

causes of death away from flu/heart/respiratory/cancer etc deaths and called them covid deaths in order that the facilities could benefit financially..nahhh. After all--the entire excess death count in the USA at this time was approx zero

Now the deaths are piling up a bit and some are being reported to vaers and 10 other reporting agencies. But that isnt getting publicized much

The publicity is going to those who are either vaccinated or non vaccinated.And 'surprisingly' those who die within 2 weeks after  being vaccinated are being

categorized as deaths of the unvaccinated.

There is so much more ..But I dont want to put anyone to sleep.

 

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, calti said:

But I dont want to put anyone to sleep.

No.  Just to death.

[Cascade Youth]

Yes it’s all a giant conspiracy by Big Pharma and the Democrats with the goal of laying the groundwork for a Green New Deal whereby sweeping life-altering body-controlling job-killing regulations will be passed en masse under the auspices of solving a public health crisis and us sheeple will already be pumped so full of the Govt Similac we will let it all happen.

Something like that right?

Get bent.  Seriously.

EDIT:

Also, the Neville Chamberlains who go around saying “I don’t judge anyone for not getting the vaccine, it’s a personal decision!” can get bent too.  Quit appeasing.  It’s ok to judge the sh- out of mouth-breathing conspiracy-slinging Neanderthals.  Enough is enough with this garbage. 

Edited August 25, 2021 by Cascade Youth

[SwampD]

1 hour ago, Cascade Youth said:

It’s a bot.

[Wyldnwoody44]

2 hours ago, Cascade Youth said:

Yes it’s all a giant conspiracy by Big Pharma and the Democrats with the goal of laying the groundwork for a Green New Deal whereby sweeping life-altering body-controlling job-killing regulations will be passed en masse under the auspices of solving a public health crisis and us sheeple will already be pumped so full of the Govt Similac we will let it all happen.

Something like that right?

Get bent.  Seriously.

EDIT:

Also, the Neville Chamberlains who go around saying “I don’t judge anyone for not getting the vaccine, it’s a personal decision!” can get bent too.  Quit appeasing.  It’s ok to judge the sh- out of mouth-breathing conspiracy-slinging Neanderthals.  Enough is enough with this garbage. 

Who the F made you king. If people don't want it, they don't want it, let me bow down in your eternal greatness, you're so f'ing amazing. I don't buy into the nonsense dribble and I have oh, idk 15 years of medical experience and I still will allow people to make choices on what they believe. I hope it doesn't hurt when you fall off that cloud of judgement you're sitting on, when it implodes on your pathetic ass. 

[JohnC]

4 minutes ago, Wyldnwoody44 said:

Who the F made you king. If people don't want it, they don't want it, let me bow down in your eternal greatness, you're so f'ing amazing. I don't buy into the nonsense dribble and I have oh, idk 15 years of medical experience and I still will allow people to make choices on what they believe. I hope it doesn't hurt when you fall off that cloud of judgement you're sitting on, when it implodes on your pathetic ass. 

In the military the soldiers will soon be required to get vaccinated whether they want to or not.