COVID-19

[Weave]

14 minutes ago, #freejame said:

A friends roommate invited her friends down from NY. One of them brought it down and now not only is her whole household infected, my group of friends are also infected from a kayak trip we had taken while we were in town. I was never within more than six feet of the NYers and even then it was very limited and outdoors. 
 

I will continue to believe it’s clowns from infected states bringing the virus to South Carolina until I am proven otherwise. All anecdotal evidence points to this being the case. It’s crazy how everything was fine until all the out-of-towners started showing up. Just wish I had re-upped on the Devil’s Lettuce before testing positive...here’s to having a reserve of wine and Jameson. 

It’s a virus.  And a rather easy one to spread.  It’s not like your area was going to remain an island of Covid free paradise for long.

Clowns?  Harsh.  Possibly accurate.  But harsh.  Is Neo a clown for coming up north right now?

[#freejame]

11 minutes ago, Weave said:

It’s a virus.  And a rather easy one to spread.  It’s not like your area was going to remain an island of Covid free paradise for long.

Clowns?  Harsh.  Possibly accurate.  But harsh.  Is Neo a clown for coming up north right now?

Neo called the government of NY to make sure he followed the proper guidelines and would not be taking extra risks. He is being considerate of those around him and taking precautions. He can correct me if I’m wrong, but he isn’t going out maskless to bars or out to eat 6 times in three days. I have another friend who ran into them while at the bar on Saturday night, now she’s being tested as well. Who knows how many they infected.

 

Did people get a little too complacent down here after being open since May first? Maybe. But I think everyone can understand the desire to return to normalcy. Yes, that is why people are visiting. Yes, I understand it sucks you can’t do things where you are. But people traveling from hot spots to open places are the problem. 
 

There’s a way to travel that’s respectful, considerate, and limits the spread. That has not been the case down here. It’s frustrating because of the way certain states have been portrayed in the media, and while I try not to look, the comment sections of various websites. I’m fairly certain that Fauci said we had handled it great as recently as six or so weeks ago. 
 

I’m frustrated. There isn’t much else to say. I haven’t taken this as seriously as many on here, but I have followed my local and state guidelines and have been respectful and courtesy to those around me. I’m hoping to stay asymptomatic. I will quarantine either way. But *****, I know you can understand my frustration. 

Edited June 26, 2020 by #freejame

[Weave]

I agree that people traveling to open places from hotspots are a problem.  I disagree that you can do it considerately.  Putting someone else at unnecessary risk is pretty inconsiderate.  I had to travel for business last week.  I did everything according to local rules and some to an even higher standard.  But If I didn’t have to go, I wouldn’t have.  The considerate thing to do would be stay home.  Alas, the economy is more important I guess.

We’re all frustrated.  Too many people everywhere not giving this virus the respect they should.

[Taro T]

The wildcard in all of this is if we aren't able to produce an effective vaccine & we aren't going to totally eradicate it (both of which are unknowns at this point whether we'll be able to accomplish either), then herd immunity is how we manage to protect those that are high risk.  If we could actually eradicate it without the herd immunity (obtained naturally or via injection) then yes, absolutely minimizing exposure for all is the best thing, but that doesn't really seem plausible at this point.  Hopefully it is, maybe it is, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

As long as hospitals aren't overwhelmed & so far they aren't & as long as deaths continue declining & so far they seem to be then having younger people (which the data seems to be indicating are predominantly the people currently getting the virus) getting infected and recovering isn't necessarily a calamity & may actually in the big picture be a good thing.

Social distance & be responsible, but don't stop living.  My 2 cents.

[#freejame]

4 minutes ago, Taro T said:

The wildcard in all of this is if we aren't able to produce an effective vaccine & we aren't going to totally eradicate it (both of which are unknowns at this point whether we'll be able to accomplish either), then herd immunity is how we manage to protect those that are high risk.  If we could actually eradicate it without the herd immunity (obtained naturally or via injection) then yes, absolutely minimizing exposure for all is the best thing, but that doesn't really seem plausible at this point.  Hopefully it is, maybe it is, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

As long as hospitals aren't overwhelmed & so far they aren't & as long as deaths continue declining & so far they seem to be then having younger people (which the data seems to be indicating are predominantly the people currently getting the virus) getting infected and recovering isn't necessarily a calamity & may actually in the big picture be a good thing.

Social distance & be responsible, but don't stop living.  My 2 cents.

I agree with all of this, particularly the second to last paragraph. That is basically what has been going on here. Like I said, it’s just frustrating. I’m asymptomatic and I don’t mind working from home in the slightest, but I have a pretty serious history of pneumonia and that’s always a concern in the back of my mind. I’m confident all will be well and want to make sure I don’t give it to anyone vulnerable. 

[Weave]

Except new areas of the country are approaching ICU capacity just like NYC in March.  Controls are going to be needed for a fair bit of time yet.

[Stoner]

Does herd immunity rely on the idea that if you had it, you can't get it again? If protection is short-lived as has been speculated, you might even have people who were sick in March getting infected again now. The length of protection is still a great unknown.

But a lot is being learned about who's vulnerable. The CDC put out a statement yesterday I think that downplayed age and basically said anyone of any age with certain underlying conditions is vulnerable. Hypertension alone doesn't look as risky now; for a while now they've been saying it's only moderate to severe asthma that is a concern, not simply "asthma."

[Stoner]

Quote

The new guidance breaks down medical conditions that can influence disease severity into those for which there is strong evidence, and those for which the evidence is not as strong, classifying the latter as conditions that might increase the risk of severe illness.

Cardiovascular disease, chronic kidney disease, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease or COPD, obesity, any immuno-suppressing condition, sickle cell disease, a history of an organ transplant, and type 2 diabetes are classified as having strong evidence of increasing the risk of Covid-19 infection.

Conditions that are considered ones that might increase the risk of severe illness are chronic lung diseases, including moderate to severe asthma and cystic fibrosis, high blood pressure, a weakened immune system, neurologic conditions, such as dementia or history of stroke, liver disease, and pregnancy.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/25/cdc-broadens-guidance-on-americans-facing-risk-of-severe-covid-19/

Note that obesity was previously cut off at 40 BMI but has been reduced to 30 BMI.

[Taro T]

5 hours ago, Weave said:

Except new areas of the country are approaching ICU capacity just like NYC in March.  Controls are going to be needed for a fair bit of time yet.

But how much of that capacity could be regained by cutting back on elective procedures again?

The areas that are getting "crushed" at present are nothing like NYC was at the end of March.  Wasn't the death toll over 900/day at its peak there with like 24,000 hospitalized?  (Am asking because the NY Covid tracker now only shows the past week or so of data rather than back into February like it had originally shown & am going off memory.) Though NYC expected to exceed ICU & ventilator capacity (& came extremely close) fortunately they didn't.

And absolutely those areas that are seeing upswings need to be vigilant & increase measures to control the rapid spread, but they likely don't need to be fully locked down.  That could change.

And having data on the causes of the spread there (and elsewhere too) would be extremely helpful in understanding exactly what is happening.  Also, having data on what's causing free capacity reductions would be helpful as well.  Last week (haven't looked more recently) about 20% of AZ's ICU occupied beds were COVID related & the rest weren't.  Was that by design or forced by emergencies.  How much of that increased ICU usage is due to heart attacks &/or urgent surgeries that were delayed that weren't urgent 2 months ago but are now?  Also, would be nice to know what is the typical ICU bed usage during "normal" times.  What %age of COVID hospitalizations require ICU and is that %age increasing or decreasing?  All these answers would go a long way towards understanding how individual areas need to react to the changing picture where they're at.

 

[shrader]

23 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/25/cdc-broadens-guidance-on-americans-facing-risk-of-severe-covid-19/

Note that obesity was previously cut off at 40 BMI but has been reduced to 30 BMI.

Was that a COVID-specific cutoff?  30 has always been the cutoff for obesity for as long as I've been in research.  That's only around 20 years, but that's a long enough time.  40 is just the highest class, most extreme grouping, of obesity.

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, shrader said:

Was that a COVID-specific cutoff?  30 has always been the cutoff for obesity for as long as I've been in research.  That's only around 20 years, but that's a long enough time.  40 is just the highest class, most extreme grouping, of obesity.

Obesity as a risk factor for severe outcomes.

[Eleven]

Question for our doctors / nurses / etc on here:  If someone is admitted to a hospital, has blood work done, etc., is that person automatically tested for COVID?

[Zamboni]

Just now, Eleven said:

Question for our doctors / nurses / etc on here:  If someone is admitted to a hospital, has blood work done, etc., is that person automatically tested for COVID?

Unless you are presenting symptoms... no.

If you get admitted to the hospital do they automatically test for cancer? Diabetes? Lupus? How about Sickle cell? Crohns? Iron deficiency?
 

Those are an extra step to test for specific things. An extra step costs time. Time is money. Unless there’s a reason, it’s not tested for. Now granted, a dr. could order a wide spectrum of tests and cast a wide net, but it needs to be somewhat justified as to why he/she is ordering specific bloodwork.

[SwampD]

8 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

Unless you are presenting symptoms... no.

If you get admitted to the hospital do they automatically test for cancer? Diabetes? Lupus? How about Sickle cell? Crohns? Iron deficiency?
 

Those are an extra step to test for specific things. An extra step costs time. Time is money. Unless there’s a reason, it’s not tested for. Now granted, a dr. could order a wide spectrum of tests and cast a wide net, but it needs to be somewhat justified as to why he/she is ordering specific bloodwork.

I’m not sure it has to be justified. I know a few people that were getting bloodwork done for other reasons and the doctor had them tested because “why not.”

[Randall Flagg]

17 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Question for our doctors / nurses / etc on here:  If someone is admitted to a hospital, has blood work done, etc., is that person automatically tested for COVID?

I am not one of those things, but will share that people I know have gone for routine bloodwork (and donations) and they've done the test while it's happening.

In February, neighbor classroom teachers in my girlfriend's school all got sick with a virus, and gave it to her the next week. Nasty cough, general malaise. I caught a bit of it too. At the time everyone thought the only US corona cases were in Washington. But all of those teachers tested positive for the antibodies, so we're wondering if we had it too. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

39 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Question for our doctors / nurses / etc on here:  If someone is admitted to a hospital, has blood work done, etc., is that person automatically tested for COVID?

No.  My brother ended up in ICU in NJ but was never tested for Covid at any time during his stay in the hospital.  They just assumed he had it and went forward from there.  Now that he is home and healthy he can't donate blood to others who need because he has no positive test on file.  He obviously can go get a test now, but what the hospital did in NJ is unacceptable.

One further note about state vs state.  My father is in assisted living here in GA.  Unlike NY and NJ our Governor forbid nursing homes and assisted living facilities from taking back residents and staff who had Covid.  In NY and NJ the Governors required the opposite.  Now thousands have died in the NY and NJ facilities.   While we have had some deaths here, we have seen nothing even close to the infection rate or death as seen in NY and NJ facilities.  In fact, my Dad's facility has had zero cases so far in residents or staff.  Maybe Cuomo is criticizing the Fla Governor to avoid responsibility for his deadly actions in NY 

[North Buffalo]

58 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Question for our doctors / nurses / etc on here:  If someone is admitted to a hospital, has blood work done, etc., is that person automatically tested for COVID?

Not sure, yes if they ask.  In our area so many people have been tested including anti bodies.  If they show any symptoms yes and are put on sfc status until results and treated as if.  From my perspective we treat them all as if.

[Stoner]

Kaleida hospital here tests anyone in ER and anyone being admitted. I'm guessing that's a Kaleida wide policy.

[North Buffalo]

14 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

No.  My brother ended up in ICU in NJ but was never tested for Covid at any time during his stay in the hospital.  They just assumed he had it and went forward from there.  Now that he is home and healthy he can't donate blood to others who need because he has no positive test on file.  He obviously can go get a test now, but what the hospital did in NJ is unacceptable.

One further note about state vs state.  My father is in assisted living here in GA.  Unlike NY and NJ our Governor forbid nursing homes and assisted living facilities from taking back residents and staff who had Covid.  In NY and NJ the Governors required the opposite.  Now thousands have died in the NY and NJ facilities.   While we have had some deaths here, we have seen nothing even close to the infection rate or death as seen in NY and NJ facilities.  In fact, my Dad's facility has had zero cases so far in residents or staff.  Maybe Cuomo is criticizing the Fla Governor to avoid responsibility for his deadly actions in NY 

Yeah the hard part in that decision was NYC was nearing bed capacity at the time.  Bad decision but a damned if you did or didnt.

[GASabresIUFAN]

2 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Yeah the hard part in that decision was NYC was nearing bed capacity at the time.  Bad decision but a damned if you did or didnt.

Not really.  He had the hospital ship and then the Javitz center which he didn’t utilize

[freester]

5 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Not really.  He had the hospital ship and then the Javitz center which he didn’t utilize

Yup what Cuomo and Wolfe in PA and the NJ governor did was unconscionable. They were singlehandedly  responsible for thousands of nursing home deaths. 

[North Buffalo]

Actually they were used, not to capacity, but they were used and at the height it wasnt clear that it was going to stop going up.  Hospitals were shipping pts everywhere even up state.

Not saying it was a good decision... more out of desperation and couldve been thought thru better.

[SwampD]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

No.  My brother ended up in ICU in NJ but was never tested for Covid at any time during his stay in the hospital.  They just assumed he had it and went forward from there.  Now that he is home and healthy he can't donate blood to others who need because he has no positive test on file.  He obviously can go get a test now, but what the hospital did in NJ is unacceptable.

One further note about state vs state.  My father is in assisted living here in GA.  Unlike NY and NJ our Governor forbid nursing homes and assisted living facilities from taking back residents and staff who had Covid.  In NY and NJ the Governors required the opposite.  Now thousands have died in the NY and NJ facilities.   While we have had some deaths here, we have seen nothing even close to the infection rate or death as seen in NY and NJ facilities.  In fact, my Dad's facility has had zero cases so far in residents or staff.  Maybe Cuomo is criticizing the Fla Governor to avoid responsibility for his deadly actions in NY 

What hospital?

[Ogre]

I’m embarrassed that my country can’t contain this like all of the other first world countries could.

[Weave]

Just now, Ogre said:

I’m embarrassed that my country can’t contain this like all of the other first world countries could.

When 1/3 of the country still thinks its a hoax.....