2020 Off-season gameplan

[Thorner]

50 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

With how the last couple days went, I’m really hoping there’s a greater plan behind this. I’m really hoping not qualifying Kahun was for saving money for the deal I was told about. I’m really doubting it at this point but it would be amazing if it were to happen. Maybe, just maybe they picked Quinn because they expected a crowded center room in the near future, one where Rossi wouldn’t fit well, and an empty RW room, where maybe Thompson, Quinn, and JJP can compete in the future. This is all a bizarre hope at this point, but I desperately want it to come true.

So it was Monahan and Gaudreau? With Reino going out?

Edited October 8, 2020 by Thorny

[Gabrielor]

8 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

I wanted Rossi too but Quinn is a star prospect as well.  52 goals in junior driving his own line.  If the guy can be a 40 goal scorer who is strong defensively then that is a star player.

We passed on a guy who I'd say is about an 85% chance of being Brayden Point, 15% chance of being Tyson Jost, for a guy who's about a 30% to be Pastrnak, 35% chance to be Kyle Palmieri, 35% chance to be Drew Stafford.

 

The draft is all a probability game, and we chose poorly.

[Gabrielor]

6 hours ago, Thorny said:

So it was Monahan and Gaudreau? With Reino going out?

Eichel - Monahan - Staal - Lazar/Ruotsalainen is....a weird center spine. A lot of offense. Not a lot of PK, d-zone-draw strength...

[nfreeman]

1 hour ago, Gabrielor said:

We passed on a guy who I'd say is about an 85% chance of being Brayden Point, 15% chance of being Tyson Jost, for a guy who's about a 30% to be Pastrnak, 35% chance to be Kyle Palmieri, 35% chance to be Drew Stafford.

 

The draft is all a probability game, and we chose poorly.

The bolded is nuts.

[Gabrielor]

51 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

The bolded is nuts.

Time will tell. 

 

I had him as the 3rd best player in the draft, near guaranteed star 1st-liner.

[Flashsabre]

2 hours ago, Gabrielor said:

We passed on a guy who I'd say is about an 85% chance of being Brayden Point, 15% chance of being Tyson Jost, for a guy who's about a 30% to be Pastrnak, 35% chance to be Kyle Palmieri, 35% chance to be Drew Stafford.

 

The draft is all a probability game, and we chose poorly.

This is an angry response, not a rational one.  You can love Rossi, I liked him and wanted him at 8 but let’s not get crazy.  There is no guarantee that a 5’9 centre becomes a superstar and that a 50 goal scorer that drove his own line becomes a bum.

[dudacek]

Nick Cousins wasn't qualified by Vegas: a cheap defensive centre option in free agency?

[Gabrielor]

1 hour ago, Flashsabre said:

This is an angry response, not a rational one.  You can love Rossi, I liked him and wanted him at 8 but let’s not get crazy.  There is no guarantee that a 5’9 centre becomes a superstar and that a 50 goal scorer that drove his own line becomes a bum.

??? Who has the angry response here? I'm just fine. Meanwhile...

"and that a 50 goal scorer that drove his own line becomes a bum."

30% Pastrnak   superstar

35% Palmieri  great, consistent winger

35% Stafford sketchy, inconsistent, but still top 6 in his prime, winger

No bums there. Have a nice day!

[Curt]

4 hours ago, Gabrielor said:

We passed on a guy who I'd say is about an 85% chance of being Brayden Point, 15% chance of being Tyson Jost, for a guy who's about a 30% to be Pastrnak, 35% chance to be Kyle Palmieri, 35% chance to be Drew Stafford.

 

The draft is all a probability game, and we chose poorly.

I love Rossi and would definitely have drafted him at 8.  I had him as the 3rd best prospect in this class.  Even I think your percentages are crazy off.

[sabresparaavida]

4 hours ago, Gabrielor said:

Eichel - Monahan - Staal - Lazar/Ruotsalainen is....a weird center spine. A lot of offense. Not a lot of PK, d-zone-draw strength...

Definitely not a ton of Dzone strength/PK strength, but you may still be able to make it work. I think lines would be something like: 

Skinner-Eichel-Thompson

Gadreau-Monahan-Cozens?

Ruotsalainen? - Staal - Olofsson? 
 

defensive UFA/lazar - lazar/defensive UFA- Okposo 

Could even be 2 defensive UFA there, and Lazar as 13th forward. 

[Gabrielor]

5 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

Definitely not a ton of Dzone strength/PK strength, but you may still be able to make it work. I think lines would be something like: 

Skinner-Eichel-Thompson

Gadreau-Monahan-Cozens?

Ruotsalainen? - Staal - Olofsson? 
 

defensive UFA/lazar - lazar/defensive UFA- Okposo 

You'll need to find a Larsson, and quick.

 

I'd roll

Olof Eichel Some-Defensive-Presence (I'd keep Olof with Eichel)

Skinner Staal Cozens (vet vet youth + Staal & Skinner familiarity)

Gaudreau Monahan Thompson (boy oh boy, let them feast)

Lazar New-Larsson Okposo (Lazar could fill Girgensons role pretty easily, you just need that consistent defense center, because this line will see very heavy d zone)

 

Yeah, I'd be pretty excited about that offensive power.

 

Edited October 8, 2020 by Gabrielor

[Flashsabre]

1 hour ago, sabresparaavida said:

Definitely not a ton of Dzone strength/PK strength, but you may still be able to make it work. I think lines would be something like: 

Skinner-Eichel-Thompson

Gadreau-Monahan-Cozens?

Ruotsalainen? - Staal - Olofsson? 
 

defensive UFA/lazar - lazar/defensive UFA- Okposo 

Could even be 2 defensive UFA there, and Lazar as 13th forward. 

So was this the deal you were sitting on?  Something like Monahan+Gaudreau for Reinhart+Risto/Montour+

[sabresparaavida]

Yeah, pretty much. The deal was before the bubble, so I don’t know how the performance affected the FO outlook on the team. It was going to be Gadreau+Monahan for Reinhart and one of Risto/Montour, as well as picks/prospects. This would be about the trade I would think would happen if it did happen. 
 

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1997903

 

It is a lot to give up, but with the now high quality RWs in the system to eventually fix the hole left by Reinhart. I think this would really accelerate our timeline into highly competitive, now. Fix the goaltending, and you may have a contender. 

[JohnC]

54 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

Yeah, pretty much. The deal was before the bubble, so I don’t know how the performance affected the FO outlook on the team. It was going to be Gadreau+Monahan for Reinhart and one of Risto/Montour, as well as picks/prospects. This would be about the trade I would think would happen if it did happen. 
 

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1997903

 

It is a lot to give up, but with the now high quality RWs in the system to eventually fix the hole left by Reinhart. I think this would really accelerate our timeline into highly competitive, now. Fix the goaltending, and you may have a contender. 

A lot of interesting maneuvers. But I don't foresee such a dramatic change because I don't believe that the Sabres will be spending to the cap. The internal cap will probably be around the mid 70s M, if that. So one or two of the higher priced players you added will probably be substituted for mid-priced players. Under normal economic circumstances your shuffling of players would be much more plausible. 

[Gabrielor]

2 hours ago, sabresparaavida said:

Yeah, pretty much. The deal was before the bubble, so I don’t know how the performance affected the FO outlook on the team. It was going to be Gadreau+Monahan for Reinhart and one of Risto/Montour, as well as picks/prospects. This would be about the trade I would think would happen if it did happen. 
 

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1997903

 

It is a lot to give up, but with the now high quality RWs in the system to eventually fix the hole left by Reinhart. I think this would really accelerate our timeline into highly competitive, now. Fix the goaltending, and you may have a contender. 

Holy ***** haha. I was right on the money then.

[Flashsabre]

3 hours ago, sabresparaavida said:

Yeah, pretty much. The deal was before the bubble, so I don’t know how the performance affected the FO outlook on the team. It was going to be Gadreau+Monahan for Reinhart and one of Risto/Montour, as well as picks/prospects. This would be about the trade I would think would happen if it did happen. 
 

https://www.capfriendly.com/armchair-gm/team/1997903

 

It is a lot to give up, but with the now high quality RWs in the system to eventually fix the hole left by Reinhart. I think this would really accelerate our timeline into highly competitive, now. Fix the goaltending, and you may have a contender. 

That would be something but none of it would matter if the goalie tandem is the same.  I think in that case you would have to not sign Toffoli and use some of that money on an upgrade in net and a cheaper winger (like a Craig Smith)

 

And one question: was this a Botts deal or was it all Adams after he came in?

Edited October 9, 2020 by Flashsabre

[Rasmus_]

Wallmark and Wennberg.  Those are two guys I'd be after for bottom six center roles.  Depending on what happens with Larsson. 

[dudacek]

Under-the-radar quote from Ralph on the Instigators this morning while talking about Cozens starting on the wing and later moving to centre.

"We're really. lining up here to potentially have in our top 12 forwards six players who can play centre which is a goal I've always had as a coach...which is something we didn't have at a lot of times last year."

First of all, that's interesting in terms of philosophy, but second of all, it makes for some interesting math:

• Last year: Jack, Larry (for sure) Mojo, Casey, Sobotka, Lazar, Asplund (maybe)
• This year: Jack, Staal (for sure) Casey, Lazar, Asplund, Cozens (maybe)

You tell me how that adds up to six this year if it didn't last year? If he's thinking Sam or Zemgus, well they were here last year and they didn't play centre.

To me, the math says that means they are adding at least one centre, and possibly two.

Edited October 9, 2020 by dudacek

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Under-the-radar quote from Ralph on the Instigators this morning while talking about Cozens starting on the wing and later moving to centre.

"We're really. lining up here to potentially have in our top 12 forwards six players who can play centre which is a goal I've always had as a coach...which is something we didn't have at a lot of times last year."

First of all, that's interesting in terms of philosophy, but second of all, it makes for some interesting math:

• Last year: Jack, Larry (for sure) Mojo, Casey, Sobotka, Lazar, Asplund (maybe)
• This year: Jack, Staal (for sure) Casey, Lazar, Asplund, Cozens (maybe)

You tell me how that adds up to six this year if it didn't last year? If he's thinking Sam or Zemgus, well they were here last year and they didn't play centre.

To me, the math says that means they are adding at least one centre, and possibly two.

Ya, if he's counting Reinhart, probably 5 last year and 6 this year would mean 1 more add. 

Aside from injuries I'm kind of assuming they felt they had at least 4 on the roster last year so as to have a full compliment (Eichel, Johansson, Larsson, Lazar/Mittelstadt), and then perhaps considered one more an option. 

So now it's Eichel, Staal, Cozens, Lazar, perhaps Reinhart, and we'll need one more add unless he thinks one of Asplund, Casey, or Girgs will develop into one this year, but I doubt they think that/are counting on that. Doomsday would be Casey, with Cozens being the addition that makes 6.

But I think/hope we are getting one more and ya two could be possible depending on Sam. I said in another thread the C addition pushes Lazar to 13th man but really, it probably sends Mittelstadt there, probably to be replaced by more of a bench rider. 

Edited October 9, 2020 by Thorny

[Weave]

6 hours ago, dudacek said:

Under-the-radar quote from Ralph on the Instigators this morning while talking about Cozens starting on the wing and later moving to centre.

"We're really. lining up here to potentially have in our top 12 forwards six players who can play centre which is a goal I've always had as a coach...which is something we didn't have at a lot of times last year."

First of all, that's interesting in terms of philosophy, but second of all, it makes for some interesting math:

• Last year: Jack, Larry (for sure) Mojo, Casey, Sobotka, Lazar, Asplund (maybe)
• This year: Jack, Staal (for sure) Casey, Lazar, Asplund, Cozens (maybe)

You tell me how that adds up to six this year if it didn't last year? If he's thinking Sam or Zemgus, well they were here last year and they didn't play centre.

To me, the math says that means they are adding at least one centre, and possibly two.

Missing Girgensons.

[Gabrielor]

8 hours ago, Flashsabre said:

That would be something but none of it would matter if the goalie tandem is the same.  I think in that case you would have to not sign Toffoli and use some of that money on an upgrade in net and a cheaper winger (like a Craig Smith)

 

And one question: was this a Botts deal or was it all Adams after he came in?

I'm almost positive it was a Botterill deal. I got told that last night by a friend.

[LabattBlue]

My wish list...

1 - Backup goalie upgrade.  Too many good choices on the market that are better than Hutton.  Buy him out, send to Rochester, or give him the Moulson treatment...I don’t care. 
 

2 - Physical 3rd pairing LD. 
 

3 - A 3C who is defensively sound and can pitch in 30-35 points.

 

4 - A 4C who is a pest and a good PK’er.  There should be one out there for 1-1.5mil. 

[Gabrielor]

3 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

My wish list...

1 - Backup goalie upgrade.  Too many good choices on the market that are better than Hutton.  Buy him out, send to Rochester, or give him the Moulson treatment...I don’t care. 
 

2 - Physical 3rd pairing LD. 
 

3 - A 3C who is defensively sound and can pitch in 30-35 points.

 

4 - A 4C who is a pest and a good PK’er.  There should be one out there for 1-1.5mil. 

Mine's a little longer (including a Risto/Montour trade, a Dahlin partner(Savard), and top 6 forwardf add), but I fully agree with 1-3. 2 in particular is the most important add of the day. 4 could be tougher because of bodies and rumored internal cap though.

[LabattBlue]

5 minutes ago, Gabrielor said:

Mine's a little longer (including a Risto/Montour trade, a Dahlin partner(Savard), and top 6 forwardf add), but I fully agree with 1-3. 2 in particular is the most important add of the day. 4 could be tougher because of bodies and rumored internal cap though.

You did remind me of one other thing...

 

Get rid of Montour. I dislike his game more than any other Sabre.   While RK neutered our franchise dman all season, Montour recklessly skated around the offensive zone every time I flipped a game on. 
 

 

[Flashsabre]

36 minutes ago, Gabrielor said:

Mine's a little longer (including a Risto/Montour trade, a Dahlin partner(Savard), and top 6 forwardf add), but I fully agree with 1-3. 2 in particular is the most important add of the day. 4 could be tougher because of bodies and rumored internal cap though.

Savard is a guy I have been hoping they would look at especially since the rumours are that Columbus has made him available.  Savard+ one of their goalies would be a huge move for the Sabres.