Trade: Wayne Simmonds to Sabres for a Conditional 2021 5th

[inkman]

6 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Murray pretty much had to take the guy who was more likely to turn out as a center, and that's Reinhart.  As Reinhart is *hardly* a bust, I don't think we can fault Murray for taking him over Drasaitl.

He was the safe pick. Thank God we didn't get Bennett.  

[Taro T]

12 minutes ago, inkman said:

He was the safe pick. Thank God we didn't get Bennett.  

Yep.

And Draisatl had concerns about his skating.  It picked up quite a bit (or those criticizing his skating were very wrong), but he definitely was viewed as having a significantly lower floor than Reinhart.  Sam definitely was the safe pick at 2.

[WildCard]

 

[DarthEbriate]

^ If we could get anything out of PP2 (or have Simmonds on PP1 and either rest Risto, or have him on 2), that'd be a significant boost to this team. Right now, the plan is Eichel or Olofsson or bust.

[pi2000]

14 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

I wasn't alive for the Super Bowls, but everyone I talk to resents Marv for constantly being outcoached in them and failing to win a super bowl with those absurdly talented rosters

I was 18-22yo for those Super Bowls.   This is the first I've heard the idea of Marv being outcoached in those games.    The first game is on Norwood.... the second SB against Washington is maybe the only game I would entertain the thought of Marv being out coached, but they played like hot garbage anyway... JK looked hungover, Thurman couldn't find his helmet, just a general lack of focus... which I could understand being partly Marv's fault.     The two losses against Dallas were because of turnovers, I don't blame Marv for that.... and Dallas had a great team too.    

[Randall Flagg]

9 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

I was 18-22yo for those Super Bowls.   This is the first I've heard the idea of Marv being outcoached in those games.    The first game is on Norwood.... the second SB against Washington is maybe the only game I would entertain the thought of Marv being out coached, but they played like hot garbage anyway... JK looked hungover, Thurman couldn't find his helmet, just a general lack of focus... which I could understand being partly Marv's fault.     The two losses against Dallas were because of turnovers, I don't blame Marv for that.... and Dallas had a great team too.    

They did indeed blame the lack of team focus every year on Marv. 

And I don't think it's sufficient to blame Norwood for SB 25. They were playing against the backup QB and let the Giants' ball control cripple the things they were good at all season. Then, i've heard a lot about horrible time management on the last drive. 

Also, everything I see indicates that 47 yards on grass was absurd to expect out of Norwood at the time. It was at the far end of his range on turf. Better execution and clock management could have easily made it a more manageable kick 

Edited February 25, 2020 by Randall Flagg

[WildCard]

I always heard

1st: Marv incredibly outcoached vs Parcells and Belicheck

2nd: Redkins were a train nobody was stopping

3rd: Same with Dallas

4th: Marv outcoached again via halftime adjustments

[shrader]

Meanwhile, the Sabres traded for Wayne Simmonds

[WildCard]

Just now, shrader said:

Meanwhile, the Sabres traded for Wayne Simmonds

It was only 3 posts lol

[Curt]

1 hour ago, Derrico said:

I love me Sam Reinhart but it sure looks like Drasaitl should have been that second overall pick in 2014.  Can I blame EXGMTM for that too?

Looks like he should have been picked 1st really.

[pi2000]

39 minutes ago, WildCard said:

I always heard

1st: Marv incredibly outcoached vs Parcells and Belicheck

2nd: Redkins were a train nobody was stopping

3rd: Same with Dallas

4th: Marv outcoached again via halftime adjustments

Marv was known for making quality halftime adjustments during those years... they won a ton of games by coming back in the second half.... so I definitely don't see "halftime adjustments" as a weakness of his... it was, in fact, a strength.   

I agree about the Redskins that year, they were on a heater.

The 4th Super Bowl they were up at halftime, IIRC driving the ball to start the second-half when Thurman fumbled.    If he hangs on to the ball there and they put up some points, then it's a completely different game.    That fumble was a crushing metnal blow to team who lost 3 SB in a row, and put up 7 or 8 turnovers in the previous SB.    They just could not mentally overcome that fumble... even the fans know the game was over at that point.

[SABRES 0311]

2 hours ago, WildCard said:

 

I’m guessing PP1. Right in front of the goalie. As for ES I’d guess with Skinner and MOJO. What’s our third line since Sheary and ERod are Pittsburgh’s problem? Kahun, Asplund and Lazar? Should I change that to fourth line?

[erickompositör72]

3 minutes ago, SABRES 0311 said:

I’m guessing PP1. Right in front of the goalie. As for ES I’d guess with Skinner and MOJO. What’s our third line since Sheary and ERod are Pittsburgh’s problem? Kahun, Asplund and Lazar? Should I change that to fourth line?

I actually prefer Risto there. Risto has shown some play making ability with the puck down-low and in tight. Perhaps Simmonds on PP2?

[SABRES 0311]

Just now, erickompositör72 said:

I actually prefer Risto there. Risto has shown some play making ability with the puck down-low and in tight. Perhaps Simmonds on PP2?

Yeah I thought about that too. I’m not a fan of dmen playing forward but PP is a different beast than ES. 

[spndnchz]

3 minutes ago, erickompositör72 said:

I actually prefer Risto there. Risto has shown some play making ability with the puck down-low and in tight. Perhaps Simmonds on PP2?

I liked on one of the last PP, Jack had Risto standing in front, looking at Jack, Jack takes the shot and Risto didn’t even look back. He knew Jack scored. Lol

[Randall Flagg]

I'd put Simmonds in Risto's spot (if he looks good there in practice) just because we need a rested Risto if we want to do something down the stretch. 

[WildCard]

43 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I'd put Simmonds in Risto's spot (if he looks good there in practice) just because we need a rested Risto if we want to do something down the stretch. 

Not that Risto is bad at it, but Simmonds is probably better at it anyways 

Edited February 25, 2020 by WildCard

[Kristian]

20 minutes ago, WildCard said:

Not that Risto is bad at it, but Simmons is probably better at it anyways 

Simmonds might be slightly better at pissing off the opposing goalie, he used to piss me off when he was with the Flyers.

Edited February 25, 2020 by Kristian

[Randall Flagg]

26 minutes ago, WildCard said:

Not that Risto is bad at it, but Simmons is probably better at it anyways 

That's what I figure.

[DarthEbriate]

27 minutes ago, Kristian said:

Simmonds might be slightly better at pissing off the opposing goalie, he used to piss me off when he was with the Flyers.

Just having the offensive awareness and years of practice of deflections on net, plus the drive to the net mindset --- it'll be good. As we saw last game and many times this season, if the goalie can't see for even a moment, Jack (or Olofsson) is going to pull the trigger and likely bury it.

[Huckleberry]

Kahun should get a spot on PP2.     Skinner - Mojo - Kahun or Skinner - Kahun - Okposo ( he does have that nice shot from the right circle).

[Taro T]

3 hours ago, SABRES 0311 said:

I’m guessing PP1. Right in front of the goalie. As for ES I’d guess with Skinner and MOJO. What’s our third line since Sheary and ERod are Pittsburgh’s problem? Kahun, Asplund and Lazar? Should I change that to fourth line?

Would expect, as you do, that Simmonds takes Ristolainen's spot on PP1 as the net front presence.  Which then gives Krueger the option of either letting Risto fill that role on PP2 or, even better, reduce his ice time back to a more manageable 22 or so minutes from where it creeps up to when Krueger runs only 6 D.

If the 2nd scoring line ends up Skinner-Johansson-Simmonds as it was at practice today, that makes the 3rd scoring (2nd checking?) line Kahun-Lazar-Vesey and Frolik becomes the spare.

If Frolik does in fact move to the press box regularly, then the net effect of the Scandella trade and this Pens trade is swapping Skinner from line 3 to line 2, sliding Sheary's replacement onto the 3rd line and moving Miller from the press box to the Dahlin pairing.

Are the Sabres better with Miller and Kahun playing than they were with Scandella and Sheary?  If so, the trades net out positive but it does make the Frolik trade more painful as the 4th and cap space would seem to be even more valuable than Frolik seemed to be prior to the trade deadline.

[FogBat]

2 hours ago, DarthEbriate said:

Just having the offensive awareness and years of practice of deflections on net, plus the drive to the net mindset --- it'll be good. As we saw last game and many times this season, if the goalie can't see for even a moment, Jack (or Olofsson) is going to pull the trigger and likely bury it.

No "love" button, but Awesome will do.

[SABRES 0311]

28 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Would expect, as you do, that Simmonds takes Ristolainen's spot on PP1 as the net front presence.  Which then gives Krueger the option of either letting Risto fill that role on PP2 or, even better, reduce his ice time back to a more manageable 22 or so minutes from where it creeps up to when Krueger runs only 6 D.

If the 2nd scoring line ends up Skinner-Johansson-Simmonds as it was at practice today, that makes the 3rd scoring (2nd checking?) line Kahun-Lazar-Vesey and Frolik becomes the spare.

If Frolik does in fact move to the press box regularly, then the net effect of the Scandella trade and this Pens trade is swapping Skinner from line 3 to line 2, sliding Sheary's replacement onto the 3rd line and moving Miller from the press box to the Dahlin pairing.

Are the Sabres better with Miller and Kahun playing than they were with Scandella and Sheary?  If so, the trades net out positive but it does make the Frolik trade more painful as the 4th and cap space would seem to be even more valuable than Frolik seemed to be prior to the trade deadline.

I keep forgetting about Vesey and I don’t know why. I still wouldn’t mind seeing Asplund get a couple more games.

[Taro T]

4 minutes ago, SABRES 0311 said:

I keep forgetting about Vesey and I don’t know why. I still wouldn’t mind seeing Asplund get a couple more games.

Wouldn't mind seeing Asplund some more either, but really doubt we see him again in Buffalo this season unless we see at least 2, if not 3, forwards go out injured.

But, especially if Girgensons and Larsson get re-signed, with Asplund ready to challenge for a spot, Lazar fitting in well in his very specific role, and Kahun presumably being pencilled into next years roster as well (to go along with Eichel, Skinner, Johansson, Reinhart, Olofsson, and Okposo who will all be back barring retirement) there is only room for 1 of Mittelstadt, Cozens, and Thompson to make the roster presuming Botterill lands a 2C.

Olofsson - Eichel - Reinhart

Skinner - 2C - Johansson/ Thompson / Kahun

Kahun - Mittelstadt / Johansson - Cozens / Thompson

Girgensons - Larsson - Okposo

Spare Lazar / Asplund

 

This doesn't even have Vesey coming back though Krueger trusts him and he'll be relatively cheap.  Could truly see Botterill only trade for a 2C and sign a FA goalie this off-season.  Could also see that being enough if they're both the right guys.