Non Sabres Deadline Trades/Rumors

[tom webster]

Was told over lunch yesterday that it’s 50/50 if anything gets done. JBOT is sticking to his price after the ROR fiasco. 

I’ve been told they have two deals in place. It all really hinges on Marner and Laine.

[Eleven]

2 minutes ago, tom webster said:

Was told over lunch yesterday that it’s 50/50 if anything gets done. JBOT is sticking to his price after the ROR fiasco. 

I’ve been told they have two deals in place. It all really hinges on Marner and Laine.

Mitch Marner has ruined this off-season.

35 minutes ago, tom webster said:

If you search hard, you will find this reported by a few, less then reputable “reporters” all using same, exact verbiage.

Oh, I do not accord any reliability to the tweet.  I just saw one is all.  

[...]

10 minutes ago, tom webster said:

Was told over lunch yesterday that it’s 50/50 if anything gets done. JBOT is sticking to his price after the ROR fiasco. 

I’ve been told they have two deals in place. It all really hinges on Marner and Laine.

I'm sure the answer is in this thread, and, of course, I'm familiar with the history of NHL roster activities over the summer, but I can't quite wrap my head around why a guy or two is/are stopping everything.

The conventional wisdom applies:

"As for the others, it feels like they’re waiting for one another to sign in order to gauge their worth. They all want to get paid what they’re worth and it’s helpful when you have other player’s contracts to compare to."  https://ham-sports.com/2019/09/01/september-1st-thoughts-training-camp-2-weeks-out-27-rfas-left/

Is this it? Really? Aren't there another 600+ contracts out there to compare with? It must be more involved than that to make sense.

[Randall Flagg]

21 minutes ago, ... said:

I'm sure the answer is in this thread, and, of course, I'm familiar with the history of NHL roster activities over the summer, but I can't quite wrap my head around why a guy or two is/are stopping everything.

The conventional wisdom applies:

"As for the others, it feels like they’re waiting for one another to sign in order to gauge their worth. They all want to get paid what they’re worth and it’s helpful when you have other player’s contracts to compare to."  https://ham-sports.com/2019/09/01/september-1st-thoughts-training-camp-2-weeks-out-27-rfas-left/

Is this it? Really? Aren't there another 600+ contracts out there to compare with? It must be more involved than that to make sense.

Say one of the teams involved is Winnipeg, whose defense is such that they would be interested in Ristolainen. 

Winnipeg has no idea if Laine is going to get a 2 year bridge deal at 6 per, or an 8 year deal at 11 per. Further, if they lose Laine, they might be less inclined to trade forwards for Risto, and more inclined to go for Gardiner, who is sitting pretty with interest from teams like Winnipeg, Buffalo, MTL perhaps. And if Laine gets a BIG contract, maybe suddenly Risto is not affordable for them at all. 

Jason is interested in Peg's offer, and is willing to let it play out before he moves on to a team like Anaheim. 

something like that hypothetical, maybe? 

[...]

3 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

Say one of the teams involved is Winnipeg, whose defense is such that they would be interested in Ristolainen. 

Winnipeg has no idea if Laine is going to get a 2 year bridge deal at 6 per, or an 8 year deal at 11 per. Further, if they lose Laine, they might be less inclined to trade forwards for Risto, and more inclined to go for Gardiner, who is sitting pretty with interest from teams like Winnipeg, Buffalo, MTL perhaps. And if Laine gets a BIG contract, maybe suddenly Risto is not affordable for them at all. 

Jason is interested in Peg's offer, and is willing to let it play out before he moves on to a team like Anaheim. 

something like that hypothetical, maybe? 

Appreciate the effort.  I get all of the mechanisms waiting to be sprung for a Buffalo-centric set of probable circumstances, and understand that the same mechanisms are set and under tension throughout the league.  That not a one has been sprung is what makes me wonder.

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, ... said:

Appreciate the effort.  I get all of the mechanisms waiting to be sprung for a Buffalo-centric set of probable circumstances, and understand that the same mechanisms are set and under tension throughout the league.  That not a one has been sprung is what makes me wonder.

All teams with RFAs have no idea how much they're going to pay them and if they can even afford it maybe? I saw something (posted here probably) that argued there literally isn't enough cap space in the league for what the explosion in contracts indicates for this batch of RFAs. And there are a lot of them, not just Marner/Laine. Tkachuk, Konecny, Werenski, Connor, etc. etc. 

[...]

6 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

All teams with RFAs have no idea how much they're going to pay them and if they can even afford it maybe? I saw something (posted here probably) that argued there literally isn't enough cap space in the league for what the explosion in contracts indicates for this batch of RFAs. And there are a lot of them, not just Marner/Laine. Tkachuk, Konecny, Werenski, Connor, etc. etc. 

I think I've seen that, too, and forgot about it. Maybe earlier this thread.  That is the best explanation and the only one that makes any sense.  

[rakish]

My memory is that it was a friend of Derrico's, without any actual text.

[Eleven]

36 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

All teams with RFAs have no idea how much they're going to pay them and if they can even afford it maybe? I saw something (posted here probably) that argued there literally isn't enough cap space in the league for what the explosion in contracts indicates for this batch of RFAs. And there are a lot of them, not just Marner/Laine. Tkachuk, Konecny, Werenski, Connor, etc. etc. 

I know I read a The Athletic article that held this theory.

Edited September 4, 2019 by Eleven

[shrader]

I'd be curious to see if there is a lot of overlap between the agents of these still unsigned RFAs.  I'd suspect a bit of collusion on their part.  And I don't mean to imply a negative spin with that term collusion, they're allowed to do it if they want.

[Derrico]

1 hour ago, ... said:

I think I've seen that, too, and forgot about it. Maybe earlier this thread.  That is the best explanation and the only one that makes any sense.  

They was my explanation and that’s exactly what’s happening.

1 hour ago, rakish said:

My memory is that it was a friend of Derrico's, without any actual text.

Absolutely correct that I stole it.  I have all of his work and it makes sense.  Wish there was a way to copy paste it easily or attach it somehow.  I’m really sad when it comes to technical aspects of anything.

[Thorner]

6 hours ago, tom webster said:

Was told over lunch yesterday that it’s 50/50 if anything gets done. JBOT is sticking to his price after the ROR fiasco. 

I’ve been told they have two deals in place. It all really hinges on Marner and Laine.

So because he sold low on a good player he's afraid to not maximize the return of a bad one. It's ass-backwards, ROR trade may not only cost us ROR but a Risto deal for the forward help we desperately need, as well. 

---

Is Botterill at the place among fans that he now has a pass for this season's results due to the RFA situation? Legitimately asking. Are we in a write-off year? Marner likely isn't starting the season. 

Edited September 4, 2019 by Thorny

[Thorner]

5 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

Say one of the teams involved is Winnipeg, whose defense is such that they would be interested in Ristolainen. 

Winnipeg has no idea if Laine is going to get a 2 year bridge deal at 6 per, or an 8 year deal at 11 per. Further, if they lose Laine, they might be less inclined to trade forwards for Risto, and more inclined to go for Gardiner, who is sitting pretty with interest from teams like Winnipeg, Buffalo, MTL perhaps. And if Laine gets a BIG contract, maybe suddenly Risto is not affordable for them at all. 

Jason is interested in Peg's offer, and is willing to let it play out before he moves on to a team like Anaheim. 

something like that hypothetical, maybe? 

I understand it's just a hypothetical, but having said that the Jets have no interest in a LT deal for Laine at what he would sign on the dotted line for. 

[Randall Flagg]

7 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I understand it's just a hypothetical, but having said that the Jets have no interest in a LT deal for Laine at what he would sign on the dotted line for. 

Which makes a lot of sense given the way he looked out there most of this year.

[nfreeman]

Evander Kane's nude photos sure seem to have made @Thorny frisky today, innit?

[TrueBlueGED]

3 hours ago, Thorny said:

So because he sold low on a good player he's afraid to not maximize the return of a bad one. It's ass-backwards, ROR trade may not only cost us ROR but a Risto deal for the forward help we desperately need, as well. 

---

Is Botterill at the place among fans that he now has a pass for this season's results due to the RFA situation? Legitimately asking. Are we in a write-off year? Marner likely isn't starting the season. 

This is essentially my concern. Botterill either learned the wrong lesson, or he learned the right lesson but he's applying it to the wrong player. 

[LGR4GM]

You know we don't have to trade him. I get the forward depth argument but even still. Not knowing that offer on the table, I think it's premature to be concerned when the season is a month away still. 

[WildCard]

I always forget if this guy is accurate or not but regardless...

 

[LGR4GM]

3 hours ago, Thorny said:

So because he sold low on a good player he's afraid to not maximize the return of a bad one. It's ass-backwards, ROR trade may not only cost us ROR but a Risto deal for the forward help we desperately need, as well. 

---

Is Botterill at the place among fans that he now has a pass for this season's results due to the RFA situation? Legitimately asking. Are we in a write-off year? Marner likely isn't starting the season. 

I think we should wait until the season to see how things change. The rfa stuff is not a pass, it's a reality. 

Just now, WildCard said:

I always forget if this guy is accurate or not but regardless...

 

Do not want. He's 1 dimensional and the league figured that out. 

[sweetlou]

22 hours ago, Curt said:

Risto for Mantha was something out there suggested as a possibility weeeks ago.  Not a rumor, just speculation.  I’m not putting any stock in it.

I would even add another prospect like Thompson or Smith knowing you are getting a proven top 6 winger. 

I would offer Risto, Larsson and Thompson for Mantha and Glendening and 2021 3rd rd pick.

 

[dudacek]

9 hours ago, tom webster said:

Was told over lunch yesterday that it’s 50/50 if anything gets done. JBOT is sticking to his price after the ROR fiasco. 

I’ve been told they have two deals in place. It all really hinges on Marner and Laine.

So can we infer the Marner aspect is tied to Gardiner? In that Gardiner wants to somehow be a Leaf but Marner’s situation is in the way and we are his fallback?

And are we comfortable with futures for Risto if we immediately sign Gardiner with the cap space created?

I’m thinking Risto for Roslovic and a second and Gardiner?

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I think we should wait until the season to see how things change. The rfa stuff is not a pass, it's a reality. 

Do not want. He's 1 dimensional and the league figured that out. 

For Risto, straight across?

[WildCard]

4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Do not want. He's 1 dimensional and the league figured that out. 

And expensive and lazy

Course those are all things people said about Ovi too

Edited September 5, 2019 by WildCard

[TrueBlueGED]

I don't love him, but I'd rather have Laine's one dimension than Risto's. 

[dudacek]

7 minutes ago, WildCard said:

I always forget if this guy is accurate or not but regardless...

 

Provorov and Werenski are intriguing targets, if true, although I would think either is worth more than Laine.

The RFA situation bears watching.

Edited September 5, 2019 by dudacek

[TrueBlueGED]

9 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

You know we don't have to trade him. I get the forward depth argument but even still. Not knowing that offer on the table, I think it's premature to be concerned when the season is a month away still. 

We don't have to trade him, but we do have to upgrade our top-6, and he's probably our most likely way to do it.