Buffalo Bills: 2020-2021

[Eleven]

Here's the thing.  I really don't care whether the Pegulas are "nice people" to work for.  I know that Tom Golisano wasn't.  I know Paul Snyder (Braves) wasn't and isn't.  I don't know about the Rigases or Knoxes.  As long as the Pegulas don't turn out to be Dan Snyder, all I care about is whether the team operations work well.

[That Aud Smell]

^
This is fair.

Thing is, if morale in business operations is low (awful), that is *not* a good omen for overall operational success. In fact, it would tend to predict more failure(s).

[Eleven]

Just now, That Aud Smell said:

^
This is fair.

Thing is, if morale in business operations is low (awful), that is *not* a good omen for overall operational success. In fact, it would tend to predict more failure(s).

I generally agree, but the Sabres had success under Golisano somehow.

[dudacek]

Massive layoffs and firings?

During a pandemic full of race riots?

Tied to a pair of sports franchises with long histories of failure?

 

There’s an obvious purge going on. It would impossible for there not to be morale issues and collateral damage.

The question is whether we are witnessing culture change, or the continued need for it?

[Weave]

33 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Massive layoffs and firings?

During a pandemic full of race riots?

Tied to a pair of sports franchises with long histories of failure?

 

There’s an obvious purge going on. It would impossible for there not to be morale issues and collateral damage.

The question is whether we are witnessing culture change, or the continued need for it?

An entire operational team walking out voluntarily is usually not planned culture change.

Edited August 29, 2020 by Weave

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, Weave said:

An entire operational team walking out voluntarily is usually not planned culture change.

Wasnt insinuating planned, but the idea of collateral damage is a possibility: group of employees sees itself as undervalued and not liking new direction they are seeing from struggling org.

Bosses not particularly valuing said group of employees, have different view on direction struggling org needs to take.

Frustrated employees leave.

I've lived it. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by dudacek

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

I generally agree, but the Sabres had success under Golisano somehow.

That guy knows how to build and run a business, though.

[inkman]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

That guy knows how to build and run a business, though.

With precise indifference 

[Broken Ankles]

4 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

Maybe @john wawrow will expand on this Tweet in a future report. 

I take these reports as a troubling sign.
 

 

It's a good thing PLAYERS win championships, and not organizations.   I wish my entire marketing department would quit.   When Marketing, as a department becomes essential to what it is that you produce,  the quality and sustainability of that product becomes questionable. 

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

With precise indifference 

I hear you. Believe me - I’m no fan. But the guy has a demonstrated ability to create, build, and run businesses. He appears to a huge a-hole. Excellent business execs often are.

50 minutes ago, Broken Ankles said:

It's a good thing PLAYERS win championships, and not organizations.   I wish my entire marketing department would quit.   When Marketing, as a department becomes essential to what it is that you produce,  the quality and sustainability of that product becomes questionable. 

Really? Players not organizations? Hmm. I understand the point, to a point. But having a well-run, operationally stable organization seems like the right starting point to building a winner.

@inkman: and to @PASabreFan’s frequent point: Maybe it’s better if the owner has a certain level of indifference to a pro sports team that s/he owns.

[nfreeman]

I'd be curious to know whether the group that left was brought in by Russ Brandon and/or whether it was targeted for downsizing/reassignment as a result of KA's organizational review (if that review included the Bills' front office -- not sure about that).

[inkman]

2 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

I hear you. Believe me - I’m no fan. But the guy has a demonstrated ability to create, build, and run businesses. He appears to a huge a-hole. Excellent business execs often are.

Really? Players not organizations? Hmm. I understand the point, to a point. But having a well-run, operationally stable organization seems like the right starting point to building a winner.

@inkman: and to @PASabreFan’s frequent point: Maybe it’s better if the owner has a certain level of indifference to a pro sports team that s/he owns.

We've found Jerry Krause.  Organizations win championships!!

[LTS]

23 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

^
This is fair.

Thing is, if morale in business operations is low (awful), that is *not* a good omen for overall operational success. In fact, it would tend to predict more failure(s).

It might predict failures in other groups who are not aligned with the direction the company is heading.  It doesn't mean there's a problem, it just means things are changing.  (I'm not sure we know enough to identify WHAT is going on however).

22 hours ago, Weave said:

An entire operational team walking out voluntarily is usually not planned culture change.

No, but accepted culture change sure.  I'm dealing with that right now. We have a team of 15 developers who signed up to do "start up" type work and are struggling with the changes that are being made as we go from "start up" to productization. The more rigorous controls and timelines we need to put on them are not settling well.  At this point we expect them to leave. We're not forcing them to leave. We don't want them to leave. We'll take a hit if they do leave.  However, we also need that team to operate differently than they have in the past and they might not be capable of doing so.

16 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I'd be curious to know whether the group that left was brought in by Russ Brandon and/or whether it was targeted for downsizing/reassignment as a result of KA's organizational review (if that review included the Bills' front office -- not sure about that).

Could be this.  When our company was going through downsizing and everyone feared for their jobs there were many who just up and left.  Get out while you can kind of thing. It might be that those 3 people end up starting their own company.  I've seen it happen.

I think, overall, there are clearly changes being made in PSE and those changes are net settling well.  It could very well be that Terry and Kim are the worst to work for.  We've certainly seen their public statements demonstrating an air of "let them eat cake".  I'm not totally inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. I suppose when it comes time to spend my money in a way that would benefit them I will consider the value of their enterprises and decide then.  Until then I will read the tea leaves with everyone else.

 

[tom webster]

6 hours ago, LTS said:

It might predict failures in other groups who are not aligned with the direction the company is heading.  It doesn't mean there's a problem, it just means things are changing.  (I'm not sure we know enough to identify WHAT is going on however).

No, but accepted culture change sure.  I'm dealing with that right now. We have a team of 15 developers who signed up to do "start up" type work and are struggling with the changes that are being made as we go from "start up" to productization. The more rigorous controls and timelines we need to put on them are not settling well.  At this point we expect them to leave. We're not forcing them to leave. We don't want them to leave. We'll take a hit if they do leave.  However, we also need that team to operate differently than they have in the past and they might not be capable of doing so.

Could be this.  When our company was going through downsizing and everyone feared for their jobs there were many who just up and left.  Get out while you can kind of thing. It might be that those 3 people end up starting their own company.  I've seen it happen.

I think, overall, there are clearly changes being made in PSE and those changes are net settling well.  It could very well be that Terry and Kim are the worst to work for.  We've certainly seen their public statements demonstrating an air of "let them eat cake".  I'm not totally inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. I suppose when it comes time to spend my money in a way that would benefit them I will consider the value of their enterprises and decide then.  Until then I will read the tea leaves with everyone else.

 

The whole “maintain our lifestyle” and “build my yacht” may go down as the most misunderstood narrative ever.

[inkman]

30 minutes ago, tom webster said:

The whole “maintain our lifestyle” and “build my yacht” may go down as the most misunderstood narrative ever.

Maybe.  The choice of words leaves a lot to be desired.  

[SwampD]

33 minutes ago, tom webster said:

The whole “maintain our lifestyle” and “build my yacht” may go down as the most misunderstood narrative ever.

I think the yacht is for sale, anyway.

[inkman]

5 minutes ago, SwampD said:

I think the yacht is for sale, anyway.

Shocker

[tom webster]

17 minutes ago, inkman said:

Maybe.  The choice of words leaves a lot to be desired.  

It was definitely a poorly worded slide and Ill advised presentation. 
Anyone with a modicum of business acumen knows what they were saying but even those that understand continue to go for the cheap laugh or easy shot to further the narrative.

 

[LTS]

15 hours ago, tom webster said:

The whole “maintain our lifestyle” and “build my yacht” may go down as the most misunderstood narrative ever.

Maybe that's why the marketing department left?

15 hours ago, tom webster said:

It was definitely a poorly worded slide and Ill advised presentation. 
Anyone with a modicum of business acumen knows what they were saying but even those that understand continue to go for the cheap laugh or easy shot to further the narrative.

 

No, that's a sympathetic view. In fact, your first statement and the beginning of your second are insulting to those who actually do have a modicum of business talent because anyone who has that modicum of business acumen knows that you don't do use those poorly worded slides and ill advised presentation. 

The yacht. The lifestyle. The "we have more information than fans" when defending the GM and then firing him.  The list is not as small as you'd like to make it.

I find your second sentence dismissive and insulting. To imbue my statement with "going for the cheap laugh or easy shot" is dismissive.  To insinuate that I have no business acumen, is insulting.

 

[tom webster]

2 minutes ago, LTS said:

Maybe that's why the marketing department left?

No, that's a sympathetic view. In fact, your first statement and the beginning of your second are insulting to those who actually do have a modicum of business talent because anyone who has that modicum of business acumen knows that you don't do use those poorly worded slides and ill advised presentation. 

The yacht. The lifestyle. The "we have more information than fans" when defending the GM and then firing him.  The list is not as small as you'd like to make it.

I find your second sentence dismissive and insulting. To imbue my statement with "going for the cheap laugh or easy shot" is dismissive.  To insinuate that I have no business acumen, is insulting.

 

Wasn’t talking about you personally but a presentation to its management staff is different then public statements and have nothing to do with their marketing staff.

For those of you that are unclear about the “lifestyle” quote, it was in reference to PSE and Harborcenter running as if there was an unlimited supply of cash there to cover up bad business decisions.

When they started some of these businesses the original staff was pretty much allowed to do whatever they saw fit with no regard for budget. Like any business, that was unsustainable and as business matures certain decisions have to be made and the business has to stand in its own. The “maintain our lifestyle” slide was meant to tell these people, enough is enough. Either these businesses can stand on their own, or they can’t. 
It’s a natural progression that was poorly presented and a lot of that employee morale, but not all of it, is because now people are expected to justify their existence.

[SwampD]

2 hours ago, tom webster said:

Wasn’t talking about you personally but a presentation to its management staff is different then public statements and have nothing to do with their marketing staff.

For those of you that are unclear about the “lifestyle” quote, it was in reference to PSE and Harborcenter running as if there was an unlimited supply of cash there to cover up bad business decisions.

When they started some of these businesses the original staff was pretty much allowed to do whatever they saw fit with no regard for budget. Like any business, that was unsustainable and as business matures certain decisions have to be made and the business has to stand in its own. The “maintain our lifestyle” slide was meant to tell these people, enough is enough. Either these businesses can stand on their own, or they can’t. 
It’s a natural progression that was poorly presented and a lot of that employee morale, but not all of it, is because now people are expected to justify their existence.

Your explanation of the use of the phrase makes it no less ridiculous. There’s just no defense of it.

The “narrative” is all of their own making. Maybe the slide should have said “Let them eat cake.”

EDIT: I missed LTS saying Let them eat cake. Great minds...

Edited August 31, 2020 by SwampD

[Wyldnwoody44]

[tom webster]

31 minutes ago, SwampD said:

Your explanation of the use of the phrase makes it no less ridiculous. There’s just no defense of it.

The “narrative” is all of their own making. Maybe the slide should have said “Let them eat cake.”

That is a complete mis-representation but we will just have to agree to disagree.

Show me any business where the owners say just keep spending money and don’t worry about the results and I’ll show you a business no longer in operation.

The “let them eat cake” reference implies they won’t pay for results and that’s not true. I’m not doing a good job of explaining it if you think the slide meant we have ours and we don’t care what you have.

If you believe it’s their job to keep PSE and HarborCenter run no natter what the losses are then we are in a completely different place.

Edited August 31, 2020 by tom webster

[SwampD]

25 minutes ago, tom webster said:

That is a complete mis-representation but we will just have to agree to disagree.

Show me any business where the owners say just keep spending money and don’t worry about the results and I’ll show you a business no longer in operation.

The “let them eat cake” reference implies they won’t pay for results and that’s not true. I’m not doing a good job of explaining it if you think the slide meant we have ours and we don’t care what you have.

If you believe it’s their job to keep PSE and HarborCenter run no natter what the losses are then we are in a completely different place.

No one is arguing the point you are trying to make. Using that phrase to make that point is indefensible, though.

 

Edited August 31, 2020 by SwampD

[tom webster]

56 minutes ago, SwampD said:

No one is arguing the point you are trying to make. Using that phrase to make that point is indefensible, though.

 

I’m not sure I’m arguing that either. My apologies if I offended anyone but I think some are arguing my point.