Jbot needs to go

[...]

Botterill makes Rob Ray sound like a Shakespearean actor.

[PerreaultForever]

9 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Show me proof of this. I don't believe it. Anyone who had even a rudimentary analytics understanding looked at that trade and barfed. It was all, well Tage and that first have to big for this to pay off. 

Sobotka was garbage. A good 2 way forward is ROR. 

If the only reason Tage was considered a future NHL player was because he was tall than that is completely stupid. Logan Stanley comes to mind. Being tall or big on its own doesn't mean anything. 

Sporting News, Blues get an A but we got a B+ so not that far off

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nhl/news/ryan-oreilly-trade-grades-details-sabres-blues-draft-picks-patrik-berglund/jb179og12xvh1dttn0s5c9g1i

Lots of fan based blog type reactions like this

https://www.diebytheblade.com/2018/7/3/17529032/buffalo-sabres-st-louis-blues-ryan-oreilly-trade-has-resulted-in-wide-range-of-opinions-on-the-deal

just quick examples. There were tons. Your "proof" is out there and you know it. 

TSN comments on TV as well. I remember McKenzie said it was good for both teams. Milbury or somebody on NBC said the same thing. You want to be Genius Hindsight go for it, but it's irrelevant in terms of arguing. If you were smarter than JBot at the time, prove that for me.

Only thing that matters is he is the GM so it's on him and he has to be held accountable for botching it. I'm sure we agree on that right?

[dudacek]

Botterill has refused to publicly commit to any sort of expectations for his team, but reading between the lines from several interviews I think he expected this team to be 15 to 20 points better than the previous year and on the playoff bubble.

His biggest miscalculations/disappointments this year:

1) Thinking he could get 80-90 goals from Skinner, Vesey, Sheary and Johansson

2) Thinking he could get significant development from Casey Mittelstadt, Victor Olofsson, and/or Tage Thompson

3) Thinking he could parlay his depth on defence into a trade to fill his holes up front.

What else?

[Torpedo Forecheck]

48 minutes ago, ... said:

Botterill makes Rob Ray sound like a Shakespearean actor.

Olivier

[Randall Flagg]

Schopp had some relatively tough questions in there. 

Jason touching on what we talked about a few days back - it's not as simple as taking a guy's goal column and assuming you'll continue to get that no matter what position you put them in on your team. I understand that Vesey, Sheary are below their goal scoring norms, but Jimmy was a second liner by ice time on the Rangers, scored goals in their transition-based offense, and was still mediocre enough that they were willing to part with him for a 3rd despite desperately needing depth scoring almost as bad as we do. We shoved him in our bottom six, where he's playing a different game. You can't just map the goal column anywhere you want, a huge part of NHL skill evaluation is taking into account development, role changes, potential chemistry. The fact that Jason has swung and missed so many times, as far as production taking a hit when these mediocre players hit our bottom six, tells me that he's just bad at doing it, rather than unlucky. 

Skinner is the only guy I'd really say isn't scoring as much as you'd expect him to on this team. Johansson, Vesey, Sheary, Sobotka since last year, Berglund last year, Thompson, Mitts, otherwise what these guys are giving us shouldn't have been surprising. Plenty more names if you go back to his first year

Edited February 5, 2020 by Randall Flagg

[TrueBlueGED]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

Botterill has refused to publicly commit to any sort of expectations for his team, but reading between the lines from several interviews I think he expected this team to be 15 to 20 points better than the previous year and on the playoff bubble.

His biggest miscalculations/disappointments this year:

1) Thinking he could get 80-90 goals from Skinner, Vesey, Sheary and Johansson

2) Thinking he could get significant development from Casey Mittelstadt, Victor Olofsson, and/or Tage Thompson

3) Thinking he could parlay his depth on defence into a trade to fill his holes up front.

What else?

I think you're right, and that's a perfect illustration of the problem. 

(If it's not clear, the GM is the problem) 

[dudacek]

4 hours ago, dudacek said:

Botterill has refused to publicly commit to any sort of expectations for his team, but reading between the lines from several interviews I think he expected this team to be 15 to 20 points better than the previous year and on the playoff bubble.

His biggest miscalculations/disappointments this year:

1) Thinking he could get 80-90 goals from Skinner, Vesey, Sheary and Johansson

2) Thinking he could get significant development from Casey Mittelstadt, Victor Olofsson, and/or Tage Thompson

3) Thinking he could parlay his depth on defence into a trade to fill his holes up front.

What else?

I have to add

4) thinking Carter Hutton could provide capable goaltending for 30-50 games.

[Thorner]

7 hours ago, dudacek said:

The boss sounding testy right now on WGR.

Basically called out (without naming names) Skinner, Sheary, Vesey and Johansson for not producing up to their track records.

 

Botterill *actually* thought his additions were the answer. It's unbelievable at this point. He absolutely needs to be fired. 

You are right, he did expect to be better this year with the roster he assembled. He just can't assemble a roster. Good grief. 

 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Thorny

[Thorner]

6 hours ago, dudacek said:

Botterill has refused to publicly commit to any sort of expectations for his team, but reading between the lines from several interviews I think he expected this team to be 15 to 20 points better than the previous year and on the playoff bubble.

His biggest miscalculations/disappointments this year:

1) Thinking he could get 80-90 goals from Skinner, Vesey, Sheary and Johansson

2) Thinking he could get significant development from Casey Mittelstadt, Victor Olofsson, and/or Tage Thompson

3) Thinking he could parlay his depth on defence into a trade to fill his holes up front.

What else?

Goaltending. Player deployment/coaching. The list goes on. What has he done right? 

[Wyldnwoody44]

It's time

[PerreaultForever]

47 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Goaltending. Player deployment/coaching. The list goes on. What has he done right? 

Jokiharju trade. But that's it. 

and it does not make up for the rest. 

Right now, it seems signing Evander Kane rather than bringing in Skinner would have even been better. Not great, but right now most people would say Kane is better than Skinner. I was on board with JBot when he got here, but now it's clear he's rubbish. We wont' know about his draft picks fully for a while but if they don't pan out he gives Murray a run for worst ever. 

[freester]

5 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Jokiharju trade. But that's it. 

and it does not make up for the rest. 

Right now, it seems signing Evander Kane rather than bringing in Skinner would have even been better. Not great, but right now most people would say Kane is better than Skinner. I was on board with JBot when he got here, but now it's clear he's rubbish. We wont' know about his draft picks fully for a while but if they don't pan out he gives Murray a run for worst ever. 

Kane’s contract is much better than Skinner and he provides a physical presence which we are desperately lacking. 

[LGR4GM]

Kane has 10 powerplay goals. Skinner has 0.  If Buffalo fixed their  powerplay it would help but it continues to be run like it is 2006. Cycle the puck the to the point, shoot or dish to halfwall, repeat. 

Yes I know SJS have a worse pp percentage overall. 

[WildCard]

7 hours ago, Thorny said:

 

Botterill *actually* thought his additions were the answer. It's unbelievable at this point. He absolutely needs to be fired. 

You are right, he did expect to be better this year with the roster he assembled. He just can't assemble a roster. Good grief. 

 

I mean of you gave them a ***** 2C they'd be fine 

[LGR4GM]

I'd probably fire Botts at this point. He built a roster that is deeply flawed and seems committed to doing nothing. 

[Doohicksie]

23 hours ago, #freejame said:

While in general I agree with you on all of this, I do seem to remember a few from TSN (?) saying it was a haul for Buffalo. Not many, but there’s always a few crazies. 

I don't.  I think a few tried to argue that the Sabres didn't get absolutely fleeced but we now

[shrader]

1 hour ago, freester said:

Kane’s contract is much better than Skinner and he provides a physical presence which we are desperately lacking. 

Kane was never going to stay.

[Doohicksie]

18 hours ago, SwampD said:

Risto never asked to be traded either. Just some Wormtongue Hamilton's leading questions spin BS. Both change of scenery questions came from him. You want the Sabres to improve?... Revoke PHam's locker room press pass.

Unknown whether he asked to be traded. 

John Wawrow wrote in September that "Ristolainen declined to say whether he has asked to be traded."

He looked like a beaten man on locker cleanout day and I think a lot of people linked it to the ROR "lost my passion for the game" remarks and made the leap of logic that he either would be traded or asked to be traded.

 

[Curt]

17 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

I don't.  I think a few tried to argue that the Sabres didn't get absolutely fleeced but we now

I do.  Some pro expert analysts said it was a good haul.

[TrueBlueGED]

2 minutes ago, Curt said:

I do.  Some pro expert analysts said it was a good haul.

Not just the analysts, but people here in this board were adding up the points for Berglund and Sobotka and saying we wouldn't lose much. 

[Doohicksie]

That was before the scales fell away from our eyes.

[WildCard]

46 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I'd probably fire Botts at this point. He built a roster that is deeply flawed and seems committed to doing nothing. 

Can't wait to go through the GM process again, those are always fun

[Radar]

If Botterill gets axed and replaced with another first timer I think I'll pull my hair out.

 

 

 

 

[WildCard]

2 minutes ago, Radar said:

If Botterill gets axed and replaced with another first timer I think I'll pull my hair out.

I don't even know who I'd want. Give me somebody from Boston I guess?

[Tondas]

JBOT (or the new GM plan).

1.  Get players in that can make Buffalo proud (and buy some time before rioting).  Tough guys, SOB's, fighters.  We won't win but it will buy some time with the passion and energy that Key Bank Center and the city needs.  This is the Sabre's identity.

2.  Draft well.  Prioritize big wingers that can score (or at least have speed).  Most goals are within 10 feet of the net.  Pin point accuracy not needed.

3.  Stop with the Sweden connection and look at the WHL.

4.  Sign FA's that augment number 1 until draft prospects are ready.

5.  Get a coach the will say, "Run' em" when needed.

6.  Fore check, hit, get puck to Jack, Skinner, and Olofsson.  Repeat as necessary.

7.  Get a first rate goalie.

8.  Don't touch the "Prince of Wales Trophy."

9.  Lift the Cup and pass it around.

 

 

 

Edited February 5, 2020 by Tondas