Around the NHL 2019-20

[Curt]

Does a brawl automatically make it a good hockey game?  If I feel like I need to see fights I’ll watch UFC.

[pi2000]

22 minutes ago, Curt said:

Does a brawl automatically make it a good hockey game? 

I, for one, would rather watch an emotionally charged physical game instead of a skills contest. 

And those two types of hockey are not mutually exclusive... unless you're the Sabres where both are prohibited.

Edited February 2, 2020 by pi2000

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

13 minutes ago, Curt said:

Does a brawl automatically make it a good hockey game?  If I feel like I need to see fights I’ll watch UFC.

As the old saying goes.....I went to the fights and a hockey game broke out. So until I can watch a UFC fight and see hockey at the same time......I'll stick to hockey and satisfy the neanderthal in me.

[Mustache of God]

21 minutes ago, Curt said:

Does a brawl automatically make it a good hockey game?  If I feel like I need to see fights I’ll watch UFC.

Not necessarily, but when brawls break out it means both teams are playing passionate, entertaining hockey. I'd rather see a game like this 1000x over the Sabres v Jackets snoozefest from yesterday. 

[Curt]

26 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

I, for one, would rather watch an emotionally charged physical game instead of a skills contest.

Yeah, sure, but a brawl isn’t emotionally charged, physical hockey.  It’s a bunch of guys on ice skates trying to punch each other without falling on their ass.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

31 minutes ago, Curt said:

Yeah, sure, but a brawl isn’t emotionally charged, physical hockey.  It’s a bunch of guys on ice skates trying to punch each other without falling on their ass.

To be quite honest with you, I can't stand UFC and think it's the most boring style of fighting. Any time I've had the unfortunate chance to experience it I've watched 2 guys spend 80% of the time on the mat with arms and legs wrapped around each other trying to keep one and other from fighting. I'd rather watch arm wrestling or lady's mud wrestling, LOL.

A good Ali/ Frazier fight or a Tyson fight.

[SABRES 0311]

Enroth is trying to find and buy back his World Cup mask. 

Edited February 2, 2020 by SABRES 0311

[Curt]

4 hours ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

To be quite honest with you, I can't stand UFC and think it's the most boring style of fighting. Any time I've had the unfortunate chance to experience it I've watched 2 guys spend 80% of the time on the mat with arms and legs wrapped around each other trying to keep one and other from fighting. I'd rather watch arm wrestling or lady's mud wrestling, LOL.

A good Ali/ Frazier fight or a Tyson fight.

You get that from time to time, but it’s relatively rare, especially for the highest level guys.

Just as boxing the quality of Ali Frazier is relatively rare.  I’ve seen a lot of snoozfest boxing matches too.

Edited February 3, 2020 by Curt

[PerreaultForever]

13 hours ago, Doohickie said:

Stylistically?  No.  But in the end effect, Skinner is effective at getting other teams off their games.  (or at least he was, prior to his injury)

I'm not seeing that. I think it's the other way around. other teams are effective at getting Skinner off his game. 

[PerreaultForever]

11 hours ago, Curt said:

Does a brawl automatically make it a good hockey game?  If I feel like I need to see fights I’ll watch UFC.

No, it's not about a brawl making it good. It's about the level of passion, the competitiveness.  Bring back a little more of the hate, as Burke said in the intermission. The building was electric, the fans were pumped, the teams went at it hard, and if a few fights break out, if a few players answer the bell, so be it. That too can be entertaining.

You'd rather have boring 2-1 games of nothingness, well, you're a fan of the right team I guess. 

Give me passion over what we see almost every night any time.

 

[Curt]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

No, it's not about a brawl making it good. It's about the level of passion, the competitiveness.  Bring back a little more of the hate, as Burke said in the intermission. The building was electric, the fans were pumped, the teams went at it hard, and if a few fights break out, if a few players answer the bell, so be it. That too can be entertaining.

You'd rather have boring 2-1 games of nothingness, well, you're a fan of the right team I guess. 

Give me passion over what we see almost every night any time.

I’m a fan of hockey played with passion and enthusiasm.  You can have that without fights, or with very very few of them at least.

The reaction that I’m responding to here was NOT “what a passionate, hard fought game, I love that kind of hockey!”

The reaction that I’m responding to WAS “Goalie fight!  That’s so awesome!”

[SwampD]

Cool!

Goalie fight!

That’s so awesome!

[Stoner]

Yep my peeper is small so I'll watch horsehung guys hit each other!

Edited February 3, 2020 by PASabreFan

[Brawndo]

 

[Eleven]

2 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

 

Why should they be allowed to circumvent the cap when other teams are stuck with albatross contracts?

[WildCard]

2 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

 

Bring back all of the Risto to Winnipeg rumors!

Just now, Eleven said:

Why should they be allowed to circumvent the cap when other teams are stuck with albatross contracts?

Chicago just blames their equipment, and NJ sends them to Siberia

[shrader]

Just now, Eleven said:

Why should they be allowed to circumvent the cap when other teams are stuck with albatross contracts?

Because they've already allowed other teams to do the same, like us with Berglund and the Devils with Kovalchuk.  I guess I'm ok with it except that the player should not be allowed to return during the life of that contract they violated.  The league missed that chance though when they allowed Kovalchuk to return.

[Eleven]

1 minute ago, shrader said:

Because they've already allowed other teams to do the same, like us with Berglund and the Devils with Kovalchuk.  I guess I'm ok with it except that the player should not be allowed to return during the life of that contract they violated.  The league missed that chance though when they allowed Kovalchuk to return.

Huh.  I didn't realize that Berglund wasn't counted against the Sabs' cap.  Interesting.  

[Curt]

27 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Why should they be allowed to circumvent the cap when other teams are stuck with albatross contracts?

Because both parties agree to terminate.  Byflygynnnnn (sic?) is agreeing to give up all the money he is owed.  He is technically in breach of contract.

Pretty similar to the berglund situation.

[shrader]

42 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Huh.  I didn't realize that Berglund wasn't counted against the Sabs' cap.  Interesting.  

There's cap recapture if the structure of the contract requires it, but that's it.  The Devils still have minimal amounts for Kovalchuk through 2025.

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, Eleven said:

Huh.  I didn't realize that Berglund wasn't counted against the Sabs' cap.  Interesting.  

That's why some of us were so adamant that the Sabres bring a 2C (or reasonable facsimile thereof) in last year after it was obvious Berglund really was done.  They gained the equivalent of about $4MM worth of full season cap space when he left and had a lot of flexibility to bring somebody in before the season sunk into the swamp just like the 1st 2 castles.

[PerreaultForever]

9 hours ago, Curt said:

I’m a fan of hockey played with passion and enthusiasm.  You can have that without fights, or with very very few of them at least.

The reaction that I’m responding to here was NOT “what a passionate, hard fought game, I love that kind of hockey!”

The reaction that I’m responding to WAS “Goalie fight!  That’s so awesome!”

It was funny. It was entertaining. Nothing more, nothing less. 

Sabres games often bore the heck out of me sad to say. 

[Curt]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

It was funny. It was entertaining. Nothing more, nothing less. 

Sabres games often bore the heck out of me sad to say. 

I do have some mixed emotions about it.  On one hand, yes, seeing other people fight is entertaining.  But on the other hand, I don’t think it should be something that we encourage as part of a game.

I acknowledge that it’s bound to happen occasionally when guys are really playing hard and emotions run high, but I also think that the league should take a tougher stance against it.  I wouldn’t mind seeing game misconducts for fighting, or suspensions for fighting X number of times in a season.

In the game above, for example:  Something happens, the goalie snaps and starts throwing, everyone on the ice grabs another guy, some throw, some just hold on.  Ok, fine, but there is no need for Talbot to come all the way from the other end just looking to get into it.

 

[PerreaultForever]

30 minutes ago, Curt said:

I do have some mixed emotions about it.  On one hand, yes, seeing other people fight is entertaining.  But on the other hand, I don’t think it should be something that we encourage as part of a game.

or discourage. Nobody's asking for nightly goalie fights or bench clearing brawls, but all of that stuff is part of the game and it is all entertaining when it happens and again, the bottom line is passion and excitement. I used to hate the staged tough guy fights of a few years back but when gloves get dropped in the heat of battle, that to me is part of the game and I love it.

30 minutes ago, Curt said:

I acknowledge that it’s bound to happen occasionally when guys are really playing hard and emotions run high, but I also think that the league should take a tougher stance against it.  I wouldn’t mind seeing game misconducts for fighting, or suspensions for fighting X number of times in a season.

They already have a tougher stance. Secondary fight during a fight so both players were ejected. That, imo, is more than tough enough. 

[pi2000]

54 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

or discourage. Nobody's asking for nightly goalie fights or bench clearing brawls, but all of that stuff is part of the game and it is all entertaining when it happens and again, the bottom line is passion and excitement. I used to hate the staged tough guy fights of a few years back but when gloves get dropped in the heat of battle, that to me is part of the game and I love it.

They already have a tougher stance. Secondary fight during a fight so both players were ejected. That, imo, is more than tough enough. 

The instigator rule, and to a lesser degree the half-shield requirement (and subsequent penalty for voluntarily taking your helmet off pre-fight), and penalty for not using your fight strap...  is why there is very little fighting these days.

I get it.   They're trying to make the game more marketable and get more kids playing and so forth, because after all, it's a business, they're trying to increase revenue.

However, that doesn't mean we all have to like it.   

When I was in my teens, coaches spent entire practices teaching the art of throwing a body-check, how to line a guy up, take the correct angle to give him nowhere to escape... etc... We would hit hard in practice.    Today, very very very little time is spent teaching kids how to body check.   My boys are 14 and 16, they both play at a high level, I've also coached and went through all the USA hockey coaching levels over the years.    USA hockey very clearly states they don't want players to finish their checks (if the puck is gone).   

When I played you would get benched if you peeled away from a guy instead of trying to put him through the boards.    Yeah it was to intimidate and that was part of the game, because the next time that guy got the puck he wouldn't be looking for an open teammate, he'd be more concerned about taking a hit and he'd cough up the puck or make an errant pass. 

That simply doesn't happen these days.   Players are more skilled sure, but they simply don't know how to throw a clean hit.    Gone are the Mike Peca's, he'd never sniff the NHL if he played today... and I"m not OK with that, because those guys brought energy and emotion to the game.   They stirred it up and got everyone going, now we see teams sleepwalk through several games at a time or entire seasons,, like robots programmed to stickhandle and skate and pass.    An absolute bore to watch IMO.   Shame.    

It just really bothers me the direction the game is going... It's catering to the wealthy well-off families who can afford to pay $500/wk for private skill lessons, while the under privileged hard nosed, blue-collar types who love hockey to death are passed over just because some silverspoon kid can stickhandle and shoot more accurately.     I probably wouldn't have gotten as far as I did in the sport if it was like that back then, my father could barely afford to put me in house league when I started out, never even took a private lesson, ever.     Gone are the days where you could "outwork" another kid to make a team.     Doesn't matter how many battles you win or checks you throw, the coach will ALWAYS take the kid who can skate, shoot and pass better.   They ripped the heart out of the game.

/rant

Edited February 4, 2020 by pi2000