Do you think Linus Ullmark will be elite

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Minnesota? 

Think about it.

[Thorner]

Dunno why we are doing Marty dirty. He had 230 wins in his career. Ullmark will need to average 23 a year until age 35 to tie him. 

[Taro T]

1 minute ago, Thorny said:

Dunno why we are doing Marty dirty. He had 230 wins in his career. Ullmark will need to average 23 a year until age 35 to tie him. 

What's dissing Biron in this?  Biron was typically the 21st-45th best goalie in the league - poor man's starter / top tier #2.  Could never lead a team to the SC, but if you just needed to stay in a game, he could let you do that.  Quite capably.  And he was very well liked in the room.

[Thorner]

6 minutes ago, Taro T said:

What's dissing Biron in this?  Biron was typically the 21st-45th best goalie in the league - poor man's starter / top tier #2.  Could never lead a team to the SC, but if you just needed to stay in a game, he could let you do that.  Quite capably.  And he was very well liked in the room.

That’s honestly a high standard for a prospective NHL goalie. To be among the 21-45 best goalies in the world for as long as he did is certainly something. 

Using him as a comparison for Linus who is 26 years old now and has proven nothing seems a little unfair to Marty. 

Ullmark would be LUCKY to have that career, it’s far more likely his utmost ceiling than a realistic expectation. 

It’s 75 wins to 24 thus far, comparing them both at age 26. 

Edited September 13, 2019 by Thorny

[Eleven]

3 hours ago, darksabre said:

I project Linus as Marty Biron 

I would consider that to be a success.

3 hours ago, Zamboni said:

Marty came to mind for me as well, but I thought better of it, because I think Marty was just more talented than Ullmark is/will be. Neither are/were elite.

I think so too.

[Taro T]

11 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I would consider that to be a success.

I think so too.

In fairness to Ullmark, he looked a lot better before Allen had had more than 1/2 a season to work with him.  And after about mid-season, he (and Hutton) were making the same sort of screw ups (such as over driving when moving laterally) that Lehner was known for prior to moving to the Island.  (And which he was still doing early last season.)

Biron got to work with a very good coach in Korn and a good one in Corsi.  Let's see what Linus can do when the goalie whisperer gets his hooks into him.

[Eleven]

22 minutes ago, Taro T said:

In fairness to Ullmark, he looked a lot better before Allen had had more than 1/2 a season to work with him.  And after about mid-season, he (and Hutton) were making the same sort of screw ups (such as over driving when moving laterally) that Lehner was known for prior to moving to the Island.  (And which he was still doing early last season.)

Biron got to work with a very good coach in Korn and a good one in Corsi.  Let's see what Linus can do when the goalie whisperer gets his hooks into him.

There's no reason not to be patient, but I don't think he's going to be quite as good as Marty Biron.  Hey, I'd love to be wrong on this one.

[Taro T]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

There's no reason not to be patient, but I don't think he's going to be quite as good as Marty Biron.  Hey, I'd love to be wrong on this one.

And if he doesn't end up quite as good as Biron but fills essentially the same role (placeholder when no top tier guy is ready and backup to (hopefully) a top tier guy when Luukkonnen (or other goalie) is ready) is it that far off to say he'll basically be Biron?

Would comparing expectations of him to Sauve be better?  (His and Biron's roles were similar and the results similar as well.)

[Doohicksie]

Yes.  The season hasn't started yet so I'm going with the unbridled enthusiasm answer.

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

And if he doesn't end up quite as good as Biron but fills essentially the same role (placeholder when no top tier guy is ready and backup to (hopefully) a top tier guy when Luukkonnen (or other goalie) is ready) is it that far off to say he'll basically be Biron?

Would comparing expectations of him to Sauve be better?  (His and Biron's roles were similar and the results similar as well.)

Let’s take an economic look at it.  Do you think that Ullmark would fetch the 31st draft pick in a trade? I do not see him rising to that level.

[MODO Hockey]

Well then, cant wait for him to prove you all wrong. 

 

[Eleven]

3 hours ago, Doohickie said:

Yes.  The season hasn't started yet so I'm going with the unbridled enthusiasm answer.

May Doohickie and his 53 Bicycles live on forever....

[Weave]

2 hours ago, MODO Hockey said:

Well then, cant wait for him to prove you all wrong. 

 

We all hope we're wrong.

[matter2003]

No. If he was going to he would have played like Bennington or even Hart from Philly when they got their chance...

He started out OK then faded rapidly

[Eleven]

32 minutes ago, matter2003 said:

No. If he was going to he would have played like Bennington or even Hart from Philly when they got their chance...

He started out OK then faded rapidly

I'm still not sure about Binnington.  He has all of the confidence in the world now, to be sure, and that is huge for a goalie.  But maybe a flash in the pan?  We've all seen those, too.  We will see.

[LGR4GM]

16 hours ago, Taro T said:

In fairness to Ullmark, he looked a lot better before Allen had had more than 1/2 a season to work with him.  And after about mid-season, he (and Hutton) were making the same sort of screw ups (such as over driving when moving laterally) that Lehner was known for prior to moving to the Island.  (And which he was still doing early last season.)

Biron got to work with a very good coach in Korn and a good one in Corsi.  Let's see what Linus can do when the goalie whisperer gets his hooks into him.

I keep thinking about the goalie coaching last year. I thought defensively we did okay keeping things to the outside but it seemed so many times our goalies overreacted to shots and never seemed to be quite where they should. Maybe the new goalie coach will be a massive upgrade. 

[darksabre]

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I keep thinking about the goalie coaching last year. I thought defensively we did okay keeping things to the outside but it seemed so many times our goalies overreacted to shots and never seemed to be quite where they should. Maybe the new goalie coach will be a massive upgrade. 

He will be.

[Stoner]

Millsie.

[Taro T]

19 hours ago, Eleven said:

Let’s take an economic look at it.  Do you think that Ullmark would fetch the 31st draft pick in a trade? I do not see him rising to that level.

He might eventually.  Biron wouldn't have at this point in his career but eventually did fetch that.

[Eleven]

15 hours ago, Taro T said:

He might eventually.  Biron wouldn't have at this point in his career but eventually did fetch that.

Like I said, I do not see him rising to that level.

[Kruppstahl]

No.  We need 2 new goalies going forward.

 

 

[Amerks8796]

4 pro seasons in NA, only one was any good. He’s a career backup at best. 

[SwampD]

I don’t think he will be elite.

I don’t think he will have to be.

I can’t think of an elite goalie in the past 10 years that made a difference,... maybe Fluery, to their team.

[Randall Flagg]

45 minutes ago, SwampD said:

I don’t think he will be elite.

I don’t think he will have to be.

I can’t think of an elite goalie in the past 10 years that made a difference,... maybe Fluery, to their team.

Price in 2014 and Bishop last year. 

Fun fact - the Dallas Stars had the worst forward depth scoring in the NHL last season. Not us, not the Oilers. Dallas.

Bishop's series against St. Louis was mind blowing, particularly that game 7 performance. 

I think each of those teams would have been bottom 6-7 teams without their goalies, and they won playoff series instead. 

Completely agree with your general point that it's very rare.

Edit: I was mistaken, Dallas' depth scoring was a little bit better than Edmonton, but just Edmonton.

Edited September 16, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[SwampD]

1 minute ago, Randall Flagg said:

Price in 2014 and Bishop last year. 

Fun fact - the Dallas Stars had the worst forward depth scoring in the NHL last season. Not us, not the Oilers. Dallas.

Bishop's series against St. Louis was mind blowing, particularly that game 7 performance. 

I think each of those teams would have been bottom 6-7 teams without their goalies, and they won playoff series instead. 

Completely agree with your general point that it's very rare.

Forgot about Price. He has always made a difference to his team.