Does Risto want out?

[rakish]

  On 8/22/2019 at 3:45 PM, Brawndo said:

I wonder if Eric Tulsky was running Carolina’s Draft. They went very heavy on players the analytics crowd loved in rounds 2-7. 

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I thought the analytics crowd was watching who McKenzie likes? I've thought NJ's and Toronto's draft were selected by analytics for years, NJ after the first round by a poker player for a while, all of Toronto. I think Toronto has changed who runs the draft, it's not very similar to mine anymore, maybe it was just coincidence.

As far as Carolina's 2019 draft, among 17 year olds, I have Suzuki 21, Murray 22, Rizzo 26, Heinola was good at age 17, age 16, not so much. Slepits I have at 47 among 19 year olds. So yeah, it indicates to me that an analytic was selecting those guys, but conversely they chose people in my 100's(Fensore), so it's not my model. I'm guessing that they draft like I guess NJ has been drafting, the analytic got the 3rd round on.

Carolina also recently traded for Kyle Wood who my model has loved for years.

[WildCard]

 

[Derrico]

  On 9/12/2019 at 1:22 PM, WildCard said:

 

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This is great.  I've been waiting to see what quotes we would get from Risto on Day 1 and he's saying all of the right things.  Either way it's bad news if he started off saying he would like to move on or something.  Then we either trade him for an even further depressed value or we keep him and it's hanging over the team all season.

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 4:01 PM, Derrico said:

This is great.  I've been waiting to see what quotes we would get from Risto on Day 1 and he's saying all of the right things.  Either way it's bad news if he started off saying he would like to move on or something.  Then we either trade him for an even further depressed value or we keep him and it's hanging over the team all season.

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I disagreed with you in the other thread and will here as well. Almost all players say what he said. It means nothing. He's not going to show up in Buffalo and be like "yea I was hoping to move on and hope a trade happens". That just was never going to be what happened. 

 

The only interesting part was how he didn't answer the question about if he had asked for a trade. He clearly talked to Botterill about it, unsure of if he directly asked but there was a conversation. 

Edited September 12, 2019 by LGR4GM

[bob_sauve28]

I was down and pissed off too, but I'm reading to work! 

 

Glad Risto is still here! ?

[Derrico]

  On 9/12/2019 at 4:03 PM, LGR4GM said:

I disagreed with you in the other thread and will here as well. Almost all players say what he said. It means nothing. He's not going to show up in Buffalo and be like "yea I was hoping to move on and hope a trade happens". That just was never going to be what happened. 

 

The only interesting part was how he didn't answer the question about if he had asked for a trade. He clearly talked to Botterill about it, unsure of if he directly asked but there was a conversation. 

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I will say the same here as the other thread.  I disagree with your take.  There are so many athletes who voice their real opinions to the media.

[North Buffalo]

Risto wants to win... despite his faults a motivated Risto can be a force if there is a team around him.

[Radar]

Let's not repeat the ROR thing. Players get frustrated losing and say things that fans don't want to hear. Let's not live in a fantasy land about it. 

[...]

Maybe Risto is thinking to himself "it'd worked for O'Reilly, what'd I do wrong?"

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 3:54 PM, Derrico said:

This is a very very good sign.  He’s not coming out demanding a trade or anything along those lines.  Saying all the right things.

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  On 9/12/2019 at 4:01 PM, LGR4GM said:

Just like every single other player ever. I don't think it is a sign of anything other than playing the game. 

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  On 9/12/2019 at 4:25 PM, Derrico said:

No it's not.  Many have publicly said they want out.  Risto isn't doing that.  Ofcourse there is still the game to be played out and he may get moved but there are many athletes who have chosen to not keep their mouth shut about it.

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It is rare for a player to publicly state in the NHL they want out. He's saying nothing of real value other than I am here so I will play here. Again, he wasn't going to show up and bitch. That isn't because he is just excited to be here, it is just who he is. His comments were basically that he talked with Botterill, the subtext is for a trade, but nothing has happened so he is happy to be back playing hockey. It was the blandest response he could have given. 

[Thorner]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:11 PM, Radar said:

Let's not repeat the ROR thing. Players get frustrated losing and say things that fans don't want to hear. Let's not live in a fantasy land about it. 

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This is exactly what I’m worried Botterill is too focused on. Gun-shy about trading a poor player because he botched the move of a good one. 

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:36 PM, Thorny said:

This is exactly what I’m worried Botterill is too focused on. Gun-shy about trading a poor player because he botched the move of a good one. 

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If he is so worried how come he made all those other trades after ROR? 

[Doohickie]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:11 PM, Radar said:

Let's not repeat the ROR thing. Players get frustrated losing and say things that fans don't want to hear. Let's not live in a fantasy land about it. 

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A CANCER IN THE ROOM!!!!!11!!1!!!

[shrader]

  On 9/12/2019 at 4:01 PM, Derrico said:

This is great.  I've been waiting to see what quotes we would get from Risto on Day 1 and he's saying all of the right things.  Either way it's bad news if he started off saying he would like to move on or something.  Then we either trade him for an even further depressed value or we keep him and it's hanging over the team all season.

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The ellipses leave a lot of wiggle room for what he was actually saying.

[Thorner]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:38 PM, LGR4GM said:

If he is so worried how come he made all those other trades after ROR? 

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Has he made a trade since where his guy was the central piece in the deal, one the subject of many a rumour leading up to it? He hasn’t really faced a similar trade in dynamic until this one. 

And I believe it was Friedman who was quoted as saying Botterill may be evaluating this move through the prism of what happened with the ROR deal. 

 

Edited September 12, 2019 by Thorny

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:43 PM, Thorny said:

Has he made a trade since where his guy was the central piece in the deal, one the subject of many a rumour leading up to it? He hasn’t really faced a similar trade in dynamic until this one. 

And I believe it was Friedman who was quoted as saying Botterill may be evaluating this move through the prism of what happened with the ROR deal. 

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Nothing like Friedman speculation. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

The Jets just re-signed 24 year old Morrissey for 6.45 per season.  Makes Risto’s deal look like a bargain.  Apparently Philly is also getting a deal done with Provorov.  It will be interesting to see that deal as well.

IMHO these deals improve Risto’s marketability if and only if Jbot wants to trade him.  I’m no longer sure that is the case.

[Thorner]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:46 PM, LGR4GM said:

Nothing like Friedman speculation. 

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But you just ignored the rest of what I said. The Friedman speculation is really irrelevant to my viewpoint. 

He’s failed to pull the trigger on Risto and until he does I’m going to theorize as to why. 

 

Edited September 12, 2019 by Thorny

[Derrico]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:36 PM, LGR4GM said:

 

 

It is rare for a player to publicly state in the NHL they want out. He's saying nothing of real value other than I am here so I will play here. Again, he wasn't going to show up and bitch. That isn't because he is just excited to be here, it is just who he is. His comments were basically that he talked with Botterill, the subtext is for a trade, but nothing has happened so he is happy to be back playing hockey. It was the blandest response he could have given. 

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First bold is exactly my point.  Second bold how do you know that?  He made a couple small comments at the end of the season, it seems obvious he and Botts have had some discussions about moving on.  He's been here like 5 friggen years of losing.  Sabres brought in 3 new RHD.  It seems obvious Jason is still in on trade talks.  I don't even think it would be out of line Risto questioning why he's still here publicly.  I'm glad this is Risto's makeup but it's not uncommon for Athletes of any sport to say what's on their mind rather than the company line ya know?

Edited September 12, 2019 by Derrico

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:53 PM, Derrico said:

First bold is exactly my point.  Second bold how do you know that?  He made a couple small comments at the end of the season, it seems obvious he and Botts have had some discussions about moving on.  He's been here like 5 friggen years of losing.  Sabres brought in 3 new RHD.  It seems obvious Jason is still in on trade talks.  I don't even think it would be out of line Risto questioning why he's still here.  I'm glad this is Risto's makeup but it's not uncommon for Athletes of any sport to say what's on their mind rather than the company line ya know?

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Yes, it is. That is my point. Most athletes say the bland thing. "I am here so I will play" is the company line that you hear all the time from guys. He was never ever ever going to walk into camp the first day and be like "this is *****! I demanded to be traded! F this team! Get me out of here!" It was just not ever going to happen, especially with a guy like Risto. 

[spndnchz]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:11 PM, North Buffalo said:

Risto wants to win... despite his faults a motivated Risto can be a force if there is a team around him.

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Winning. Changes. Everything. 

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 5:49 PM, Thorny said:

But you just ignored the rest of what I said. The Friedman speculation is really irrelevant to my viewpoint. 

He’s failed to pull the trigger on Risto and until he does I’m going to theorize as to why. 

 

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I ignored it because I don't think it is the cause. 

[Thorner]

  On 9/12/2019 at 6:43 PM, LGR4GM said:

I ignored it because I don't think it is the cause. 

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But you specifically mentioned other trades being made as evidence for why he couldn’t be gun shy on a Risto move, and I was just pointing out that the other moves were quite dissimilar to the ROR and Risto deals. 

Obviously if you don’t see it as a possibility as I do, that’s reasonable, but the defence you’ve laid out doesn’t really apply. 

Edited September 12, 2019 by Thorny

[LGR4GM]

  On 9/12/2019 at 6:47 PM, Thorny said:

But you specifically mentioned other trades being made as evidence for why he couldn’t be gun shy on a Risto move, and I was just pointing out that the other moves were quite dissimilar to the ROR and Risto deals. 

Obviously if you don’t see it as a possibility as I do, that’s reasonable, but the defence you’ve laid out doesn’t really apply. 

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That's because you are equating ROR and Risto. I do not think they are eqiuvalent. One was a elite 2nd line center that 30 other teams could use. The other is a borderline top 4 defender with a limited appeal. 

[Radar]

I have been a fan since the team's inception and there has almost always been a fan whipping boy. Mostly undeserved. I have no idea if Risto will be traded but if he's not I think it's because he's an asset. Is he a great defenseman? Probably not. Is he as bad as some here think?  Absolutely not.