2020 Draft Rankings Not Soon Enough...

[rakish]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

Seth Jarvis at 18.... hahahahahahahahahahahaha lol sure. You wanna know why? The ONLY player listed ahead of him that is also in that height group of 5'9 5'10" is Rossi. 

Also Jan Mysak sliding to the 2nd round would be good news for the Sabres and they should get that. 

I think Mysak getting to 38 is a bit optimistic. I was hoping Reichel or Greig would be there at 38 based on Elite Prospects ratings, but Bob has them in the 20's. For me, I disagree with a lot of it, but not a terrible list other than Jarvis

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I’m telling you, this kid’s got game. He might be weaker and slower than the others around him, but he’s weaker and slower like Gretzky was weaker and slower than Lafleur and Perreault.

He’s a fox in the henhouse out there.

I don't think he is really weaker. He definitely needs to work on his quickness. There is a subtlety to what he does that is Reinhart-esque at times. 

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Great piece on scouting in the Athletic where they talk to Scouts about scouting. Looks like a lot of NHL scouts agree with you.

https://theathletic.com/1713400/2020/04/06/nhl-scout-poll-what-counts-in-prospect-evaluation-who-does-it-best-and-worst/

Talks about how much certain characteristics are valued and why, the value of analytics, the value of international tournaments, what organizations draft well...

You can see in this piece why I keep yelling scouting analytics into the void. There is a large section of scouts who barely use it and I would guess that same section thinks looking at counting stats is analytics. 

[Thorner]

On 6/23/2020 at 8:07 AM, LGR4GM said:

This is why I don't trust scouts. Some of the things they claim are important are just silly. "But he was bad in that 7 game tournament so drop him down the rankings!" I just... uhg. Notice how they talk a little about ceilings and stuff but fail to mention that Byfield is almost 1 year younger than Lafrienere and Rossi. Hearing that 2 scouts had Byfield at #6 made me raise eyebrows super high. 

Anyways, I have been reading and watching a lot and I may change up some of my stuff. I am still working on a top 10 but I will say Cole Perfetti has been getting more and more of my attention. 

 

100%. See: WJC and Casey. 

Not that he didn't necessarily deserve to go where he went that draft considering the forward depth, but he was clearly vastly over hyped due to a single tournament. 

Edited June 24, 2020 by Thorny

[French Collection]

On 6/23/2020 at 8:07 AM, LGR4GM said:

This is why I don't trust scouts. Some of the things they claim are important are just silly. "But he was bad in that 7 game tournament so drop him down the rankings!" I just... uhg. Notice how they talk a little about ceilings and stuff but fail to mention that Byfield is almost 1 year younger than Lafrienere and Rossi. Hearing that 2 scouts had Byfield at #6 made me raise eyebrows super high. 

Anyways, I have been reading and watching a lot and I may change up some of my stuff. I am still working on a top 10 but I will say Cole Perfetti has been getting more and more of my attention. 

 

I like Perfetti as well but I don’t think he would play centre in the NHL. I think he is a winger who has dabbled at C in the OHL. Rossi is smaller but has more of a 200’ game and has always played C. I find Perfetti has more moves and creativity while Rossi is a better skater.

It is tough to compare Perfetti to the Euros (Stutzle, Raymond, Holtz and Lundell). I have only seen them in the WJHC and some videos.   He could be top 5.

I hope more scouts feel Byfield is #6 because the Sabres could luck into him somehow. He did not have a strong push at season’s end due to injuries and the Wolves wanting him ready for the playoffs. Coupled with his showing at the WJHC may be the reason he is dropping. I would still take him at #2.

[Weave]

4 hours ago, Thorny said:

100%. See: WJC and Casey. 

Not that he didn't necessarily deserve to go where he went that draft considering the forward depth, but he was clearly vastly over hyped due to a single tournament. 

Didn't Mittlestadt slip quite a few spots past his projection in the draft?  That would indicate to me that those end of season tournaments are not weighed more heavily than what led up to them.

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, Weave said:

Didn't Mittlestadt slip quite a few spots past his projection in the draft?  That would indicate to me that those end of season tournaments are not weighed more heavily than what led up to them.

Not really. It was one of those non-consensus years with a number of players that could have gone anywhere in the top 10 after Hischier and Patrick, depending on who was picking.

[Thorner]

11 minutes ago, Weave said:

Didn't Mittlestadt slip quite a few spots past his projection in the draft?  That would indicate to me that those end of season tournaments are not weighed more heavily than what led up to them.

No, not really. 

The WJC buzz absolutely is what sparked his big-time hype. 

[Curt]

18 minutes ago, Weave said:

Didn't Mittlestadt slip quite a few spots past his projection in the draft?  That would indicate to me that those end of season tournaments are not weighed more heavily than what led up to them.

Mitts was seen as an option to go a little earlier than he did, but it wasn’t a surprise at all.  He went about where projected.

His WJC buzz and hyped up prospect status was the year AFTER he was drafted.  It’s still an example of how too much importance can be given to a short tournament.

Edited June 24, 2020 by Curt

[dudacek]

Further to the 2017 draft, there are some great stories floating around out my way over the intense debate the Canucks has at pick 5 between Cody Glass and Elias Petterson. 

Scuttlebutt is that 2nd year chief scout Judd Brackett (sp?) wanted EP, but Benning really liked Glass. This came the year after Benning steered the staff into taking Juolevi. After some very intense debate, Benning let the scouts get their way and drafted EP.

Aside from illustrating how one decision can have such a big impact, this is also somewhat relevant to the Sabres.

Last year, Benning allegedly overruled the scouting department to take Hoglander and Brackett lost it, and was effectively pushed to the sideline. He still ran the department this year, but is not getting his contract renewed. He’s a free agent June 30 and is being talked about as a potential chief scout for the Sabres.

Its not clear if his concerns about autonomy would make him a better, or a worse fit in the Sabres flat management structure.

Prior to becoming chief scout, Brackett was the area scout credited with pushing the selections of Brock Boeser and Adam Gaudette.

Edited June 24, 2020 by dudacek

[Thorner]

56 minutes ago, Curt said:

Mitts was seen as an option to go a little earlier than he did, but it wasn’t a surprise at all.  He went about where projected.

His WJC buzz and hyped up prospect status was the year AFTER he was drafted.  It’s still an example of how too much importance can be given to a short tournament.

This is exactly right. It was the WJC that started the "better than Pettersson" stuff. 

[IKnowPhysics]

If no one else did the math.

 

[French Collection]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Further to the 2017 draft, there are some great stories floating around out my way over the intense debate the Canucks has at pick 5 between Cody Glass and Elias Petterson. 

Scuttlebutt is that 2nd year chief scout Judd Brackett (sp?) wanted EP, but Benning really liked Glass. This came the year after Benning steered the staff into taking Juolevi. After some very intense debate, Benning let the scouts get their way and drafted EP.

Aside from illustrating how one decision can have such a big impact, this is also somewhat relevant to the Sabres.

Last year, Benning allegedly overruled the scouting department to take Hoglander and Brackett lost it, and was effectively pushed to the sideline. He still ran the department this year, but is not getting his contract renewed. He’s a free agent June 30 and is being talked about as a potential chief scout for the Sabres.

Its not clear if his concerns about autonomy would make him a better, or a worse fit in the Sabres flat management structure.

Prior to becoming chief scout, Brackett was the area scout credited with pushing the selections of Brock Boeser and Adam Gaudette.

Yeah, I’m interested in Brackett. From what I’ve read on TSN and Sportsnet, there was a falling out with the team (Benning).

If the great picks In the last few drafts were his ideas and the duds‘ Benning’s, he will be a hot commodity. He’s got to be on Adams’ radar, the Sabres must be the only team without a chief scout. Maybe he is looking for an AGM/ Director of scouting job.

[French Collection]

Good interview with Seth Jarvis.

https://www.tsn.ca/talent/after-strong-second-half-portland-s-jarvis-has-top-10-potential-1.1489171

He scored at a 2 point per game pace in 2020.

He is 5’10” but thinks he will still grow. His dad is 6’2” and sprouted late.

He played a lot of football and was a QB so that would indicate a high sports IQ.

Liger may have a winner here similar to Robertson last year. Dropping  a few spots in the lottery may put him on the Sabres radar.

 

I am still hoping for Rossi at 7.

[LGR4GM]

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

Further to the 2017 draft, there are some great stories floating around out my way over the intense debate the Canucks has at pick 5 between Cody Glass and Elias Petterson. 

Scuttlebutt is that 2nd year chief scout Judd Brackett (sp?) wanted EP, but Benning really liked Glass. This came the year after Benning steered the staff into taking Juolevi. After some very intense debate, Benning let the scouts get their way and drafted EP.

Aside from illustrating how one decision can have such a big impact, this is also somewhat relevant to the Sabres.

Last year, Benning allegedly overruled the scouting department to take Hoglander and Brackett lost it, and was effectively pushed to the sideline. He still ran the department this year, but is not getting his contract renewed. He’s a free agent June 30 and is being talked about as a potential chief scout for the Sabres.

Its not clear if his concerns about autonomy would make him a better, or a worse fit in the Sabres flat management structure.

Prior to becoming chief scout, Brackett was the area scout credited with pushing the selections of Brock Boeser and Adam Gaudette.

If he was responsible for Boeser, EP, and wanted someone other than Hoglander (Hoglander was not a bad pick but I would be curious if he wanted Robertson) than we should interview him at the very least. 

12 hours ago, French Collection said:

Good interview with Seth Jarvis.

https://www.tsn.ca/talent/after-strong-second-half-portland-s-jarvis-has-top-10-potential-1.1489171

He scored at a 2 point per game pace in 2020.

He is 5’10” but thinks he will still grow. His dad is 6’2” and sprouted late.

He played a lot of football and was a QB so that would indicate a high sports IQ.

Liger may have a winner here similar to Robertson last year. Dropping  a few spots in the lottery may put him on the Sabres radar.

 

I am still hoping for Rossi at 7.

He should be on the radar as much as Perfetti already is. They have very similar numbers but I like the way Jarvis plays more than Perfetti. 

[Thorner]

4 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

If he was responsible for Boeser, EP, and wanted someone other than Hoglander (Hoglander was not a bad pick but I would be curious if he wanted Robertson) than we should interview him at the very least. 

He should be on the radar as much as Perfetti already is. They have very similar numbers but I like the way Jarvis plays more than Perfetti. 

Nice didn't realize Jarvis was from my hometown. 

[North Buffalo]

So hoping Sabres get 2nd pick and pick Byfield.  Lottery to be decided 8p Friday... https://www.nhl.com/news/alexis-lafreniere-future-will-be-clearer-after-nhl-draft-lottery/c-317256950?tid=277764372

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, North Buffalo said:

So hoping Sabres get 2nd pick and pick Byfield.  Lottery to be decided 8p Friday... https://www.nhl.com/news/alexis-lafreniere-future-will-be-clearer-after-nhl-draft-lottery/c-317256950?tid=277764372

Byfield or Stutzle

[Curt]

49 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Byfield or Stutzle

I’d put Rossi ahead of Stutzle.

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, Curt said:

I’d put Rossi ahead of Stutzle.

I think I did initially and could see an argument for that. 

[LGR4GM]

1. Lafrienerre
2. Byfield
3. Stutzle
4. Rossi
5. Jarvis
6. Raymond
7. Perfetti

This is my new top 7. I want to like Raymond and Holtz but I just don't quite get there. I still they could be really good. One thing I noticed is that if I watch them versus peers I come away more favorable. That is clearly a bias on my part and something to keep in mind. Raymond at the U20 this past season was fun to watch. 

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

1. Lafrienerre
2. Byfield
3. Stutzle
4. Rossi
5. Jarvis
6. Raymond
7. Perfetti

This is my new top 7. I want to like Raymond and Holtz but I just don't quite get there. I still they could be really good. One thing I noticed is that if I watch them versus peers I come away more favorable. That is clearly a bias on my part and something to keep in mind. Raymond at the U20 this past season was fun to watch. 

Come on, no d-men taken isn't good for us. Or, are you just presenting your list of forwards only?

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

Come on, no d-men taken isn't good for us. Or, are you just presenting your list of forwards only?

Hey, he said there is a clear bias on his part.

[sabresparaavida]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

1. Lafrienerre
2. Byfield
3. Stutzle
4. Rossi
5. Jarvis
6. Raymond
7. Perfetti

This is my new top 7. I want to like Raymond and Holtz but I just don't quite get there. I still they could be really good. One thing I noticed is that if I watch them versus peers I come away more favorable. That is clearly a bias on my part and something to keep in mind. Raymond at the U20 this past season was fun to watch. 

Is this your top 7 players, or top 7 players for the Sabres? 

[LGR4GM]

This is my top 7 and the Sabres are my team so a little of both but I don't like Drysdale as much as most. 

This is not a mock

Edited July 9, 2020 by LGR4GM

[sabresparaavida]

4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

This is my top 7 and the Sabres are my team so a little of both but I don't like Drysdale as much as most. 

This is not a mock

Got it. I was just asking because I didn't know the bolded. Drysdale would be in my top 7 of the prospects, but not sure if I would draft him at 8.