2019-20 Sabres Prospects

[shrader]

1 hour ago, tom webster said:

Actually I don’t consider a point per game lighting it up and Larsson was close to a point per game once in his career so I guess you should have said don’t make up facts to confuse the narrative.

Yeah, it’s a bit of a confusing point to make. 
https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/9009/johan-larsson

[Curt]

10 hours ago, tom webster said:

Actually I don’t consider a point per game lighting it up and Larsson was close to a point per game once in his career so I guess you should have said don’t make up facts to confuse the narrative.

Yeah, not a point per game, but I was trying to illustrate a point.  Some guys  can be very productive at lower levels, but then need to conform to a different role in the NHL.  Larsson is an example.  Asplund should be very productive in Alvensken, even if his NHL role does not project to a high scoring player.

Larsson, As a 19 yr old in the SEL: 36 pts in 49 games

As a 21/22 year old in the AHL: 81 pts  in 95 games

Thats more production than most Sabres prospects.

When Larsson was a prospect there actual was a hope/expectation that he would be a productive offensive player.  More like a 30-40 point middle 6 C, but still, more than he has produced.

Edited August 29, 2020 by Curt

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Curt said:

Yeah, not a point per game, but I was trying to illustrate a point.  Some guys  can be very productive at lower levels, but then need to conform to a different role in the NHL.  Larsson is an example.  Asplund should be very productive in Alvensken, even if his NHL role does not project to a high scoring player.

Larsson, As a 19 yr old in the SEL: 36 pts in 49 games

As a 21/22 year old in the AHL: 81 pts  in 95 games

Thats more production than most Sabres prospects.

When Larsson was a prospect there actual was a hope/expectation that he would be a productive offensive player.  More like a 30-40 point middle 6 C, but still, more than he has produced.

If you had Larsson centering for better scoring wings his production would easily be in the range that you would hope for. His current role centering between Girgensons and Okposo is more of a checking and defensive role. If he played with a winger such as Skinner, Olofsson or Reinhart his points would definitely go up. The line he is playing on is arguably playing its role as well as any line in the rotation, maybe even better than the top line. It is admittedly a limited and defined role but it is fulfilling its role exceptionally well. I'm not suggesting that Larsson would ever be a prolific scorer but he certainly could be a more contributing scorer with different linemates. 

[LGR4GM]

Larsson looked good with Skinner for the 1 period they were allowed to be together. 

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

9 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Larsson looked good with Skinner for the 1 period they were allowed to be together. 

Or did Skinner look better because he had a center?

Could this also be true, what say you?

[JohnC]

5 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Larsson looked good with Skinner for the 1 period they were allowed to be together. 

Even when Larsson played with his regular linemates he created scoring chances forcing the action and driving to the net. However, there weren't enough supporting finishers. I agree with you that if he regularly played on a line with Skinner his numbers would be much better. But even acknowledging that I don't see Larsson as a 2C. Maybe as a temporary fill-in but not as a regular on a Skinner line. 

Larsson is a feisty and edgy player. This team doesn't have enough tough players. I hope the organization keeps him. 

[LGR4GM]

Larsson is a 3c playing in a 4c role. 

[dudacek]

3 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Larsson is a 3c playing in a 4c role. 

I think of him more as a 4C playing a 3C role, at least if you subscribe to the 3C as a shutdown matchup role.

Edited August 30, 2020 by dudacek

[inkman]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Larsson is a 3c playing in a 4c role. 

That's hot

[Thorner]

On 8/28/2020 at 12:25 PM, tom webster said:

That’s just not how hockey works. Some guys aren’t meant to light up a beer league. It’s not their game. Asplund will end up a 8-10 year NHL player if he chooses.

Wooooooah there..

[Thorner]

On 8/29/2020 at 4:08 PM, dudacek said:

I think of him more as a 4C playing a 3C role, at least if you subscribe to the 3C as a shutdown matchup role.

Larsson is darn near upper echelon in a shut down capacity so if that’s what we want from line 3, I’d say he’s a third line C

[dudacek]

15 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Larsson is darn near upper echelon in a shut down capacity so if that’s what we want from line 3, I’d say he’s a third line C

Except his offensive production is pure 4th line.

Or worse. Over his 6 year career he ranks 146th in points by NHL centres. Guys who have played only 2 or 3 years, or who retired, are ahead of him. There are only 120 starting centre positions.

Edited September 1, 2020 by dudacek

[Thorner]

8 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Except his offensive production is pure 4th line.

Or worse. Over his 6 year career he ranks 146th in points by NHL centres. Guys who have played only 2 or 3 years, or who retired, are ahead of him. There are only 120 starting centre positions.

But his defence is elite. Better than your average shut down C. 

I’m not saying he’s a ideal 3C (the offence) but I’d term him capable, if we had 2 real top 6 Cs ahead of him, and a sheltered-offence-providing “4” C like Cozens on the other line. 

I’m looking to replace the offence I knowingly give up with Larsson, with a matchups-FAVOURED centre complement to Larsson’s matchups-LABOURED role.

Nice little ying/yang balance with centres 3 and 4, with the true punch provided by centres 1 and 2.

Edited September 1, 2020 by Thorny

[dudacek]

10 teams left in Pronman’s organizational countdown and the Sabres have yet to drop.

[Marvin]

On 9/1/2020 at 3:47 PM, Thorny said:

But his defence is elite. Better than your average shut down C. 

I’m not saying he’s a ideal 3C (the offence) but I’d term him capable, if we had 2 real top 6 Cs ahead of him, and a sheltered-offence-providing “4” C like Cozens on the other line. 

I’m looking to replace the offence I knowingly give up with Larsson, with a matchups-FAVOURED centre complement to Larsson’s matchups-LABOURED role.

Nice little ying/yang balance with centres 3 and 4, with the true punch provided by centres 1 and 2.

This is where i was with LOG - I will live with their offencive deficiencies (and all three were trending towards 25 points this season, which is above 25% of all forwards) because they got singularly unfavourable zone starts and match-up assignments yet were better than even-money to end in the offencive zone against top lines after each shift.

On point-scoring alone, they come out as the highest-end 4th line.  Add their defencive prowess and ability to flip the ice and you have at least an average 3rd line.

Edited September 4, 2020 by Marvin, Sabres Fan

[dudacek]

That the LOGgers are a 4th line remains one of the most common mischaracterizations about the Sabres.

Larsson was 6th in ice time among Sabre forwards.

[inkman]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

That the LOGgers are a 4th line remains one of the most common mischaracterizations about the Sabres.

Larsson was 6th in ice time among Sabre forwards.

Due to necessity.  If a capable 2 way 50 point center comes along, I think Larsson will be relegated more closely to a 4th line role.  Possibly 3rd line depending on how the chips fall. 

[Thorner]

4 hours ago, dudacek said:

That the LOGgers are a 4th line remains one of the most common mischaracterizations about the Sabres.

Larsson was 6th in ice time among Sabre forwards.

Scream it from the rooftops.

A massive hole that needs to be filled. Once we make that centre addition, the most significant centre addition we've seen since ROR, half a decade ago, we'll be back to our near-basement level status-quo.

Then we can see about knocking out some roster improvement....But we HAVE the cap space, so.

Edited September 4, 2020 by Thorny

[Thorner]

1 hour ago, inkman said:

Due to necessity.  If a capable 2 way 50 point center comes along, I think Larsson will be relegated more closely to a 4th line role.  Possibly 3rd line depending on how the chips fall. 

It's unlikely Larsson would lose his defensive match-ups role unless we brought in a better defensive C. It's not a long list. He'd settle it at 3rd most ice-time for centres I'd imagine, but pretty close to the 2nd guy, if we brought in say a Monahan level player. It would be the PP time that separated the two, though Larsson would probably make it up on the PK.

 It's funny to say "out of necessity". That's pretty scary - the obvious implication is, because we haven't had better centres. Can we acquire 2 now? Who's filling his role currently, by necessity? Lazar or Johansson I guess. 

Edited September 4, 2020 by Thorny

[dudacek]

Philly, Montreal, Colorado and Ottawa 10-9-8-7 in Pronman's Under-22 rankings.

Only six more teams to go. Sabres yet to drop

[sabresparaavida]

12 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Philly, Montreal, Colorado and Ottawa 10-9-8-7 in Pronman's Under-22 rankings.

Only six more teams to go. Sabres yet to drop

Carried by Dahlin, Cozens, and Jokiharju no doubt.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

37 minutes ago, sabresparaavida said:

Carried by Dahlin, Cozens, and Jokiharju no doubt.

Might add UPL to that list.

[DarthEbriate]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

Philly, Montreal, Colorado and Ottawa 10-9-8-7 in Pronman's Under-22 rankings.

Only six more teams to go. Sabres yet to drop

According to the images on the article's main page the top teams (in no particular order) are Buffalo, Toronto, and Vancouver (because Matthews counts).

[DarthEbriate]

42 minutes ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

Might add UPL to that list.

And even Portillo is rating well (at this early point).

[rakish]

Budik had a good year in Czech