The Pegula Qualification Thread.

[Tondas]

2 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Yes the are more than qualified to own a sport team.  Terry built a business and he made billions. He did not inherit his fortune.  The 

They are not skilled, or even lucky, when trying to put together the organizations to run each teams.  Eventually they will get there.  The Bills appear to be on the right track at least. 

The Bills do seem to be on the right track.  However, if not for McDermott, would the Pegulas have picked Beane for GM.  Are they starting to "get it" or did they just get lucky.

[Zamboni]

11 minutes ago, Tondas said:

The Bills do seem to be on the right track.  However, if not for McDermott, would the Pegulas have picked Beane for GM.  Are they starting to "get it" or did they just get lucky.

 Those that don’t like the Pegulas will  say that it’s all luck. Those that love the Pegulas will say it’s all competence.

Like most teams construction and success or failure, I believe it’s always a little of both.

[Claude_Verret]

A guy made a ***** ton of coin and bought two professional sports teams. He can and will run them however he pleases. Bitching about it will matter zero and change nothing.

Still I'm sure the crusade will march on....

[nucci]

2 minutes ago, Claude_Verret said:

A guy made a ***** ton of coin and bought two professional sports teams. He can and will run them however he pleases. Bitching about it will matter zero and change nothing.

Still I'm sure the crusade will march on....

Yes he can but just interesting that previous Sabre owners and Ralph Wilson were constantly blasted on how they ran the teams.....for some reason Pegula's get a pass regardless of how bad the teams perform. 

[Claude_Verret]

2 minutes ago, nucci said:

Yes he can but just interesting that previous Sabre owners and Ralph Wilson were constantly blasted on how they ran the teams.....for some reason Pegula's get a pass regardless of how bad the teams perform. 

That's kind of my point...the bitching about Ralph changed nothing. He had to die before it changed. Pegula is here for the foreseeable future. Players can change, coaches can change, GMs too.  This constant wishing for the Pegulas to step back and retire to a yacht in Florida is never, ever happening.

[nucci]

16 minutes ago, Claude_Verret said:

That's kind of my point...the bitching about Ralph changed nothing. He had to die before it changed. Pegula is here for the foreseeable future. Players can change, coaches can change, GMs too.  This constant wishing for the Pegulas to step back and retire to a yacht in Florida is never, ever happening.

I'm not saying they retire....Just help produce winning teams

[Tondas]

If I won a billion dollars in the lottery, I would still know nothing about drilling for gas.  Why should Terry think he knows anything about running a professional sports team(s)?  I would hire experts and not be arrogant enough to think I know better than they do.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, Tondas said:

The Bills do seem to be on the right track.  However, if not for McDermott, would the Pegulas have picked Beane for GM.  Are they starting to "get it" or did they just get lucky.

The NFL helped them with top HC candidates and they picked McD.   Help is good  

Nothing wrong with some luck either.  The Pats* got lucky with Bellichek (known as a good DC but losing record as a HC) and they got even luckier with Brady in the 6th round   

Pittsburgh got Mario and Jagr, years later they get Crosby and Malkin.  I want some luck.  

[LTS]

3 minutes ago, Tondas said:

If I won a billion dollars in the lottery, I would still know nothing about drilling for gas.  Why should Terry think he knows anything about running a professional sports team(s)?  I would hire experts and not be arrogant enough to think I know better than they do.

So, with your billion dollars you are going to go find a guy who claims to be good at drilling for gas.  How are you going to find him?  Interviews?  You don't know what makes a successful executive for that role since you know nothing about it.  You'll bring in some consultants and they'll have ties to other people and opinions on who you should hire. 

So you hire a guy based on your consultants.  Do you just scurry off the Caribbean and not check in on what he's going with your money?  What if your consultants steered you wrong.  They steered you to a guy who worked really well in the Southern US but dealing with Northerners isn't a different beast.  They don't like your Southern boy.  So, you gotta fire him and start over.  Now who do you listen to?

The smart owner is going to eventually get the right guy.  The entire time they are going to stay involved so they can learn more and more about the business they didn't know much about before.  Eventually, they'll start to get it.

Arrogance would be buying the team and not having hockey advisors help you on hiring and operating the team and going out and doing it all yourself.  That hasn't happened.

[Claude_Verret]

19 minutes ago, nucci said:

I'm not saying they retire....Just help produce winning teams

I know you aren't saying that, my apologies. Theres been pretty much been only one crusader who has been banging this drum ad nauseum.

[Tondas]

1 minute ago, LTS said:

So, with your billion dollars you are going to go find a guy who claims to be good at drilling for gas.  How are you going to find him?  Interviews?  You don't know what makes a successful executive for that role since you know nothing about it.  You'll bring in some consultants and they'll have ties to other people and opinions on who you should hire. 

So you hire a guy based on your consultants.  Do you just scurry off the Caribbean and not check in on what he's going with your money?  What if your consultants steered you wrong.  They steered you to a guy who worked really well in the Southern US but dealing with Northerners isn't a different beast.  They don't like your Southern boy.  So, you gotta fire him and start over.  Now who do you listen to?

The smart owner is going to eventually get the right guy.  The entire time they are going to stay involved so they can learn more and more about the business they didn't know much about before.  Eventually, they'll start to get it.

Arrogance would be buying the team and not having hockey advisors help you on hiring and operating the team and going out and doing it all yourself.  That hasn't happened.

Good points.  But how long is too long?  It's been 8 years and we're really no further along.  How long is the learning curve before you say Terry will never get it right?

[LTS]

Just now, Tondas said:

Good points.  But how long is too long?  It's been 8 years and we're really no further along.  How long is the learning curve before you say Terry will never get it right?

How long do you let someone build a team?  I feel that when he came in he was surrounded by too many people with differing and bad agendas.  Over the past few years we've seen an indication that he's now comfortable moving some of those people out.  They are starting to assert their values on the front offices of the teams.  Things don't change overnight, especially if one of the guys in charge really screwed things up.

More importantly, you can't fire the owner, so what does it matter?  He's the owner and will continue to be the owner.  If he continues to screw it up then fans need to start leaving.  If they do that then the team will lose money and he'll probably look to sell the team. 

It's far too early to judge where Botterill is going with this team.  It's plausible that Housley was never intended to be the coach and that Krueger was who he wanted all along.  The problem was Krueger was tied up in his soccer project and not ready to leave that.  If Housley had panned out that would have been excellent.  He didn't.  It sucks for the fans, to be certain, but each new management structure can't make decisions based on the length of time the fans have suffered.  That's how the cupboard was emptied with Murray.

I'm just more patient.  And frankly,  I have no control over it.  So I can choose to get bent over it or choose to hope it will get better.  If I feel like Botterill can't get the job done then I'll stop paying attention to the team until they make a change. 

[Tondas]

The president gets 8 years to change the country, surely it shouldn't take that long for a hockey team to make the playoffs.

[LTS]

Just now, Tondas said:

The president gets 8 years to change the country, surely it shouldn't take that long for a hockey team to make the playoffs.

Have you seen the country change much?

That said, running the US and running a hockey team are in no way related whatsoever.

[Tondas]

Just now, LTS said:

Have you seen the country change much?

That said, running the US and running a hockey team are in no way related whatsoever.

Unfortunately, I have seen the country change more in the last 2 1/2 years than I would have ever thought possible.

[That Aud Smell]

We've been around this carousel a few times, @PASabreFan.

Do you find the conversation to be an interesting one?

I mostly don't.

Would either of Terry or Kim Pegula been hired into the positions they occupy had they not bought and owned the team? Most assuredly not.

But they did buy the team. That is the ultimate and final "qualification" for any position within an organization that's been thusly purchased.

I think I find it more interesting to talk about whether RaKru was properly qualified to serve as an NHL HC.

[Kruppstahl]

16 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Correct. The issue is their qualifications to run the team, given that Kim installed herself as team president and Terry installed himself as de facto director of hockey operations.

Kim's qualifications are zero.  

Terry has, from day one, struck me as a meathead, especially considering he is a billionaire and some sort of engineer.

Their ownership of both teams has gone very poorly so far.  

For Buffalo sports fans who are just happy to have retained their teams regardless of competence, Pegula is a great owner.

For those wanting more, he has been terrible.

 

 

[Drunkard]

31 minutes ago, Kruppstahl said:

Kim's qualifications are zero.  

Terry has, from day one, struck me as a meathead, especially considering he is a billionaire and some sort of engineer.

Their ownership of both teams has gone very poorly so far.  

For Buffalo sports fans who are just happy to have retained their teams regardless of competence, Pegula is a great owner.

For those wanting more, he has been terrible.

 

 

He also lied about drilling another gas well and making the sole purpose for the team's existence to be winning the Stanley Cup. If he did he wouldn't have handcuffed his rookie GM in trading a good player for scraps just to avoid paying his bonus. I guess moving him before July 1st was more important than icing the best team possible.  

[nucci]

1 hour ago, LTS said:

How long do you let someone build a team?  I feel that when he came in he was surrounded by too many people with differing and bad agendas.  Over the past few years we've seen an indication that he's now comfortable moving some of those people out.  They are starting to assert their values on the front offices of the teams.  Things don't change overnight, especially if one of the guys in charge really screwed things up.

More importantly, you can't fire the owner, so what does it matter?  He's the owner and will continue to be the owner.  If he continues to screw it up then fans need to start leaving.  If they do that then the team will lose money and he'll probably look to sell the team. 

It's far too early to judge where Botterill is going with this team.  It's plausible that Housley was never intended to be the coach and that Krueger was who he wanted all along.  The problem was Krueger was tied up in his soccer project and not ready to leave that.  If Housley had panned out that would have been excellent.  He didn't.  It sucks for the fans, to be certain, but each new management structure can't make decisions based on the length of time the fans have suffered.  That's how the cupboard was emptied with Murray.

I'm just more patient.  And frankly,  I have no control over it.  So I can choose to get bent over it or choose to hope it will get better.  If I feel like Botterill can't get the job done then I'll stop paying attention to the team until they make a change. 

I do both...pissed about the team and hoping it gets better

[LTS]

2 hours ago, Tondas said:

Unfortunately, I have seen the country change more in the last 2 1/2 years than I would have ever thought possible.

I won't go deeper into this because it would be politics.. but it feels the same to me. 

58 minutes ago, nucci said:

I do both...pissed about the team and hoping it gets better

Well, you'd be happier to not get upset about things outside of your control.  But, to each their own.  If I were as upset as some people around here appear to be I would just stop paying attention to the Sabres.  There's enough grief in life.

[Tondas]

5 minutes ago, LTS said:

I won't go deeper into this because it would be politics.. but it feels the same to me.

Amen, brother.

[Randall Flagg]

We know Terry sits in on all the juicy stuff, watching film, scout meetings, etc. right? I just wish we knew if he ever says anything, and if people are required to listen to his opinion and take it into consideration. 

Edited June 21, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[Stoner]

35 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

We know Terry sits in on all the juicy stuff, watching film, scout meetings, etc. right? I just wish we knew if he ever says anything, and if people are required to listen to his opinion and take it into consideration. 

That's the scary thing about him watching film. I don't see any way he just does it for fun and never shares his opinion with anyone in the hockey department.

[Randall Flagg]

2 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

That's the scary thing about him watching film. I don't see any way he just does it for fun and never shares his opinion with anyone in the hockey department.

We need an insider to come forward and give the details 

Because I feel like that's a pretty make-or-break thing right? If he's telling them not to trade for xxx, that's horrifying - counting his opinion as one of the several relevant ones. If he is just like "I like that guy but you're in charge" then we're okay. 

Edited June 21, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[Stoner]

3 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

We've been around this carousel a few times, @PASabreFan.

Do you find the conversation to be an interesting one?

I mostly don't.

Would either of Terry or Kim Pegula been hired into the positions they occupy had they not bought and owned the team? Most assuredly not.

But they did buy the team. That is the ultimate and final "qualification" for any position within an organization that's been thusly purchased.

I think I find it more interesting to talk about whether RaKru was properly qualified to serve as an NHL HC.

I'll never agree with the idea that having the money to purchase some entity makes you qualified to run it. Entitled, yes. Maybe I'll buy Southwest someday and try my hand at more efficiently scheduling the flights in advance of a blizzard.