Taro T Posted June 17, 2019 Report Posted June 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Brawndo said: There goes Trouba ? Quote
darksabre Posted June 17, 2019 Report Posted June 17, 2019 I guess he wasn't interested in Buffalo for what that cost the Rangers. Quote
dudacek Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) No offence to Pionk, but I’d rather have Tage, a first a second and scraps. ? More seriously, looks like Risto and 31 could have got it done. Edited June 18, 2019 by dudacek 1 Quote
Gatorman0519 Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) The Rangers just leap frogged us in their rebuild. Edited June 18, 2019 by Gatorman0519 Quote
Curt Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 46 minutes ago, dudacek said: No offence to Pionk, but I’d rather have Tage, a first a second and scraps. ? More seriously, looks like Risto and 31 could have got it done. From the looks of it, yes, Risto and 31 probably would have been better for Winnipeg, but it Trouba had zero interest in being in Buffalo then it wouldn’t have been a very good deal for the Sabres. Quote
sabills Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 If I'm the Sabres I might look at a Trouba trade and think "I don't know if I want to go through Skinner again". Which is maybe short sighted, but I kinda get it. 1 Quote
Scottysabres Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 All eyes on Buffalo and Ristolainen now. 1 Quote
TrueBlueGED Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 2 hours ago, dudacek said: No offence to Pionk, but I’d rather have Tage, a first a second and scraps. ? More seriously, looks like Risto and 31 could have got it done. The flip side is this should temper expectations for any return in a Risto trade. The contract situation is more team friendly, but still, I'm shocked the price for Trouba was this low. 1 Quote
Thorner Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) Was that the trade Winnipeg was able to get because NY thought they had a chance to sign him? Cause that's a horrendous, horrendous trade for the Jets. They traded their first away, along with Claude's son, for Hayes, which amounted to nothing more than 2 wins in the playoffs, and they just got that first back. So, Lemieux and Trouba for Pionk. That's...a bad trade. Any team taking on Trouba could have just dealt him at the deadline for probably more than what he just fetched. This is that rare situation where a team runs into cap trouble, pre-accomplishing anything, where they actually get burned. Wheeler and Little contracts look bad, they just lost Armia and their best defenceman as cap collateral, and still they don't have a 2C. And they are still in cap trouble. People here are NOT happy. ? Edited June 18, 2019 by Thorny Quote
dudacek Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, TrueBlueGED said: The flip side is this should temper expectations for any return in a Risto trade. The contract situation is more team friendly, but still, I'm shocked the price for Trouba was this low. I pretty much called this in the other thread yesterday when I compared it to the Skinner trade: it’s basically a full-year rental of a player who is going to be very expensive and very picky about where he will sign. Pionk is better than Pu and the pick is 15 slots higher. Even though the players are similar, there may be less impact on Risto than you would expect because the contract situations are so different. Risto gives you 3 years @5.4, much is easier to absorb under the cap. Edited June 18, 2019 by dudacek Quote
TrueBlueGED Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 34 minutes ago, dudacek said: I pretty much called this in the other thread yesterday when I compared it to the Skinner thread: it’s basically a full-year rental of a player who is going to be very expensive and very picky about where he will sign. Pionk is better than Pu and the pick is 15 slots higher. Even though the players are similar, there may be less impact on Risto than you would expect because the contract situations are so different. Risto gives you 3 years @5.4, much is easier to absorb under the cap. Well, Trouba has also played on the top pair of a contender. Risto, not so much. It's so hard to think of Risto trades because I'd imagine GMs are as polarized on him as hockey fans are. The only thing I'm confident of is that if he's trades, his fans won't think it was nearly enough. Edited June 18, 2019 by TrueBlueGED Quote
Ducky Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Thorny said: Was that the trade Winnipeg was able to get because NY thought they had a chance to sign him? Cause that's a horrendous, horrendous trade for the Jets. They traded their first away, along with Claude's son, for Hayes, which amounted to nothing more than 2 wins in the playoffs, and they just got that first back. So, Lemieux and Trouba for Pionk. That's...a bad trade. Any team taking on Trouba could have just dealt him at the deadline for probably more than what he just fetched. This is that rare situation where a team runs into cap trouble, pre-accomplishing anything, where they actually get burned. Wheeler and Little contracts look bad, they just lost Armia and their best defenceman as cap collateral, and still they don't have a 2C. And they are still in cap trouble. People here are NOT happy. ? They shouldn't be happy. Trouba and NY bent Chevy over and gave it to him HARD. How the hell do you not get a conditional pick if he signs with them? Unbelievable. Chevy's worst move since coming here in my opinion. 2 Quote
dudacek Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 35 minutes ago, TrueBlueGED said: Well, Trouba has also played on the top pair of a contender. Risto, not so much. It's so hard to think of Risto trades because I'd imagine GMs are as polarized on him as hockey fans are. The only thing I'm confident of is that if he's trades, his fans won't think it was nearly enough. I doubt there has ever been a player who shines so well in traditional hockey metrics (points, size, skill, battle) and yet so poorly in a analytics, all with the mitigating factors of how he’s been used and the team’s he has been played on. The league just doesn’t know what to think of him. If the analytics guys are right, the time to trade him has passed. If the traditionalists are right, the time to trade him has yet to arrive, I think the reason why Botterill may have backed off from trading him is that he has been given no good reason to pull the trigger. Edited June 18, 2019 by dudacek 2 Quote
TrueBlueGED Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 4 minutes ago, dudacek said: I doubt there has ever been a player who shines so well in traditional hockey metrics (points, size, skill, battle) and yet so poorly in a analytics, all with the mitigating factors of how he’s been used and the team’s he has been played on. The league just doesn’t know what to think of him. If the analytics guys are right, the time to trade him has passed. If the traditionalists are right, the time to trade him has yet to arrive, I think the reason why Botterill may have backed off from trading him is that he has been given no good reason to pull the trigger. Dion Phaneuf. I'm going to keep saying it because it's true. The debates around Risto are seriously identical to those around Phaneuf in his Toronto days. 2 Quote
dudacek Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 11 minutes ago, TrueBlueGED said: Dion Phaneuf. I'm going to keep saying it because it's true. The debates around Risto are seriously identical to those around Phaneuf in his Toronto days. I think the play style and caliber are a great comparable, but I don’t remember Phaneuf being crucified the way Risto is by a large, vocal segment. Of course his reputation was pretty well established before analytics took hold, and I may have paid very little attention to what they were saying about him in the back half of his career. Quote
nfreeman Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 Risto is a much better skater than Dion. A better defenseman? Jury’s still out. Quote
Two or less Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 I'm pretty confident that Pionk isn't a much better hockey player then Casey Nelson. What a steal. Quote
Two or less Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 I can't imagine Winnipeg being that dumb. Sure teams get fleeced all the time, but this just seems too bizarre. Maybe teams know Trouba is already set on signing with the Red Wings next summer? Quote
PerreaultForever Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 Watch, if they don't sign him the Rangers will flip Trouba for a solid return at the deadline. They've been really good at that and have thus rebuilt way way faster than most. Quote
Thorner Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Ducky said: They shouldn't be happy. Trouba and NY bent Chevy over and gave it to him HARD. How the hell do you not get a conditional pick if he signs with them? Unbelievable. Chevy's worst move since coming here in my opinion. A bad move in a sea of very good moves, up until recently. I think he got caught chasing a bit (trading 1sts for rentals at deadline) and some of the more recent contracts are suspect. Up until recently he was hitting doubles, triples, and HRs. And now this trade. Edited June 18, 2019 by Thorny Quote
carpandean Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 4 hours ago, Thorny said: A bad move in a sea of very good moves, up until recently. I think he got caught chasing a bit (trading 1sts for rentals at deadline) and some of the more recent contracts are suspect. Up until recently he was hitting doubles, triples, and HRs. And now this trade. 1 Quote
Eleven Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 10 hours ago, Ducky said: They shouldn't be happy. Trouba and NY bent Chevy over and gave it to him HARD. How the hell do you not get a conditional pick if he signs with them? Unbelievable. Chevy's worst move since coming here in my opinion. Agreed, especially on the conditional. Quote
sweetlou Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 9 hours ago, Briere48 said: I can't imagine Winnipeg being that dumb. Sure teams get fleeced all the time, but this just seems too bizarre. Maybe teams know Trouba is already set on signing with the Red Wings next summer? 8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said: Watch, if they don't sign him the Rangers will flip Trouba for a solid return at the deadline. They've been really good at that and have thus rebuilt way way faster than most. Trouba is an RFA right now. He does not have a contract for next season. He signed a one year deal last summer for $5.5 million. He had said he would not sign another extension with Winnipeg and basically forced Chevy to trade him. Rangers now hold his rights and can sign him to a seven year contract. Rangers did not give up that much because he was not under contract. Jets could not sign him for a big contract and thus were forced to move him. It is hard to compare Risto to Trouba in trade value because Risto is under a good contract for three more years. Trouba will probably get around $8 million AAV. 1 Quote
dudacek Posted June 18, 2019 Report Posted June 18, 2019 (edited) I love how this deal is setting up other deals for both the Rangers and the Jets. Just like the Coburn signing is setting up a move for Tampa and the Karlsson signing sets free people from San Jose. Lots of teams with lots of balls in the air. Looks like there are a lot of dominoes to fall. Edited June 18, 2019 by dudacek 1 Quote
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