How much power does RaKru have?

[Stoner]

The relationship between coach and GM has always interested me. I usually conclude it doesn't make a lot of sense if the GM is doing the grocery shopping and the coach is preparing the meal, as an old analogy goes. The coach has to be more involved than that. So I'm wondering how much clout Ralph has, and if he negotiated as much into his deal. Ralph said he wanted to be in a president role, so should we be surprised if he ends up at Jason's side through the team-building process? This might reflect the tenuous position Jason is in. It makes good sense. Ralph seems to have a clear idea of the kind of player he wants. The two better be on the same page. But Botterill was here first and had his vision first. How's it all going to shake out?

Edited June 9, 2019 by PASabreFan

[#freejame]

Re: RaKru

[nucci]

RaKru?

[Zamboni]

RK

RaKru won’t catch on no matter how hard you try. Silly rabbit.

 

i think wasting an ounce of concern or whatever you want to call it on what the relationship is or who has what power to do what arbitrary action.... is ... silly. They have defined and distinct roles. And until someone proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that that’s not the case. I’ll go by that very safe and likely assumption.

[...]

I object to this thread's title.

[Stoner]

47 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

i think wasting an ounce of concern or whatever you want to call it on what the relationship is or who has what power to do what arbitrary action.... is ... silly. They have defined and distinct roles. And until someone proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that that’s not the case. I’ll go by that very safe and likely assumption

I'm not concerned. Just curious. GMs and coaches have many arrangements. Why would you assume your way of looking at it fits this situation?

Edited June 9, 2019 by PASabreFan

[Doohicksie]

It seems like it's getting harder and harder for our resident conspiracy theorist to come up with convincing conspiracy theories.

[7+6=13]

I don't get any of what you're suggesting?  

Because JBot is in a weak position he allowed RK to negotiate a large role in what players come here?

[Stoner]

43 minutes ago, Doohickie said:

It seems like it's getting harder and harder for our resident conspiracy theorist to come up with convincing conspiracy theories.

You're struggling a little yourself. Coaches have power. How much does Ralph have? What's the problem here? I didn't stick it in a megathread?

[Stoner]

40 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

I don't get any of what you're suggesting?  

Because JBot is in a weak position he allowed RK to negotiate a large role in what players come here?

Maybe the Pegulas wanted RaKru to have a larger role than usual. What do we know? 1. Ralph wanted to be a team president. 2. Jason is in a critical third year, with the first two being huge disappointments. It's not a conspiracy theory to ponder if Ralph is here to help Jason to some extent, if the Pegulas post-Housley might think the GM and coach should be more of a collaborative effort. Etc.

If you have nothing to add to the topic, which is a pretty standard one, feel free to hit up the draft thread, where ideas and opinions are flung with abandon. Maybe that's our stock in trade here?

[Curt]

Personally, I have no idea.

My hope is that the relationship between Jason and Ralph will be a highly collaborative one where input is passed back and forth freely, and respected.  A partnership rather than two guys doing their jobs in silos.

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, Curtisp5286 said:

Personally, I have no idea.

My hope is that the relationship between Jason and Ralph will be a highly collaborative one where input is passed back and forth freely, and respected.  A partnership rather than two guys doing their jobs in silos.

Absolutely. It just seems like Ralph has a pretty specific idea of the kinds of players he wants. He has to be involved. Am I remembering it wrong or did Jason say he didn't talk to Phil about trades?

Edited June 9, 2019 by PASabreFan

[...]

5 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

The relationship between coach and GM has always interested me. I usually conclude it doesn't make a lot of sense if the GM is doing the grocery shopping and the coach is preparing the meal, as an old analogy goes. The coach has to be more involved than that. So I'm wondering how much clout Ralph has, and if he negotiated as much into his deal. Ralph said he wanted to be in a president role, so should we be surprised if he ends up at Jason's side through the team-building process? This might reflect the tenuous position Jason is in. It makes good sense. Ralph seems to have a clear idea of the kind of player he wants. The two better be on the same page. But Botterill was here first and had his vision first. How's it all going to shake out?

I think there's something to this.  A coach and GM should be tight. I think the Pegula's probably agree with that, if the McDermott/Beane relationship is any indication.  The Pegulas seem to have bought fully into the "team" concept of top-end hockey ops leadership.

Does it reflect on Botterill?  Of course it does, but not necessarily negatively.  Let's remember Krueger is supposed to be Botterill's hire, although now that I think about it, Botterill wasn't there for the press conference, while the Pegulas were as far as I recall.  Anyway, maybe Botterill was tired of working with coaches who didn't want to collaborate and perhaps this is what put Krueger ahead of all of the other candidates.   This would compliment the out-of-the-box reasoning that justifies Krueger as an NHL coach.

#JustSayNoToRakruItsSimplyKruegerOrKruegs

[7+6=13]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Maybe the Pegulas wanted RaKru to have a larger role than usual. What do we know? 1. Ralph wanted to be a team president. 2. Jason is in a critical third year, with the first two being huge disappointments. It's not a conspiracy theory to ponder if Ralph is here to help Jason to some extent, if the Pegulas post-Housley might think the GM and coach should be more of a collaborative effort. Etc.

If you have nothing to add to the topic, which is a pretty standard one, feel free to hit up the draft thread, where ideas and opinions are flung with abandon. Maybe that's our stock in trade here?

Thank you for the suggestions.  FYI, a question is contributing.  

I get it, you think the Pegula's told JBot that all candidates he interviews, they'll also interview with the thought in mind they want someone to have say in the personnel.  

That falls in line with the Bills structure, so it would make sense.  

[#freejame]

When interviewing coaches, a GM should be looking for a coach who fits his model. 

When considering accepting a job, a coach should be contemplate whether or not the players available and the GM are suitable for the style he wants to play. 

Beyond that, no GM should consider the coach when evaluating players. The GM should already be certain the have a coach that fits their system and that the player will succeed in that system. 

[Derrico]

3 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

You're struggling a little yourself. Coaches have power. How much does Ralph have? What's the problem here? I didn't stick it in a megathread?

No I like this discussion.  I get the feeling, based on communication issues of past coaches and Ralph’s previous experience that he will have much more of a voice when deciding on acquisitions and other player personnel.  Then again, that’s how this thing should be run.  Get some super smart people and have them work together to fix this thing.  Check your ***** ego at the door if you have a problem.  This team needs to find a way to start winning now and I have no interest in hearing people getting butt hurt.  

Someone had posted a few days ago video of Krueger giving a bit of a speech to the majority of sabres employees.  Is it typical for a coach to engage day to day employees in that setting? I think Krueger will be much more involved in working with Jason to bring in the right players.  More so than any other predecessor thus far.  Don’t think that is a bad thing at all.

[DarthEbriate]

Unlimited power!

[dudacek]

I’m a believer in the simplest answer being the likeliest: Jason saw the issues created by the weak leadership in Bylsma and Housley and hits the best leader he could find. His body language and his mannerisms when speaking about Ralph (and Bots was at the presser) were as full of positive energy as I’ve ever seen them.

Is Kruger the leader he’s touted to be? Does he have enough technical acumen to complement that skill if he is? Is he actually on the same page as Jason when it comes to culture, or does it just seem like it? Will being on the same page about culture matter if they aren’t on the same page about hockey?

Guess we’ll find out.

Edited June 10, 2019 by dudacek

[Doohicksie]

18 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Am I remembering it wrong or did Jason say he didn't talk to Phil about trades?

I think on some player moves, JBot said it was his doing, not XHCPH's, but that seemed more to provide cover to Housley than an actual statement of power.

[That Aud Smell]

22 hours ago, Zamboni said:

They have defined and distinct roles. And until someone proves beyond a shadow of a doubt that that’s not the case. I’ll go by that very safe and likely assumption.

That's an odd way to proceed on a message board.

23 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

Ralph said he wanted to be in a president role

When? Link? I missed it, is all.

17 hours ago, ... said:

I think there's something to this.  A coach and GM should be tight. I think the Pegula's probably agree with that, if the McDermott/Beane relationship is any indication.  The Pegulas seem to have bought fully into the "team" concept of top-end hockey ops leadership.

This is a good point. Consider that McDermott essentially hired Beane into that position. Which is not how those things generally work. Collaboration is clearly a Pegula calling card.

14 hours ago, dudacek said:

I’m a believer in the simplest answer being the likeliest: Jason saw the issues created by the weak leadership in Bylsma and Housley and hits the best leader he could find. His body language and his mannerisms when speaking about Ralph (and Bots was at the presser) were as full of positive energy as I’ve ever seen them.

Is Kruger the leader he’s touted to be? Does he have enough technical acumen to complement that skill if he is? Is he actually on the same page as Jason when it comes to culture, or does it just seem like it? Will being on the same page about culture matter if they aren’t on the same page about hockey?

Guess we’ll find out.

That's where I am, all of it. We may come to find/feel that RaKru was little more than a snake oil salesman - fit for conducting leadership conferences, but unfit for being a HC in the NHL. In prospect ranking terms, his floor is incredibly low and his ceiling quite high. It will be interesting to see how this shakes out.

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

When? Link? I missed it, is all.

Kinda hard to find. I think it probably emanated from an interview with Lebrun of the paywalled Athletic (the gist of it is up top in the article and can be seen without paying): https://theathletic.com/900010/2019/04/01/lebrun-ralph-krueger-would-consider-a-return-to-the-nhl-but-most-likely-not-as-a-coach/

I imagine if you googled "Krueger Lebrun" some seconding reporting of it would come up.

Also, I think Ralph was asked about it and addressed it at his presser.  He might have said something to the effect that it was the opportunity in Buffalo that really spoke to him and he essentially got Kevorka-ed by the situation ("the irresistible allure of the hideous beast").

Edited June 10, 2019 by PASabreFan

[Eleven]

On 6/9/2019 at 9:24 AM, #freejame said:

Re: RaKru

Even I understood this one.

[dudacek]

38 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Kinda hard to find. I think it probably emanated from an interview with Lebrun of the paywalled Athletic (the gist of it is up top in the article and can be seen without paying): https://theathletic.com/900010/2019/04/01/lebrun-ralph-krueger-would-consider-a-return-to-the-nhl-but-most-likely-not-as-a-coach/

I imagine if you googled "Krueger Lebrun" some seconding reporting of it would come up.

Also, I think Ralph was asked about it and addressed it at his presser.  He might have said something to the effect that it was the opportunity in Buffalo that really spoke to him and he essentially got Kevorka-ed by the situation ("the irresistible allure of the hideous beast").

Yep. The gist of what he said was that he expected his path to continue in the direction of his EPL experience, except likely in hockey.

But as he talked to people about opportunities, it was Botterill’s that got him the most excited - an opportunity to lead and develop potential in a market that would appreciate it, in a milieu that has always fired him up and been closest to his heart.

[woods-racer]

31 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Even I understood this one.

I quite possible could be the most meme deprived of all on this board.

I have no idea where that one came from and what meaning it has to this thread.

[Drunkard]

14 minutes ago, woods-racer said:

I quite possible could be the most meme deprived of all on this board.

I have no idea where that one came from and what meaning it has to this thread.

I think it came from the movie Mean Girls, but it was definitely in the response to the OP trying to get everyone on board with calling Ralph Krueger RaKru.