Sheldon Keefe

[Torpedo Forecheck]

https://www.sportsnet.ca/magazine/a-chance-at-redemption-sheldon-keefe/sn-amp/

 

Personally, I say no it does not preclude the hiring of him as Sabres coach.

 

[Torpedo Forecheck]

He recruited my son to play for him in Pembroke about 10 years ago. My son's college coach who he had already committed to said no way he's going to go play for Sheldon Keefe. We talked about the stuff in the articles and the decision was made-No!

 Over the next couple years I watched a great coach in action. One who was loved by his players and had nothing but positives to say about him. I watched him get married and become a father. He was a tough coach, but a gentleman and someone who was a feel good redemption story.

[Zamboni]

Those that say yes probably still hate ROR for the Tim Horton incident, Hate Darcy for offering Nolan only a one year contract, and hate Hasek for wanting out of Buffalo so he can win a cup elsewhere.  

long long ago in a era far far away.  ?

[nfreeman]

Please delete the text of the article -- we can't copy entire articles on this board.  You can copy a couple of excerpts -- I would suggest the ones that relate to Keefe directly.  You can unlock once that is done.  thanks.

[Torpedo Forecheck]

2 hours ago, Zamboni said:

Those that say yes probably still hate ROR for the Tim Horton incident, Hate Darcy for offering Nolan only a one year contract, and hate Hasek for wanting out of Buffalo so he can win a cup elsewhere.  

long long ago in a era far far away.  ?

There are defineatly  some who want to kick him to the curb for sure. BTW, where are all the ones who were ripping it on the coach thread?

Edited May 13, 2019 by Torpedo Forecheck

[inkman]

I feel this article is a little more coherent.

https://www.thestar.com/sports/hockey/2015/03/27/sheldon-keefe-builds-second-career-out-of-second-chance.html

[LGR4GM]

I said it didn't but I don't think they are going to hire Keefe

[Eleven]

2 hours ago, Torpedo Forecheck said:

https://www.sportsnet.ca/magazine/a-chance-at-redemption-sheldon-keefe/sn-amp/

 

Personally, I say no it does not preclude the hiring of him as Sabres coach.

 

You could bring back the reddit link maybe?  There was good information in there.

[Torpedo Forecheck]

20 minutes ago, Eleven said:

You could bring back the reddit link maybe?  There was good information in there.

I had to delete it 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/marlies-sheldon-keefe-shown-willingness-adapt-off-ice/

 

Edited May 13, 2019 by Torpedo Forecheck

[Eleven]

13 minutes ago, Torpedo Forecheck said:

I had to delete it 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/marlies-sheldon-keefe-shown-willingness-adapt-off-ice/

 

No, I think that was a misunderstanding.  And even if we cannot have long quotations, you still can link to the reddit post.

[nfreeman]

Correct -- NP providing a link to the reddit post.

(Sorry -- I deleted the entire text box as it was the only way to delete the article.)

[Eleven]

2 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Correct -- NP providing a link to the reddit post.

(Sorry -- I deleted the entire text box as it was the only way to delete the article.)

That wasn’t an article; that was the reddit post.  Just for clarity, in a non-copyright situation like that, was it simply too much to paste?  So we should use links instead?

[Taro T]

If people never got second chances, this world would have pretty much no successes.  And an inordinate amount of human capital would be discarded prematurely.

Certain things (premeditated murder & the like) don't come with Mulligans.  Most of the rest, people should usually be allowed at least 1. 

Though those using Mulligans can be looked at more critically (quite reasonably) and have more hoops to jump through than those not using them.

[shrader]

1 minute ago, Eleven said:

That wasn’t an article; that was the reddit post.  Just for clarity, in a non-copyright situation like that, was it simply too much to paste?  So we should use links instead?

If it's the one I'm thinking it was, I'd say yeah, it's probably better to link to something that is incredibly long.  If nothing else, it saves us from that inevitable moment where multiple people quote the whole thing.

[SDS]

13 minutes ago, Eleven said:

No, I think that was a misunderstanding.  And even if we cannot have long quotations, you still can link to the reddit post.

Why doesn't a Reddit post deserve the same respect as a published author? Those thoughts are owned by the creator and licensed to their platform of choice - Reddit.

[Torpedo Forecheck]

https://torontosun.com/2012/12/03/ex-frost-disciple-keefe-looks-to-shed-baggage/wcm/c0f7b235-b400-4be6-b056-84c7aa14b8f9

[Eleven]

27 minutes ago, SDS said:

Why doesn't a Reddit post deserve the same respect as a published author? Those thoughts are owned by the creator and licensed to their platform of choice - Reddit.

Respect? No difference.  Your liability is different.  That’s the only reason for the question. I’m fine with whatever conclusions you all reach.

35 minutes ago, Taro T said:

If people never got second chances, this world would have pretty much no successes.  And an inordinate amount of human capital would be discarded prematurely.

Certain things (premeditated murder & the like) don't come with Mulligans.  Most of the rest, people should usually be allowed at least 1. 

Though those using Mulligans can be looked at more critically (quite reasonably) and have more hoops to jump through than those not using them.

I am more concerned whether Keefe is scarred than whether he was a bad actor when manipulated as an adolescent.  I’d still like him as a coach.

[Brawndo]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

I said it didn't but I don't think they are going to hire Keefe

Their not, Friedman said the Sabres were not interested. This probably comes as a result of Keefe being happy to take over Toronto 

[Taro T]

25 minutes ago, Eleven said:

Respect? No difference.  Your liability is different.  That’s the only reason for the question. I’m fine with whatever conclusions you all reach.

I am more concerned whether Keefe is scarred than whether he was a bad actor when manipulated as an adolescent.  I’d still like him as a coach.

Which is why I MIGHT have reservations about him running a PeeWee or a Bantam team.  Far less concerned with him running an NHL squad.

[nfreeman]

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

That wasn’t an article; that was the reddit post.  Just for clarity, in a non-copyright situation like that, was it simply too much to paste?  So we should use links instead?

 

I agree with the poster upthread who said it was too long to copy entirely into a post here.

Here is the link to the reddit post:  https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comments/4vyd9y/wayback_wednesday_brampton_boys_the_four_horsemen/

And here is the only unsavory detail about Frost I saw:

Quote

While coaching the Hawks, Frost lived with Keefe, Tiveron, and another player in a room at a local motel. Rumours spread around town about the four and their partying habits, and the local high school girls often seen at the room. Rumours spread that it wasn't the players keeping the girls company. Other rumours sprang up, of physical abuse against the players. Both Jefferson and Keefe were seen sobbing after meetings with Frost, covered with strange bruises.

 

 

36 minutes ago, Torpedo Forecheck said:

https://torontosun.com/2012/12/03/ex-frost-disciple-keefe-looks-to-shed-baggage/wcm/c0f7b235-b400-4be6-b056-84c7aa14b8f9

This is yet another article that really sheds zero light on what exactly Keefe allegedly did with Frost.

[Sabel79]

This is the problem.  Keefe gets tarred (by some) with the David Frost brush, but there’s really no evidence he was ever anything other than a victim, like all the other kids. 

Just google Mike Danton.  The reddit thread posted buried the lede on this, he was the young Jefferson kid mentioned briefly (later changed his name).  The whole story is wild. 

To blame the literal children Frost took advantage of misses the mark entirely.   

[inkman]

It feels like there is a lot of info out there but it doesn't seem as if anyone ever surmized it in one place. The OP makes it seem as if Keefe is some sort of criminal or bad guy but nothing I've read really details anything he did. 

 

Scratch that. The Reddit piece covers it all. It would have been nice had the OP understood SDS's request and not post the entire article rather than abandoning it all together .

Edited May 13, 2019 by inkman

[inkman]

I wouldn't hold any of that past against Keefe but man has he gone through some *****. He has to carry a lot of baggage from that period of his life, a very formative time for sure. As a human, I have to wonder how it impacts his day to day actions.  

[Torpedo Forecheck]

43 minutes ago, Sabel79 said:

This is the problem.  Keefe gets tarred (by some) with the David Frost brush, but there’s really no evidence he was ever anything other than a victim, like all the other kids. 

Just google Mike Danton.  The reddit thread posted buried the lede on this, he was the young Jefferson kid mentioned briefly (later changed his name).  The whole story is wild. 

To blame the literal children Frost took advantage of misses the mark entirely.   

I remember being at the Fred Page Cup in Brockville when SK was coaching Pembroke. David Frost showed up, he is a big nasty looking guy and I believe he was banned at the time (no one was asking him to leave though). There was a buzz around the rink that it was him and he wanted back into Sheldon's life. Sheldon wanted nothing to do with him. They didn't speak and haven't in many years. He broke away from the cult, and it was a cult. I just remember him being there with his wife, who was pregnant at the time, and being extremely happy at the end. It says in one of the articles that Frost doesn't know his wife, doesn't know his kids. So in his day to day he could still deliver with him there.

Edited May 13, 2019 by Torpedo Forecheck

[wingnut]

Brad Richards witnessed firsthand some of Keefe's previous behavior on ice in the OHL, was a teammate of his later in the NHL, and I'm sure still has mutual friends and/or acquaintances. That's an opinion I would be curious to hear.