If fans could fire an owner, would you fire Terry?

[Stoner]

Bump.

[Zamboni]

Again .... no

[That Aud Smell]

Hmm.

Yeah. I'm getting there.

Not quite there yet.

[Stoner]

I think we can get to 30% by noon. Everyone casting a Yes vote will receive a Nina Totenberg bag and a Ted Black autographed urinal cake.

[Stoner]

Maybe the question could be: if Terry were a player, would you have moved on from him by now? Look at the history of the Pegulas/PSE and look at their current position as outlined in The Athletic. Aren't we looking at a top pick in year six who hasn't done anything yet — with the possibility of getting his act together now extremely remote?

[darksabre]

I need to know what position I'm in that allows me to fire Terry. Am I some kind of board member? God? An elected representative of the entire fan base? Do I also get to hire a replacement? 

[mjd1001]

As long as the Bills and Sabres are still here, I think most people, including myself, would say no, he stays.

However, that is really the biggest and only criteria where I would keep them here.  I have said for the last few years there are things about them I don't like, how they run the teams.  I just don't think they are that good yet as sport team owners.

If you told me you could get rid of the Pegula ownership and replace them with somene else, and the ONLY thing you knew about the new owners was that they would keep the teams in WNY, then I would say yes, make that move.

[Stoner]

20 minutes ago, darksabre said:

I need to know what position I'm in that allows me to fire Terry. Am I some kind of board member? God? An elected representative of the entire fan base? Do I also get to hire a replacement? 

Did you miss the "if"? Or do you need to know how this fantasy would actually work? Let's say you are the unseen hand directing all things Sabre — the Illumisabri.

[Stoner]

16 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

As long as the Bills and Sabres are still here, I think most people, including myself, would say no, he stays.

However, that is really the biggest and only criteria where I would keep them here.  I have said for the last few years there are things about them I don't like, how they run the teams.  I just don't think they are that good yet as sport team owners.

If you told me you could get rid of the Pegula ownership and replace them with somene else, and the ONLY thing you knew about the new owners was that they would keep the teams in WNY, then I would say yes, make that move.

That's kind of the only justification left, I'd say. The old "it'll never be about money again" appears to be gone.

OSP reportedly didn't want to sell until Terry came along, and then he sold the team with the contractual condition that the team would not move. Should the Pegulas decide to sell, I have to assume they would put the same condition on a sale. And that's without the league having its say about keeping a franchise in Buffalo.

However — it feels like things are shifting under our collective feet, so who knows if old assumptions still hold.

[mjd1001]

11 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

 

However — it feels like things are shifting under our collective feet, so who knows if old assumptions still hold.

Agreed. Right now we don't know what things will be like in the future.  

Next year at this time, things might be 100% normal, the way they have been for years.

Or, next year we might be dealing with no Bandits and Lacrosse league..maybe no AHL...an NHL with less teams, a good percentage of college sports teams no longer existing....The truth is probably someplace between those 2 scenarios....but nothing would surprise me now.

[Taro T]

29 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

That's kind of the only justification left, I'd say. The old "it'll never be about money again" appears to be gone.

OSP reportedly didn't want to sell until Terry came along, and then he sold the team with the contractual condition that the team would not move. Should the Pegulas decide to sell, I have to assume they would put the same condition on a sale. And that's without the league having its say about keeping a franchise in Buffalo.

However — it feels like things are shifting under our collective feet, so who knows if old assumptions still hold.

Yes, that seems to be gone in an absolutely unprecedented worldwide event.  We have never had the world simply shutdown intentionally before.  Ever.  

When the economy is back and functioning, fully expect to see them back more as they had been.  (For all the talk of belt tightening this past year people forget the Sabres were over the cap every single day this season.)

[nfreeman]

58 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

Maybe the question could be: if Terry were a player, would you have moved on from him by now? Look at the history of the Pegulas/PSE and look at their current position as outlined in The Athletic. Aren't we looking at a top pick in year six who hasn't done anything yet — with the possibility of getting his act together now extremely remote?

But this essentially assumes away the key point:  players come and go.  Owners willing to spend to the cap, fund fancy facilities, scouting departments, etc. for an NHL team in Buffalo are like unicorns.

 

44 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

As long as the Bills and Sabres are still here, I think most people, including myself, would say no, he stays.

However, that is really the biggest and only criteria where I would keep them here.  I have said for the last few years there are things about them I don't like, how they run the teams.  I just don't think they are that good yet as sport team owners.

If you told me you could get rid of the Pegula ownership and replace them with somene else, and the ONLY thing you knew about the new owners was that they would keep the teams in WNY, then I would say yes, make that move.

I agree with most of this, but the bolded IMHO needs the additional factor of being willing to spend what it takes to be competitive.  Ralph didn't do this for the last 15 years or so and the Bills became a joke of a franchise.  OSP didn't either and Black Sunday, followed by a generation in the desert, was the result.

 

23 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

That's kind of the only justification left, I'd say. The old "it'll never be about money again" appears to be gone.

OSP reportedly didn't want to sell until Terry came along, and then he sold the team with the contractual condition that the team would not move. Should the Pegulas decide to sell, I have to assume they would put the same condition on a sale. And that's without the league having its say about keeping a franchise in Buffalo.

However — it feels like things are shifting under our collective feet, so who knows if old assumptions still hold.

This is another huge and critical assumption that isn't borne out by the facts. 

[Stoner]

30.34!

[Pimlach]

On ‎4‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 8:51 PM, Zamboni said:

Besides the Knox brothers, Terry has been the best owner in the history of this franchise. 

Way better than John “jailbird” Rigas

Much better than Tom “penny pincher” Golisano 

no, I wouldn’t fire him 

Looking only at the product on the ice and Pegula is the worst owner in the group and it is not even close.  Ten terrible, pitiful, embarrassing, playoff-less years in a row is hard to do in the NHL. 

Rigas, according to my inside information, took the fall for his incompetent and spoiled kids.  As for Golisano, he saved the team and ran a good business.  Yes, he was tight with funds, but he ran the business better than the Pegula's. 

Looking at all the things Terry Pegula has done for the city and he gets a pass for his poor performance with the hockey team.  I just  wish he would find the right "hockey people" so he and Kim can stay at a safe distance from Hockey Operations. 

 

So I would vote  "No" but it was close. 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Pimlach

[Zamboni]

16 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Looking only at the product on the ice and Pegula is the worst owner in the group and it is not even close.  Ten terrible, pitiful, embarrassing, playoff-less years in a row is hard to do in the NHL. 

Rigas, according to my inside information, took the fall for his incompetent and spoiled kids.  As for Golisano, he saved the team and ran a good business.  Yes, he was tight with funds, but he ran the business better than the Pegula's. 

Looking at all the things Terry Pegula has done for the city and he gets a pass for his poor performance with the hockey team.  I just  wish he would find the right "hockey people" so he and Kim can stay at a safe distance from Hockey Operations. 

 

So I would vote  "No" but it was close. 

Meh... yawn. You have your opinion and I have mine. I too would still vote no.

[Pimlach]

4 minutes ago, Zamboni said:

Meh... yawn. You have your opinion and I have mine. I too would still vote no.

Sorry to bore you 

[Tondas]

I wouldn't fire Terry, but I would gladly consult with him on how to run a  professional, employee-centric organization that achieves results and makes money.  First of all, don't hire family or friends, EVER!

[Pimlach]

2 minutes ago, Tondas said:

I wouldn't fire Terry, but I would gladly consult with him on how to run a  professional, employee-centric organization that achieves results and makes money.  First of all, don't hire family or friends, EVER!

Remember the cronies from Penn State and Pittsburgh?   Battista and the likes lurking about when Lafontaine and Nolan were trying to get a rebuild started. 

I heard about them hiring their kids friends too.  Uugh. 

[Tondas]

1 minute ago, Pimlach said:

Remember the cronies from Penn State and Pittsburgh?   Battista and the likes lurking about when Lafontaine and Nolan were trying to get a rebuild started. 

I heard about them hiring their kids friends too.  Uugh. 

Yep.  Nothing kills a culture faster than nepotism.  

[Stoner]

1 hour ago, Pimlach said:

Remember the cronies from Penn State and Pittsburgh?   Battista and the likes lurking about when Lafontaine and Nolan were trying to get a rebuild started. 

I heard about them hiring their kids friends too.  Uugh. 

Good point. He started out hiring friends — his accountant, his PSU pal. And it was his accountant who hooked Terry up with Penguin contacts. Good ole boys.

[Taro T]

4 hours ago, Pimlach said:

Looking only at the product on the ice and Pegula is the worst owner in the group and it is not even close.  Ten terrible, pitiful, embarrassing, playoff-less years in a row is hard to do in the NHL.

Rigas, according to my inside information, took the fall for his incompetent and spoiled kids. As for Golisano, he saved the team and ran a good business.  Yes, he was tight with funds, but he ran the business better than the Pegula's. 

Looking at all the things Terry Pegula has done for the city and he gets a pass for his poor performance with the hockey team.  I just  wish he would find the right "hockey people" so he and Kim can stay at a safe distance from Hockey Operations. 

 

So I would vote  "No" but it was close. 

Wouldn't quite put it that way.  Would say it was more of a case of him trusting his Ivy educated greedy progeny to keep him from doing anything illegal and they failed him mightily.  (Remember, when the company was privately held, much of the crud they pulled was legal; but wasn't legal for management of publicly held firms to do.  And Rigas himself owned it for a long time.)

[Weave]

How has this thread not been resurrected yet?

Let's see those vote totals change now.

Edited June 17, 2020 by Weave

[Stoner]

Votes can be changed.

[Tondas]

Frankly, I'd fire Kim before Terry. Just because I think Terry knows his limitations, Kim does not..

[Radar]

Fire them both. May be the most lost owners of a sports franchise they are totally incompetent.