NEXT COACH should be? mega thread ...

[tom webster]

I googled Pegula balked at paying TM and got two hits.

Doesnt mean it’s true which is why I stated “hearing whispers” and used TP “supposedly balked”.

carry on

[dudacek]

I’m not on the no one wants to coach here train yet.

But I will say that unless the Sabres have one or more candidates (Keefe) they feel they must interview, chances are decent they have been rejected.

I will also say the “Tippett to Edmonton” whispers sound like something I would want my agent to plant if I was Tippett and interested in the Sabres gig.

The Keefe not interested from Friedman is very interesting to me. @Thorny was he speculating or reporting?

Edited May 7, 2019 by dudacek

[SDS]

1 hour ago, Thorny said:

I think that's a lie, I think Botterill is on the clock for massive improvement this year, but doesn't he have to tell it anyways?

There is nothing tangible to back up this statement, there is only your projected feelings. 

[Taro T]

2 hours ago, Thorny said:

Friedman on 590 said just now that his thought is that Keefe would say no if Buffalo asked. That if he leaves its for an "ideal situation". 

---

The more I think about it, I think the perception of stability is going to matter, here. I don't think Pegula has much choice other than to tell Botterill he's not on the hot seat and has time to build the roster he sees fit. 

I think that's a lie, I think Botterill is on the clock for massive improvement this year, but doesn't he have to tell it anyways? The incoming coach can't be thinking that the GM is potentially one and out, or that coach would be thinking he is too. 

Pegula has to lie right now, or commit to giving Botterill a timeline mulligan should this coming season be another fail. 

Unless the Sabres TRULY under perform again next season, I'd be surprised if Botterill weren't back at least 1 more season.  And, even if they did underperform, should that be due to significant Eichel injury, he'd be back again.

[Stoner]

5 hours ago, tom webster said:

I’m sure it’s out there. TP supposedly balked at paying a guy $5M when Edmonton was only paying him $3M and then fired him. 

People won't believe me when I say this, but I don't want this story to be true. I don't want Terry to look bad anymore. Because if it is true, it does show him as a meddling owner, an owner who doesn't trust his GM's judgment and an owner who's worried about the pegullions. I live in La La Land. When my GM goes to my owner and says I want this guy at this price, I want my owner to say, fine and don't call me on my yacht again.

[Marvin]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

When my GM goes to my owner and says I want this guy at this price, I want my owner to say, fine and don't call me on my yacht airplane again.

FTFY, based on available evidence. ?

[Thorner]

3 hours ago, SDS said:

There is nothing tangible to back up this statement, there is only your projected feelings. 

Yup, that's why I said "I think". 

Isn't that usually how these things go? It was speculation. 

Not to mention the fact that being on the clock for 1 good season out of 3 doesn't seem that far fetched. 

So, I mean, their record being bad for 3 straight seasons seems a rather tangible bit of information to me, anyways, should that come to pass. Which is what I'm basing my speculation on, that I believe Botterill could be done after another failed season.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Thorny

[Thorner]

2 hours ago, Taro T said:

Unless the Sabres TRULY under perform again next season, I'd be surprised if Botterill weren't back at least 1 more season.  And, even if they did underperform, should that be due to significant Eichel injury, he'd be back again.

If they aren't a bubble team he absolutely should be canned. To achieve nothing in 3 full seasons is not an acceptable level of job performance. They need to show substantial improvement, not just avoid underperforming. 

In my opinion. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by Thorny

[Thorner]

4 hours ago, dudacek said:

I’m not on the no one wants to coach here train yet.

But I will say that unless the Sabres have one or more candidates (Keefe) they feel they must interview, chances are decent they have been rejected.

I will also say the “Tippett to Edmonton” whispers sound like something I would want my agent to plant if I was Tippett and interested in the Sabres gig.

The Keefe not interested from Friedman is very interesting to me. @Thorny was he speculating or reporting?

Speculating. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by Thorny

[Taro T]

10 minutes ago, Thorny said:

If they aren't a bubble team he absolutely should be canned. To achieve nothing in 3 full seasons is not an acceptable level of job performance. They need to show substantial improvement, not just avoid underperforming. 

In my opinion. 

Depends how "bubble team" gets defined to frame how "truly underperforming" gets defined.  Either way, unless they're reasonably healthy and pushing for real good lottery odds, my expectation is he's back for the lockout.

[Thorner]

7 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Depends how "bubble team" gets defined to frame how "truly underperforming" gets defined.  Either way, unless they're reasonably healthy and pushing for real good lottery odds, my expectation is he's back for the lockout.

I hope injuries don't factor in. We were pretty healthy this season, especially relative to recent seasons, and it made no difference. 

I get that the consensus seems to be that we are judging Botterill based on the bar set by previous GMs here, ie - if Botterill takes 3 years to turn us from a tire fire into a tire fire with slightly less heat, that's a win, but If you told told me when Botterill was hired that in 3 full years he wouldn't manage to even get us to bubble status, I'd have said he was the wrong man for the job. How many would honestly say different?

As far as I can see, if we are sitting at 80-85 points in 20-25th place after next season, that's gonna be my view. 

Edited May 8, 2019 by Thorny

[Kruppstahl]

If the Sabres don't make big improvements this upcoming year, Botterill will be gone.

It will probably mean making the playoffs, but more than that, a lot of the player decisions he will be making this off-season are going to have to pan out with a competitive team in the playoff picture for most of the season.

That's a tall order.  This team is a long way away from being a solid playoff team and it routinely takes periods, games, and stretches of schedule off.

I think we'll be discussing what GM X needs to do to fix this mess, not Botterill, b/c Botterill will be gone before it does get fixed.

 

 

 

[pi2000]

39 minutes ago, Kruppstahl said:

If the Sabres don't make big improvements this upcoming year, Botterill will be gone.

It will probably mean making the playoffs, but more than that, a lot of the player decisions he will be making this off-season are going to have to pan out with a competitive team in the playoff picture for most of the season.

That's a tall order.  This team is a long way away from being a solid playoff team and it routinely takes periods, games, and stretches of schedule off.

I think we'll be discussing what GM X needs to do to fix this mess, not Botterill, b/c Botterill will be gone before it does get fixed.

 

 

 

I think you'll be surprised how much better this team will play with a competent head coach.

[dudacek]

23 minutes ago, pi2000 said:

I think you'll be surprised how much better this team will play with a competent head coach.

For all the flak Housley took down the stretch, I’m surprised this isn’t getting more play.

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, Taro T said:

Unless the Sabres TRULY under perform again next season, I'd be surprised if Botterill weren't back at least 1 more season.  And, even if they did underperform, should that be due to significant Eichel injury, he'd be back again.

I agree and it'd be a mistake to bail on the plan in the third year. Aside from Dahlin, you need a few years to really evaluate JBot's drafting. Ultimately that will sink or save him (and the team). However, if:

1. Skinner leaves

2. No FAs of any substantive value are added

3. there are no other promising rookie sensations added

and so we do as badly or worse, then I think he is out the door and we start yet again. Not saying it's a good idea or bad, just think that is what would happen in that scenario.

I still think we should have a hockey guy as an over seeing president and that should be the only guy who talks to and is talked to by Pegula but it is what it is.

 

On the coaching front  I suspect Edmonton will hire Tippett so at this point I think we get the Swede and fingers crossed if that happens cause, although he might be a good coach, we might have to bear the growing pains of a lack of nhl coaching experience. My pessimism is growing.

[LGR4GM]

I think the addition of a new coach will have profound impact regardless of whatever else gets added. 

[Thorner]

15 hours ago, dudacek said:

For all the flak Housley took down the stretch, I’m surprised this isn’t getting more play.

I honestly think most of the fanbase avoided the scapegoat mentality this season and are basically past that point in general with this team. For all talk of Housley being bad, most seemed to consider him one of several problems, not THE problem. 

[Radar]

59 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I honestly think most of the fanbase avoided the scapegoat mentality this season and are basically past that point in general with this team. For all talk of Housley being bad, most seemed to consider him one of several problems, not THE problem. 

Players need talent and motivation. In a long season the coach can make a difference in motivation and that involves how the coach utilizes the talent and keeps all those egos pulling together rather than apart. I personally think that's why Marv Levey was successful. Lots of talent with huge egos and he kept them together to work toward the goal of winning come Sundays. He wasn't a great coach but hired good men around him and had the respect of his players.

[French Collection]

22 minutes ago, Radar said:

Players need talent and motivation. In a long season the coach can make a difference in motivation and that involves how the coach utilizes the talent and keeps all those egos pulling together rather than apart. I personally think that's why Marv Levey was successful. Lots of talent with huge egos and he kept them together to work toward the goal of winning come Sundays. He wasn't a great coach but hired good men around him and had the respect of his players.

That's what I liked about Babcock, he took a boatload of talent to the Olympics and the World Cup and got them to buy into the program for the greater good.

It's probably easier in a short tournament for high stakes, but a Norris Trophy winner like PK Subban being the 7th D would probably balk at 82 games of that role.

Tippett is my first choice but I would not be upset if it was Gronberg. Keefe is third in my books because I've seen these next "greats" fail at the next level.

[Thorner]

I think I want Tippett. 

Going with a "swing for the fences" type play when you aren't even hitting singles seems ill-advised. I'd make that move once we've established a good team that cannot get over the hump, should it come to that. 

[Taro T]

47 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I think I want Tippett. 

Going with a "swing for the fences" type play when you aren't even hitting singles seems ill-advised. I'd make that move once we've established a good team that cannot get over the hump, should it come to that. 

My preference is: Keefe, then Tippett, then Gronberg (sp?).

No other names discussed thus far seem enticing.

[tom webster]

26 minutes ago, Taro T said:

My preference is: Keefe, then Tippett, then Gronberg (sp?).

No other names discussed thus far seem enticing.

I think this is where I’m at.

[Brawndo]

Dreger mentioned that Keefe will have a short window to interview with teams once his season is over. 

Friedman has some good reasons why Keefe would stay put as he is the next head coach of the Leafs.  The question becomes is he willing to possibly wait four years for the role.  A solid offer for a HC Position maybe better than the promise of one. Friedman mentioned his salary for the Marlies is probably north 400,000. Even if they go to a million, the Sabres can match or beat his salary. It comes down to whether coaching Eichel and Dahlin is considered an ideal situation. 

Lance Lykowski for the News mentioned there were some talks with Nate Leaman at the Frozen Four. 

[IKnowPhysics]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

A solid offer for a HC Position maybe better than the promise of one.

I think it is.  See also: Yzerman, GM.

[Brawndo]

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-1050/overdrive-hour-2-may-8th-1.1302780

 

Keefe was on TSN 1050, his interview starts at the 5:17 mark, they ask him about his interest in a NHL Job that starts at 16:00 mark

He mentioned other people decide when you are ready for an additional opportunity, the same thing he tells his players. 

He also states he does not lose perspective that there are many very good coaches outside the NHL, in the AHL, Europe and not employed and there are very few jobs in the NHL. He recognizes he gets the benefit of coaching in Toronto, but he knows there are a lot of quality candidates out there. He will continue to do his job and see what comes. 

It sounds like he will at least listen to what’s available when his season is over.