Fighting in sports...it's a thing?

[Claude Balls]

For all these high horse advocates who think fighting/violence in hockey is stupid, then why do you watch? Serious ***** question. It's been a part of the game since it's inception. It isn't going anywhere soon. You choir boys should just stop watching anything sports related other than tennis, golf or bowling. Every team sport, basketball, hockey, baseball, football, soccer, lacrosse has fighting. Get over it and move on. It's a losing battle to say it's not part of the game. It is and always has been. Give it a break, we arent changing anything, and I am fine the way things are. Even without the old goon days of the NHL. Flame away purse swingers.

[SwampD]

6 minutes ago, Claude Balls said:

For all these high horse advocates who think fighting/violence in hockey is stupid, then why do you watch? Serious ***** question. It's been a part of the game since it's inception. It isn't going anywhere soon. You choir boys should just stop watching anything sports related other than tennis, golf or bowling. Every team sport, basketball, hockey, baseball, football, soccer, lacrosse has fighting. Get over it and move on. It's a losing battle to say it's not part of the game. It is and always has been. Give it a break, we arent changing anything, and I am fine the way things are. Even without the old goon days of the NHL. Flame away purse swingers.

Mike Shopp dreams of a day when every game is played by robots that have pre programmed percentages and every play is just a reversion to the mean.

When the game is over, we all just say, "Yes, that just happened."

Edited March 14, 2019 by SwampD

[Claude Balls]

It's life, people have temper/emotions/snapping points. Violence/fighting is going to happen no matter what. Some people think they can change the world, but they can't. At least not in our lifetime. Accept it and move along. It's not that difficult. And Schoop is a major league moron. He's another one that thinks he can change the world. The last few weeks without him on WGR have been listenable. Bulldog isn't that bad on his own, and even better with Sal. 

[PerreaultForever]

I think that isn't true. It's not "part of the game" but it is part of the entertainment spectacle that it is. Having said that though, everything changes and I am pretty sure that eventually it will be gone or very very rare like the NBA for example. Don't get me wrong, I'm old school and still check hockeyfights.com regularly. I prefer the old days, but I don't think most women agree with that or lots of newer fans. Eventually it will be gone completely. 

[Weave]

6 hours ago, Claude Balls said:

For all these high horse advocates who think fighting/violence in hockey is stupid, then why do you watch? Serious ***** question. It's been a part of the game since it's inception. It isn't going anywhere soon. You choir boys should just stop watching anything sports related other than tennis, golf or bowling. Every team sport, basketball, hockey, baseball, football, soccer, lacrosse has fighting. Get over it and move on. It's a losing battle to say it's not part of the game. It is and always has been. Give it a break, we arent changing anything, and I am fine the way things are. Even without the old goon days of the NHL. Flame away purse swingers.

LOL “we aren’t changing anything”.  Hey, brah, you stop watching or something?  

[#freejame]

At all levels, hockey is an inherently escalatory game. Someone is going to get slashed in a way they don’t like it or cross checked in a spot without padding. They’re going to retaliate and then that person will retaliate and then fights happen. You could take fighting out of the NHL and there would still be fights in all levels of hockey because of that.

[SDS]

This is a perfect example of how out of touch a segment of hockey fans are...

1. “Sports”. Fighting is near non-existent in every sport except hockey. I have no idea what sports you are watching. Unless the existence of a single fight makes it “a thing” to you. Which doesn’t make it true. 

2. In 2003-2004 there was a fighting major given in 2 out of every 3 games. It is now 1 out of every 5. It’s already going away. Yesterday is gone. 

https://www.hockeyfights.com/stats

3. There are no enforcers left in the NHL. None. 

4. To anyone periodically emerging from the cave,  it is clear it is being coached out of the game at every level. Coaches no longer want to deal with highly skilled teams getting 5 minutes of PP time and the skill guys want to play hockey anyway, not tug on a jersey like a teenage boy.

5. According to the link above, the Buffalo Sabres are 16th in the league in fights.

Fighting is nearly gone from the NHL. The decrease in fights per game go down every year and it shows no signs of abating. 

[Pimlach]

Fighting in the NHL will continue because emotions run hot and things happen.   However, fighting will never return to the levels of the past.  Those types of players are becoming more and more extinct.   Teams no longer carry them in on their rosters  

Using the sabres as an example.  The Rob Ray policeman is almost extinct, only a few teams still have one.  The Mathew Barnaby type instigator is almost extinct, there is no one like that on most teams.

There are players that will fight, like Evander Kane for Buffalo. Most of today’s fighter also play in the standard line rotation.  

Edited March 16, 2019 by Pimlach

[sabills]

7 hours ago, Claude Balls said:

It's life, people have temper/emotions/snapping points. Violence/fighting is going to happen no matter what. Some people think they can change the world, but they can't. At least not in our lifetime. Accept it and move along. It's not that difficult. And Schoop is a major league moron. He's another one that thinks he can change the world. The last few weeks without him on WGR have been listenable. Bulldog isn't that bad on his own, and even better with Sal. 

IDK, I've managed to make it 32 years without punching someone in the face, or getting punched in the face for that matter, I don't think its "going to happen no matter what".

[Hoss]

If fighting was part of the game then why is it given one of the highest penalties allowable whenever it happens?

[SwampD]

7 hours ago, Hoss said:

If fighting was part of the game then why is it given one of the highest penalties allowable whenever it happens?

If fighting was not a part of the game then why was the lack of a fight seen as one of the watershed moments in the Sabres' recent past?

Edited March 14, 2019 by SwampD

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

9 hours ago, Claude Balls said:

For all these high horse advocates who think fighting/violence in hockey is stupid, then why do you watch? Serious ***** question. It's been a part of the game since it's inception. It isn't going anywhere soon. You choir boys should just stop watching anything sports related other than tennis, golf or bowling. Every team sport, basketball, hockey, baseball, football, soccer, lacrosse has fighting. Get over it and move on. It's a losing battle to say it's not part of the game. It is and always has been. Give it a break, we arent changing anything, and I am fine the way things are. Even without the old goon days of the NHL. Flame away purse swingers.

 

2 hours ago, SDS said:

This is a perfect example of how out of touch a segment of hockey fans are...

1. “Sports”. Fighting is near non-existent in every sport except hockey. I have no idea what sports you are watching. Unless the existence of a single fight makes it “a thing” to you. Which doesn’t make it true. 

2. In 2003-2004 there was a fighting major given in 2 out of every 3 games. It is now 1 out of every 5. It’s already going away. Yesterday is gone. 

https://www.hockeyfights.com/stats

3. There are no enforcers left in the NHL. None. 

4. To anyone periodically emerging from the cave,  it is clear it is being coached out of the game at every level. Coaches no longer want to deal with highly skilled teams getting 5 minutes of PP time and the skill guys want to play hockey anyway, not tug on a jersey like a teenage boy.

5. According to the link above, the Buffalo Sabres are 16th in the league in fights.

Fighting is nearly gone from the NHL. The decrease in fights per game go down every year and it shows no signs of abating. 

So we'll have to settle for the fights in the stands instead?

How do you suggest the league "protect" their investments (star players) worth MEGA MILLIONS?

Maybe we could hand out a trophy to every participant that plays in a game that doesn't have any violence in it.

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

1 hour ago, sabills said:

IDK, I've managed to make it 32 years without punching someone in the face, or getting punched in the face for that matter, I don't think its "going to happen no matter what".

But do you play hockey for a living and have someone hitting you with a stick, smashing your face into the boards, tripping you so that you crash into boards head 1st, cross-checking you in the throat for trying to win a battle in front of the net, charging you from behind like a bull, poking a stick in your jewels, etc.?

Oh, and I forgot....licking your face.

[MattPie]

 

4 hours ago, MakeSabresGrr8Again said:

But do you play hockey for a living and have someone hitting you with a stick, smashing your face into the boards, tripping you so that you crash into boards head 1st, cross-checking you in the throat for trying to win a battle in front of the net, charging you from behind like a bull, poking a stick in your jewels, etc.?

Oh, and I forgot....licking your face.

I know it's imperfect, but the league has to step on stuff like this. All those things are penalties, and some of them suspendable. But, nothing is going to get better until the dinosaurs in the league offices and in this thread are gone.

Also, congrats @Claude Balls, I think the 12-ish years I've been here your's is the first post I've reported. "Purse swingers" is insulting on a number of levels, but I'm not surprised.

[Hoss]

Do mods even pay attention to reported posts? I’ve reported a few egregious ones (egregious by even the least sensitive standards) and just seen those conversations continue uninterruped.

[SDS]

5 minutes ago, Hoss said:

Do mods even pay attention to reported posts? I’ve reported a few egregious ones (egregious by even the least sensitive standards) and just seen those conversations continue uninterruped.

Yes, we see them all because we get email and onscreen notifications when it happens. It really depends on the situation of an intervention is necessary. 

[Torpedo Forecheck]

7 hours ago, SDS said:

This is a perfect example of how out of touch a segment of hockey fans are...

1. “Sports”. Fighting is near non-existent in every sport except hockey. I have no idea what sports you are watching. Unless the existence of a single fight makes it “a thing” to you. Which doesn’t make it true. 

2. In 2003-2004 there was a fighting major given in 2 out of every 3 games. It is now 1 out of every 5. It’s already going away. Yesterday is gone. 

https://www.hockeyfights.com/stats

3. There are no enforcers left in the NHL. None. 

4. To anyone periodically emerging from the cave,  it is clear it is being coached out of the game at every level. Coaches no longer want to deal with highly skilled teams getting 5 minutes of PP time and the skill guys want to play hockey anyway, not tug on a jersey like a teenage boy.

5. According to the link above, the Buffalo Sabres are 16th in the league in fights.

Fighting is nearly gone from the NHL. The decrease in fights per game go down every year and it shows no signs of abating. 

Excellent Post! I couldn't agree more with everything stated. Played and coached hockey at many levels and the fighting was nothing more than a sideshow and an embarrassment to the sport. It was always a way to bring the talented players and teams down to the level of the less talented ones. Good riddance! If you want to see the brawls/fights I've been in and seen then go watch UFC and WWF. The game played with the speed and skill now has never been better and more pure. The fact is, what was allowed, and to the extent it was in the 70s/80s in particular, is because of expansion. So it wasn't always that way. There have always been the occasional scrap...still are...but it is emotion driven and controlled...not an intimidation tactic.

Edited March 14, 2019 by Torpedo Forecheck

[shrader]

6 hours ago, Hoss said:

If fighting was part of the game then why is it given one of the highest penalties allowable whenever it happens?

Quite honestly, I expect that penalty to become larger eventually.  In this day and age of concern over concussions, I don't know how they're going to be able to let people punch each other in the face and then play again later in the game.  Now I know that some will say that it can't be done, but just look at the NCAA.  That's a high level of hockey that gets along just fine without it.  Yes, it still happens, but they do it knowing that a steep punishment is coming their way.

[Tondas]

6 hours ago, Hoss said:

If fighting was part of the game then why is it given one of the highest penalties allowable whenever it happens?

Fighting in hockey earns the least penalty of any sport.  Every other sport it's expulsion and probably a suspension.  Fighting was always part of the fabric of hockey.

[nfreeman]

The OP is one of the worst posts I can remember on this board.

[steveoath]

I flipflop on the issue. It's exciting when it happens (especially live - EIHL is my in the flesh fix which follows broadly NHL tolerances). I like hockey as my whole family enjoys the game together, but I'm really uncomfortable when there's a fight when I have my 5 year old daughter is with us. I also think officiating needs to be more consistent across the league. 

[inkman]

1 hour ago, MattPie said:

 

I know it's imperfect, but the league has to step on stuff like this. All those things are penalties, and some of them suspendable. But, nothing is going to get better until the dinosaurs in the league offices and in this thread are gone.

Also, congrats @Claude Balls, I think the 12-ish years I've been here your's is the first post I've reported. "Purse swingers" is insulting on a number of levels, but I'm not surprised.

I keep telling everyone, it's a man's bag. 

Edited March 14, 2019 by inkman

[SDS]

35 minutes ago, steveoath said:

I flipflop on the issue. It's exciting when it happens (especially live - EIHL is my in the flesh fix which follows broadly NHL tolerances). I like hockey as my whole family enjoys the game together, but I'm really uncomfortable when there's a fight when I have my 5 year old daughter is with us. I also think officiating needs to be more consistent across the league. 

Have you read any post-career accounts of those who fought all those years for our benefit? It isn’t pretty. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/no-ones-cheering-me-on-ex-nhl-enforcer-battles-substance-abuse-concussion-symptoms-on-the-streets-of-surrey/amp

I’m perfectly fine leaving Thunderdome behind. These people don’t need to be punched in the face for me. Not that they actually do that anymore. As I have alluded to previously, it’s mostly jersey tugging and haymakers into the air. 

[SwampD]

19 minutes ago, SDS said:

Have you read any post-career accounts of those who fought all those years for our benefit? It isn’t pretty. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/no-ones-cheering-me-on-ex-nhl-enforcer-battles-substance-abuse-concussion-symptoms-on-the-streets-of-surrey/amp

I’m perfectly fine leaving Thunderdome behind. These people don’t need to be punched in the face for me. Not that they actually do that anymore. As I have alluded to previously, it’s mostly jersey tugging and haymakers into the air. 

I can't stand this argument. As we hear all too often on this site, correlation isn't causation. What were the alternatives for these guys? They're usually borderline fourth line NHLers that find a way to stay by fighting. If they weren't doing that they're all of a sudden going to become bastions of the community? Who's to say they wouldn't have had these same issues had they not fought?

[SDS]

1 minute ago, SwampD said:

I can't stand this argument. As we hear all too often on this site, correlation isn't causation. What were the alternatives for these guys? They're usually borderline fourth line NHLers that find a way to stay by fighting. If they weren't doing that they're all of a sudden going to become bastions of the community? Who's to say they wouldn't have had these same issues had they not fought?

Lol.  What are you actually saying here? That they would have dropped out of hockey and fought in the streets? 

 I don’t think this particular article alluded to it, but guys talk about how mentally hard it is to go onto the ice knowing they HAVE to start a fight with another human being.  I think Andrew Peters talked about this. 

I always have this vision of Jason Bourne sitting in the corner asking what the other guy in the corner did before he shoots him.

 I know it’s fashionable to say tough guys just go out and hit other people on command, but in the absence of alcohol I don’t think that is very  common.