Buffalo Bills 2019-2020

[LGR4GM]

Completely disagree on the Beasley criticism for that interception. That was 100% on Allen for a bad throw that was basically at Beasley's feet. Allen gunned that pass in there as well. Allen needs to throw that better. It is a short 10 yard throw. Get it up so your receiver can actually have a good chance on it.

4 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

This is the instruction on throws like those. Like I just said, Brady did the same thing. It's what you're supposed to do.

I disagree. It is looking at Allen with Rose Colored glasses. It was a bad throw with an unlucky result. 

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

Completely disagree on the Beasley criticism for that interception. That was 100% on Allen for a bad throw that was basically at Beasley's feet. Allen gunned that pass in there as well. Allen needs to throw that better. It is a short 10 yard throw. Get it up so your receiver can actually have a good chance on it.

Brady threw the same pass to his WR on the exact same route last night, because that pass is supposed to be low. And it hit him in both hands.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[LGR4GM]

1 hour ago, sabills said:

Agreed, but its still a bad throw:

Beasly is wiiide open there, and Allen puts it in the dirt from 10 yards away with little pressure on him..

I agree. It was a bad throw and people defending Allen on it is mind boggling.

3 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

Brady threw the same pass to his WR on the exact same route last night, because that pass is supposed to be low. 

I don't care what Tom Brady did. That pass is not supposed to be at the WR's feet. The nearest defender is still 2 yards away from Beasley when the ball is to him. Bring it up a foot. There's a difference between low and that low. 

Edited September 9, 2019 by LGR4GM

[nfreeman]

1 hour ago, sabills said:

Agreed, but its still a bad throw:

Beasly is wiiide open there, and Allen puts it in the dirt from 10 yards away with little pressure on him..

Negative.

The ball was at Beasley's knees, not in the dirt.  It was a bit low, but that pass, into that defense, is supposed to be low.

Those photos are indecipherable, but the TV replay from the QB's perspective showed that it was absolutely catchable. 

[Randall Flagg]

3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I agree. It was a bad throw and people defending Allen on it is mind boggling.

I don't care what Tom Brady did. That pass is not supposed to be at the WR's feet. The nearest defender is still 2 yards away from Beasley when the ball is to him. Bring it up a foot. 

Even if this were true, which it's not, that's where the pass is supposed to be in that situation, but even if it were true, would you bring the same criticism to the other QBs I saw turf footballs at their receivers' feet more than one time yesterday? Because their receivers didn't volley those passes into the arms of the waiting MLB. I'll give you a list of names that you can go into the 10 minute highlight videos and see make similar throws - Mayfield, Brady, Stafford, Rodgers, Rivers, Wilson.

Welcome to the NFL. The inteception was 100% Cole Beasley's fault. 

Edited September 9, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[LGR4GM]

I thought Allen made a lot of good throws and I think he showed a real good grasp of the offense. He made 3 mistakes that almost cost us and I hope he can iron some of those out. Overall it was good to see Allen make the throws he did. Some of them were very good and he did well. 

2 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

Even if this were true, which it's not, that's where the pass is supposed to be in that situation, but even if it were true, would you bring the same criticism to the other QBs I saw turf footballs at their receivers' feet more than one time yesterday? Because those receivers didn't volley those passes into the arms of the waiting MLB. I'll give you a list of names that you can go into the 10 minute highlight videos and see make similar throws - Mayfield, Stafford, Rodgers, Rivers, Wilson.

Welcome to the NFL. The inteception was 100% Cole Beasley's fault. 

I don't care what the other QB's did. They aren't Buffalo's. That interception is Allen's fault for a terrible throw. 

[LGR4GM]

I will go watch the replay of the throw in slow mo on the highlights to see if I think maybe Allen doesn't deserve all the blame. 

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, LGR4GM said:

I thought Allen made a lot of good throws and I think he showed a real good grasp of the offense. He made 3 mistakes that almost cost us and I hope he can iron some of those out. Overall it was good to see Allen make the throws he did. Some of them were very good and he did well. 

I don't care what the other QB's did. They aren't Buffalo's. That interception is Allen's fault for a terrible throw. 

It was a nearly perfect throw, whose only issue was that it was perhaps three inches off center of Beasley's body. it's a checkdown to a route that's about to get swallowed up by three tacklers, who can and will close the gap in your photo (still shots in moving sports are always borderline useless, see the Trubisky pic from earlier in this thread) in about a quarter of a second. I'm honestly shocked that you think QB's AREN'T supposed to sit their receivers down safely there. I've literally seen that exact play so many times. This is the first time I've seen the WR take the ball in their hands and then pop it up for the defender.

Just now, LGR4GM said:

I will go watch the replay of the throw in slow mo on the highlights to see if I think maybe Allen doesn't deserve all the blame. 

ALL the blame?? Even if it was low it hit a RECEIVER in the HANDS. 

 

[WildCard]

 

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I don't care what the other QB's did. They aren't Buffalo's. That interception is Allen's fault for a terrible throw. 

Tom Brady makes that throw the same exact way 100% of the time, he's literally the greatest QB of all time. Dismissing it simply because he doesn't play for Buffalo when the point of that comparison is to illustrate how a good QB would make that throw the same way Allen did is nonsense 

[LGR4GM]

3 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

It was a nearly perfect throw, whose only issue was that it was perhaps three inches off center of Beasley's body. it's a checkdown to a route that's about to get swallowed up by three tacklers, who can and will close the gap in your photo (still shots in moving sports are always borderline useless, see the Trubisky pic from earlier in this thread) in about a quarter of a second. I'm honestly shocked that you think QB's AREN'T supposed to sit their receivers down safely there. I've literally seen that exact play so many times. This is the first time I've seen the WR take the ball in their hands and then pop it up for the defender.

ALL the blame?? Even if it was low it hit a RECEIVER in the HANDS. 

 

It wasn't a perfect throw. You can scream this into the void until your voice gives out but I just watched in slow mo about 20 times on repeat. That ball should be a foot higher and to the outside of Cole. It was a foot low and too the inside. You can see Cole where he sets his hands as he breaks and where Allen delivered it. You want to assign blame, alight. Beasley is 30% to blame because he had a chance to catch it but it isn't a good throw. 

[sabills]

 

2 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Negative.

The ball was at Beasley's knees, not in the dirt.  It was a bit low, but that pass, into that defense, is supposed to be low.

Those photos are indecipherable, but the TV replay from the QB's perspective showed that it was absolutely catchable. 

Catchable is not good. That throw to Brown was catchable, but it was a bad throw, too.

If my WR needs to go to his knees to make a catch its just a bad throw. They brought in Beasley because the dude has a 50 foot catch radius because they KNOW Allen can't throw accurately. Beasley screwed up and could/should have caught it, but its a bad pass.

[LGR4GM]

4 minutes ago, WildCard said:

 

Tom Brady makes that throw the same exact way 100% of the time, he's literally the greatest QB of all time. Dismissing it simply because he doesn't play for Buffalo when the point of that comparison is to illustrate how a good QB would make that throw the same way Allen did is nonsense 

Show me the video. 

2 minutes ago, sabills said:

 

Catchable is not good. That throw to Brown was catchable, but it was a bad throw, too.

If my WR needs to go to his knees to make a catch its just a bad throw. They brought in Beasley because the dude has a 50 foot catch radius because they KNOW Allen can't throw accurately. Beasley screwed up and could/should have caught it, but its a bad pass.

That is all I was trying to say. Allen needs to make a better throw there. 

[WildCard]

8 minutes ago, sabills said:

 

Catchable is not good. That throw to Brown was catchable, but it was a bad throw, too.

If my WR needs to go to his knees to make a catch its just a bad throw. They brought in Beasley because the dude has a 50 foot catch radius because they KNOW Allen can't throw accurately. Beasley screwed up and could/should have caught it, but its a bad pass.

How is the throw to Brown bad? It's a back shoulder throw, Rogers does that all the time too

[Randall Flagg]

11 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

It wasn't a perfect throw. You can scream this into the void until your voice gives out but I just watched in slow mo about 20 times on repeat. That ball should be a foot higher and to the outside of Cole. It was a foot low and too the inside. You can see Cole where he sets his hands as he breaks and where Allen delivered it. You want to assign blame, alight. Beasley is 30% to blame because he had a chance to catch it but it isn't a good throw. 

To the outside? His route was a pivot and he was stationary. Why do you want him reaching his arms out? You're arguing about literal inches, maybe two or three, when a receiver took a ball in his hands and volleyed it up to a defender. Beasley is 100% to blame unless you expect your QB to be a perfect robot. He sat Beasley down like he was supposed to, and Beasley knew it which is why he was in an incredibly low stance as the ball was just leaving Allen's hands. That's just what you do on that route so you don't get killed. And I'm not screaming, I'm capitalizing the relevant words which highlight how I don't think you understand what is going on in that football play

Edited September 9, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[LGR4GM]

3 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

To the outside? His route was a pivot and he was stationary. Why do you want him reaching his arms out? You're arguing about literal inches, maybe two or three, when a receiver took a ball in his hands and volleyed it up to a defender. Beasley is 100% to blame unless you expect your QB to be a perfect robot. He sat Beasley down like he was supposed to, and Beasley knew it which is why he was in an incredibly low stance as the ball was just leaving Allen's hands. That's just what you do on that route so you don't get killed. And I'm not screaming, I'm capitalizing the relevant words which highlight how I don't think you understand what is going on in that football play

This is not true. The ball hits his hands and he is trying to catch it and it skips up. volley is a poor word choice IMPO. 

[Randall Flagg]

If you throw at a normal height to Beasley there, he gets popped in the back before he can turn around, and drops the ball, and probably breaks a rib. You sit your stationary receivers down on the ground with a throw, and Allen's throw was about 20 inches off the ground, into Beasley's hands such that he could fall to the turf with it while catching it and be touched down rather than blasted. Beasley, like he did in preseason, volleyed a football for a pick.

[LGR4GM]

Just watched every single throw Tom Brady made yesterday. All of the short routes were thrown at the lowest waist height. 

2 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

If you throw at a normal height to Beasley there, he gets popped in the back before he can turn around, and drops the ball, and probably breaks a rib. You sit your stationary receivers down on the ground with a throw, and Allen's throw was about 20 inches off the ground, into Beasley's hands such that he could fall to the turf with it while catching it and be touched down rather than blasted. Beasley, like he did in preseason, volleyed a football for a pick.

We aren't going to agree on this. We should move on. 

[Randall Flagg]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

This is not true. The ball hits his hands and he is trying to catch it and it skips up. volley is a poor word choice IMPO. 

I mean that's what I meant to indicate by volley haha - whatever it was, I haven't seen anything like that since I played football in like sixth grade, and it's slightly worrisome to me because Cole has done something like it twice now for interceptions in his few snaps he's seen since preseason started

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Just watched every single throw Tom Brady made yesterday. All of the short routes were thrown at the lowest waist height. 

We aren't going to agree on this. We should move on. 

Link? 

[LGR4GM]

3 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I mean that's what I meant to indicate by volley haha - whatever it was, I haven't seen anything like that since I played football in like sixth grade, and it's slightly worrisome to me because Cole has done something like it twice now for interceptions in his few snaps he's seen since preseason started

Link? 

 

There is a throw underneath just below the waist. But unless I missed one, Brady kept the throws up a little and to one side or the other. 

[WildCard]

@Randall Flagg 9:09 mark. Brady throws it low to the same route

Edited September 9, 2019 by WildCard

[Randall Flagg]

2 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

 

There is a throw underneath just below the waist. But unless I missed one, Brady kept the throws up a little and to one side or the other. 

This does not contain the throw I'm talking about because it's not every Brady throw, it's the game highlight video.

Liger, all of the routes in that video are crossing routes in which the receiver is moving and stays upright. I'm talking about a route where the receiver pivots and stops. Brady sits him down. 

[Randall Flagg]

Just taking a step back, try and see what I mean here. That football, in the picture, was caught by the guy circled in red, and you wanted to give 100% of the blame for the pick to the quarterback, and grudgingly moved to 70%. That is simply insane, even if that throw isn't supposed to be that low, which it is, which Beasley was even bracing for because he was already crouched to about four feet tall before the throw even left Allen's hands, because when you stop and pivot and have 3 defenders behind you, your quarterback's job is to sit you down so you don't get blown up.

[shrader]

10 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

This is not true. The ball hits his hands and he is trying to catch it and it skips up. volley is a poor word choice IMPO. 

While you're watching videos, go watch some beach volleyball.  Not only is a treat for the eyes, but you'll also see exactly what Flagg is referencing.

[Randall Flagg]

I also want to establish that I don't think Allen is some savior, and he's still incredibly raw to the point where my stomach clenches every time he lets go of a pass to a receiver I can't see on the screen. But damn guys we should be excited about yesterday

We should be talking about those passes to Brown, Sweeney, and the touch on that ball to Beasley that he dropped on the sideline

I don't think a single receiver had to break stride on a crossing route reception, even the ones 15 yards down the field

That's exactly what we worried about 

Edited September 9, 2019 by Randall Flagg

[LGR4GM]

9 minutes ago, WildCard said:

@Randall Flagg 9:09 mark. Brady throws it low to the same route

2 things. Brady is jumping on that throw. Josh had a clean pocket. The 2nd is that I think it was a better throw. 

8 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

Just taking a step back, try and see what I mean here. That football, in the picture, was caught by the guy circled in red, and you wanted to give 100% of the blame for the pick to the quarterback, and grudgingly moved to 70%. That is simply insane, even if that throw isn't supposed to be that low, which it is, which Beasley was even bracing for because he was already crouched to about four feet tall before the throw even left Allen's hands, because when you stop and pivot and have 3 defenders behind you, your quarterback's job is to sit you down so you don't get blown up.

Yes. 70%is on Allen because the threw the pass. A better pass and Beasley isn't doing any of the things you are mad at him for.