GDT - Maple Leaves @ Sabres - December 4, 2018 - 7:30 PM (EST)

[Randall Flagg]

27 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

You value something other than point production then.

I actually think you care more about this stuff than plenty of Sabres fans, even though I obsess over things like point production. If Jack never grew another ounce I'd be satisfied and never have to look at the 1C position on this team again over the next decade, focusing all my attention elsewhere, and he's going to be a better player 1, 2, 3 years from now than he is now

[Stoner]

26 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I actually think you care more about this stuff than plenty of Sabres fans, even though I obsess over things like point production. If Jack never grew another ounce I'd be satisfied and never have to look at the 1C position on this team again over the next decade, focusing all my attention elsewhere, and he's going to be a better player 1, 2, 3 years from now than he is now

I don't care that much about the scoring lists. But it does bother me to have to look down to 23 to find Jack. 30 something last year; 14 has been the high water mark. And in terms of shooting percentage, he's well on his way to 500th place. I hope you're right about more improvement to come, but I suspect it's going to be in the intangible areas like we're hearing about this year (good 200-foot player, strong captain, etc.).

[Rasmus_]

Back after a brief hiatus.  The game was definitely exciting and it was excellent to see Jack finally step up and get the puck into the net.  It was good to get at least a point, though we need to start finding ways to fend off pucks in the third after having a lead. 

[Randall Flagg]

32 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

 I don't care that much about the scoring lists. But it does bother me to have to look down to 23 to find Jack. 30 something last year; 14 has been the high water mark. And in terms of shooting percentage, he's well on his way to 500th place. I hope you're right about more improvement to come, but I suspect it's going to be in the intangible areas like we're hearing about this year (good 200-foot player, strong captain, etc.).

Is it mostly coming from what it took to get Jack? And how Marner is above him on the list while going 4th, an 85 point season for Barzal from the same draft at 15, Rantanen leading the league from 10, Aho over a PPG from the second round etc?

Because I share that resentment but it's leveled towards the tank 

[Randall Flagg]

I know it's not fair and sometimes deceiving to analyze snapshots in hockey, and I've loved Sam's play the last few weeks. But from the situation in this picture there should be a zero percent chance that Toronto gets the puck on their sticks before OT is over, much less winning it, and honestly a 33% chance that we should win the game on this developing play. Sam is not a good OT player at this point in his career.

[R_Dudley]

20 hours ago, R_Dudley said:

Just watching replays on Matthews goal did he close his hand on the puck ? Also did he almost drop it into the net but used his stick to tap it in? 

Anybody manning the DVR tonight?

So sorry busy work day and just got back to this thread so haven't read the thread since I dropped out last night but no one responded last night on page 14 when I asked this and this still bothered me so I just checked the rules. I apologize if already covered 
67.2 Minor Penalty – Player - A player shall be permitted to catch the puck out of the air but must immediately place it or knock it down to the ice. If he catches it and skates with it, either to avoid a check or to gain a territorial advantage over his opponent, a minor penalty shall be assessed for “closing his hand on the puck”.

I need to see that replay again because according to the rule and the distance traveled from one end of the net to other for the wrap around I do not see how Matthews didn't carry it and the goal was allowed.    

Now the NHL does have some fan boy love for Matthews for sure but not to the point of rules be damned.. 

[Jsixspd]

36 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

I know it's not fair and sometimes deceiving to analyze snapshots in hockey, and I've loved Sam's play the last few weeks. But from the situation in this picture there should be a zero percent chance that Toronto gets the puck on their sticks before OT is over, much less winning it, and honestly a 33% chance that we should win the game on this developing play. Sam is not a good OT player at this point in his career.

It almost looked like the Sabres figured "we're going to the shootout" and sat on their heels for the last 10 seconds of the OT.  I couldn't believe they just let them come down the ice and take a whack at the goal.   

It's all about playing a full period, a full 3rd period, a complete game etc etc etc.  Sitting on their heels is a bad habit the Sabres learned in their tank days that I had hoped they'd fully exorcised, but some remnants apparently linger unfortunately.     

Edited December 5, 2018 by Jsixspd

[R_Dudley]

9 hours ago, nfreeman said:

Holy mackerel.

That was a fantastic hockey game. 

I yelled at the TV and jumped around my man-cave more than I can remember doing for a Sabres game in forever.

Eichel probably isn't as good as Matthews (who IMHO is the best non-Gretzky goalscorer since Mike Bossy), but when the fire burns and he digs deep like he did last night, he might be.

Matthews definitely closed his hand around the puck on his first goal and secured an advantage in the way he moved it and placed it.  (Although I seem to think the rule on that has changed in the last few years -- not sure about that.)

Pilut may or may not get sent back down, depending on the health of Scandy, McCabe and Nelson, but he is an NHL defenseman and maybe a good NHL defenseman.

Sheary makes a big difference in the effectiveness of the 2nd line.  As others have said, though, they need Mitts to produce more if the Sabres are going to be a consistently good team.

Ullmark was really good.

Big picture:  the Sabres are a good, exciting, fun team again with good goaltending and the right guys at GM and HC.  Halle-freakin-lujah.

Ok caught up on the thread and see nfreeman has confirmed what I thought i saw yesterday.  According to the rule 67.2 I found should have been a penalty and goal disallowed. 

Final question(s) Is the coach allowed to challenge that play ? Who is manning the video for the Sabres and why don't they know the rules? ....

Come on TPegs you can afford to pay someone smart who can read and study and address this...

 

Yeah after Dallas foot in the crease not being called I guess I don't let things like this go easy.... /rant

[bunomatic]

1 hour ago, R_Dudley said:

Ok caught up on the thread and see nfreeman has confirmed what I thought i saw yesterday.  According to the rule 67.2 I found should have been a penalty and goal disallowed. 

Final question(s) Is the coach allowed to challenge that play ? Who is manning the video for the Sabres and why don't they know the rules? ....

Come on TPegs you can afford to pay someone smart who can read and study and address this...

 

Yeah after Dallas foot in the crease not being called I guess I don't let things like this go easy.... /rant

I don't normally rail on the officials but alas I do at times but the hand closed on puck by Mathews wasn't the only egregious thing they let go I'm still pissed about Marleau's late hit on Eichel. Real late. And Pierre gabalot went off on how good of a play it was as he ballwashed Marleau and the Leafs. O.K. rant over.

[Cityo'Rasmii]

Yeah,  Jack was pretty burned up about it when he got to the bench.  Did you see him throw his helmet?

Edited December 6, 2018 by Cityo'Rasmii

[Randall Flagg]

Concerning trend: The Sabres have won only four of their last ten games played against the Leafs.

[Taro T]

44 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said:

Concerning trend: The Sabres have won only four of their last ten games played against the Leafs.

Non-concerning trend: the greatest team since sliced bread (just ask the TO media) could only defeat a bad Sabres team 5 times out of 9.

 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

13 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

I don't care that much about the scoring lists. But it does bother me to have to look down to 23 to find Jack. 30 something last year; 14 has been the high water mark. And in terms of shooting percentage, he's well on his way to 500th place. I hope you're right about more improvement to come, but I suspect it's going to be in the intangible areas like we're hearing about this year (good 200-foot player, strong captain, etc.).

Last I looked (yesterday) Jack was 9th in scoring.

[Stoner]

26 minutes ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

Last I looked (yesterday) Jack was 9th in scoring.

Have we all really not agreed to go by points per game, the most fair way to compare players?

12 hours ago, R_Dudley said:

Ok caught up on the thread and see nfreeman has confirmed what I thought i saw yesterday.  According to the rule 67.2 I found should have been a penalty and goal disallowed. 

Final question(s) Is the coach allowed to challenge that play ? Who is manning the video for the Sabres and why don't they know the rules? ....

Come on TPegs you can afford to pay someone smart who can read and study and address this...

Yeah after Dallas foot in the crease not being called I guess I don't let things like this go easy.... /rant

There's no challenge for this. And I don't think it fall under the auspices of Toronto's review of all goals.

[Stoner]

13 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

Is it mostly coming from what it took to get Jack? And how Marner is above him on the list while going 4th, an 85 point season for Barzal from the same draft at 15, Rantanen leading the league from 10, Aho over a PPG from the second round etc?

Because I share that resentment but it's leveled towards the tank 

I don't think being dismayed by Jack's shooting has anything to do with the tank. Some of the disappointment is probably unfair — "we tanked for this guy, so he'd better be generational." The enormous contract plays into it as well. I'm hard on Jack sometimes. (Sometimes it's silly GDT juju.) But it's because I think he can be more than he is. He's getting there though. He's actually been more of a development project than I had expected. And if he's adding pieces to his skillset as he goes, a lot of the pieces might very well trump being in the top 10 in scoring.

Edited December 6, 2018 by PASabreFan

[Stoner]

13 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

I know it's not fair and sometimes deceiving to analyze snapshots in hockey, and I've loved Sam's play the last few weeks. But from the situation in this picture there should be a zero percent chance that Toronto gets the puck on their sticks before OT is over, much less winning it, and honestly a 33% chance that we should win the game on this developing play. Sam is not a good OT player at this point in his career.

I dunno, my friend. 16.7 is time enough for the Sabres to press, the Leafs to come back and threaten and the Sabres to respond and win the game. I get a little nutty in tense situations when I watch the clock. It's an absolutely terrifying aspect of hockey how quickly things can happen.

[LGR4GM]

15 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

I don't care that much about the scoring lists. But it does bother me to have to look down to 23 to find Jack. 30 something last year; 14 has been the high water mark. And in terms of shooting percentage, he's well on his way to 500th place. I hope you're right about more improvement to come, but I suspect it's going to be in the intangible areas like we're hearing about this year (good 200-foot player, strong captain, etc.).

His shooting percentage will come up. Jack's on pace for a really good year. 

Also remember that Austin Matthews was drafted 1st overall. He's really good too. As they enter their prime we will see who is better. Right now I would say Matthews is. 

Eichel currently shooting at 5.7%

Matthews currently shooting at 30%

Edited December 6, 2018 by LGR4GM
Adding info

[LGR4GM]

12 hours ago, bunomatic said:

I don't normally rail on the officials but alas I do at times but the hand closed on puck by Mathews wasn't the only egregious thing they let go I'm still pissed about Marleau's late hit on Eichel. Real late. And Pierre gabalot went off on how good of a play it was as he ballwashed Marleau and the Leafs. O.K. rant over.

Yea that was ridiculous. Eichel had tossed the puck away and had turned towards the bench before Marleu appeared and railroaded him into the boards. The refs let a lot go and Pierre is a terrible color analyse. 

Edited December 6, 2018 by LGR4GM

[Hoss]

8 hours ago, Randall Flagg said:

Concerning trend: The Sabres have won only four of their last ten games played against the Leafs.

This isn’t concerning in the slightest. Four out of ten is one off of .500 and they got an extra point in there. Need a little more differential in there to be concerned.

[WildCard]

I think I hate Matthews more than Brady

[LGR4GM]

13 minutes ago, WildCard said:

I think I hate Matthews more than Brady

Wait until the Olympics. 

[Randall Flagg]

1 hour ago, Hoss said:

This isn’t concerning in the slightest. Four out of ten is one off of .500 and they got an extra point in there. Need a little more differential in there to be concerned.

Anything below ~8/10 is not ideal.

Below 5/10 makes me want to die

[LGR4GM]

I think we need more Centers. The leafs main advantage is that they run Tavares, Matthews, Kadri down the middle and that is a really solid spine. While I still believe Mitts can get better and will, after him it gets a little hazy as to the center spot. We run Eichel, Mitts, Sobotka I guess, and then Larsson. Larsson is in the right spot but we really need to make sure we are developing more centers in case Mitts ends up on the 3rd line or to make sure our 3rd line is good. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Speaking of our friend Yuri (Randall mentioned running into him in the randomer thread).

The guy trolled the heck out of me, no doubt in an alcohol induced frontal assault, at 3:30 AM.  I found it in my mobile email account inbox at 10:00 AM.

He said that he is actively cheering for Dahlin to do very well and to get the Sabres into the playoffs.  That way his beloved Marner (he was right about him) and the rest of the Leaves can defeat the Sabres 4 more time in the playoff when they meet.  This will add to a grand sum of 8 defeats by the Leaves over the Sabres this season.

I like Yuri and he and I have exchanged some pleasantries over the time, but this time he has gone too far.

Edited December 6, 2018 by New Scotland (NS)

[Randall Flagg]

1 minute ago, New Scotland (NS) said:

Speaking of our friend Yuri (Randall mentioned running into him in the randomer thread).

The guy trolled the heck out of me, no doubt in an alcohol induced, in a 3:30 AM frontal assault.

He said that he is actively cheering for Dahlin to do very well and to get the Sabres into the playoffs.  That way his beloved Marner (he was right about him) and the rest of the Leaves can defeat the Sabres 4 more time in the playoff when they meet.  This will add to a grand sum of 8 defeats by the Leaves over the Sabres this season.

I like Yuri and he and I have exchanged some pleasantries over the time, but this time he has gone too far.

When did this happen, last night?

Seriously the Leafs can fall off a cliff