Trade: Ryan O'Reilly to St Louis Blues

[pi2000]

In 2008-09, his first year as an NHL head coach, Bylsma took over a Pittsburgh team that ranked 10th in the Eastern Conference with just 25 games remaining in the regular season. Under Bylsma, the Penguins went 18-3-4 to finish the season fourth in the conference before going 16-8 in the playoffs on the way to the franchise’s first Stanley Cup in 16 years.  Bylsma won the Jack Adams Award in 2011 as the league’s “most outstanding coach” following a season that saw Pittsburgh overcome adversity to post one of the best regular-season records in franchise history. The Penguins went 49-25-8 and won the Atlantic Division that season despite ranking near the top of the league with 350 man games lost due to injury, including 119 from the team’s top three forwards in ice time per game (Sidney Crosby-41, Jordan Staal-39, Evgeni Malkin-39).

 

But yeah... Bylsma sucks.

[Doohicksie]

Stop living in the past.

[Randall Flagg]

In 2008-09, his first year as an NHL head coach, Bylsma took over a Pittsburgh team that ranked 10th in the Eastern Conference with just 25 games remaining in the regular season. Under Bylsma, the Penguins went 18-3-4 to finish the season fourth in the conference before going 16-8 in the playoffs on the way to the franchise’s first Stanley Cup in 16 years.  Bylsma won the Jack Adams Award in 2011 as the league’s “most outstanding coach” following a season that saw Pittsburgh overcome adversity to post one of the best regular-season records in franchise history. The Penguins went 49-25-8 and won the Atlantic Division that season despite ranking near the top of the league with 350 man games lost due to injury, including 119 from the team’s top three forwards in ice time per game (Sidney Crosby-41, Jordan Staal-39, Evgeni Malkin-39).

 

But yeah... Bylsma sucks.

Bylsma had simultaneous historic performances from generational centers on that playoff run, and deserves credit too for a cup a decade ago. After admitting to sticking with Therrien's system for the rest of the season (a good coaching move he should get credit for) he implemented his system in Pitt and they were subsequently seen as the most disappointing team in the league for the rest of his tenure. The league changes and he didnt change with it. He withered when teams adjusted and watched his team free fall. He had no personal side and helped lead to the festering locker room issues because of it. Nothing about his time here, from his off ice attitude to on-ice tactics, were anything other than a colossal failure regardless of what happened last decade. Keep rehashing tired useless talking points though.

Edited July 3, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[pi2000]

Bylsma had simultaneous historic performances from generational centers on that playoff run, and deserves credit too for a cup a decade ago. The league changes and he didnt change with it. He withered when teams adjusted and watched his team free fall. He had no personal side and helped lead to the festering locker room issues because of it. Nothing about his time here, from his off ice attitude to on-ice tactics, were anything other than a colossal failure regardless of what happened last decade. Keep rehashing tired useless talking points though.

 

He took a last place 50 point Sabres team, with a rookie Jack Eichel to 81 points in his first season behind the bench... and followed that up with 78 points playing half the season without Eichel.   

 

Considering how well they played a modern system last season...  In your opinion, what would've been an acceptable result for Bylsma to stick around?   

[LGR4GM]

That's true, but BUF would still have ROR and Evander Kane and they'd be coming off their first playoff appearance in 8 seasons.

Bylsma is trash. We weren't making with his whiteboards and 0 personality.

[Doohicksie]

Even if you're right pi (and you're not, but just for the sake of argument)... that train has left the station.  Let it go.

[LGR4GM]

He took a last place 50 point Sabres team, with a rookie Jack Eichel to 81 points in his first season behind the bench... and followed that up with 78 points playing half the season without Eichel.

 

Considering how well they played a modern system last season... In your opinion, what would've been an acceptable result for Bylsma to stick around?

Nothing because he's garbage.

[pi2000]

Bylsma is trash. We weren't making ###### with his whiteboards and 0 personality.

 

I see you're still drinking the Hammy juice... how's it taste?

Even if you're right pi (and you're not, but just for the sake of argument)... that train has left the station.  Let it go.

 

Sorry, I'm bored and there's work I don't feel like doing right now.... 

[LGR4GM]

 

Remember that time Pittsburgh fired bylsma and then literally won back to back cups? Like I said, he's trash.

[Randall Flagg]

He took a last place 50 point Sabres team, with a rookie Jack Eichel to 81 points in his first season behind the bench... and followed that up with 78 points playing half the season without Eichel.   

 

Considering how well they played a modern system last season...  In your opinion, what would've been an acceptable result for Bylsma to stick around?   

Pi, the Sabres added FOUR TOP SIX PLAYERS between those seasons. Are you serious?

 

With and without Eichel last year the team had the same point pace. 

 

What about the 55 point pace in the last almost half of last season, with the players tuning out his dreadful system, made you think that bringing him back into the festering dysfunctional locker room would have gotten us a playoff spot? You still haven't answered. 

 

Never mind the fact that I put 50+ hours into stat, video, and photo evidence that we were playing garbage hockey to which you could only counter "But 2008! Michel Therrien's system! Bylsma basically never won a series with two generational centers after he put his in!" 

 

Phil being bad has no bearing on the last guy needing to go because of disgusting hockey making a disgusting locker room. 

[LGR4GM]

I see you're still drinking the Hammy juice... how's it taste?

 

 

Sorry, I'm bored and there's work I don't feel like doing right now....

I'm bored with you. Your argument is as old and stale as bylsma's coaching. Bye felicia

[Randall Flagg]

Even if you're right pi (and you're not, but just for the sake of argument)... that train has left the station.  Let it go.

The guy has mentioned Bylsma's name every goddamn day he's posted here since he was fired 2 years into the 2nd biggest contract a coach has ever signed. He's freaking obsessed for some reason.

[Doohicksie]

The guy has mentioned Bylsma's name every goddamn day he's posted here since he was fired 2 years into the 2nd biggest contract a coach has ever signed. He's freaking obsessed for some reason.

 

Well, he *did* play college hockey.  So there is that....

[Hoss]

Remember that time Pittsburgh fired bylsma and then literally won back to back cups? Like I said, he's trash.

To be fair they didn’t immediately win cups. They had another coach (Mike Johnston) in between Bylsma and Sullivan.

[pi2000]

Pi, the Sabres added FOUR TOP SIX PLAYERS between those seasons. Are you serious?

 

With and without Eichel last year the team had the same point pace. 

 

What about the 55 point pace in the last almost half of last season, with the players tuning out his dreadful system, made you think that bringing him back into the festering dysfunctional locker room would have gotten us a playoff spot? You still haven't answered. 

 

Never mind the fact that I put 50+ hours into stat, video, and photo evidence that we were playing garbage hockey to which you could only counter "But 2008! Michel Therrien's system! Bylsma basically never won a series with two generational centers after he put his in!" 

 

Phil being bad has no bearing on the last guy needing to go because of disgusting hockey making a disgusting locker room. 

 

To the bolded... My take is that the veterans liked Bylsma.. the young players (Eichel, Reinhart, Risto) didn't like him because he was stern, demanding and held them accountable (eg, Reinhart's benching etc).    The experienced vets understood Bylsma and his methods, and they believed in him... this caused a divide in the locker room... which I think has culminated in ROR being shipped out after he probably told Eichel something like "Thanks for running Bylsma out of town and brining in Housley to lead us to the basement... you entitled little prick".      

 

Bylsma may not have adapted his system to the modern NHL, but he did a better job adapting it to the roster.     They had more success with that system than with Housley's.     Coaching is more about adapting to your roster than trying to make round pegs fit in square holes... which is what Housley seems to be doing.

 

I'll concede that idea that Bylsma had his faults and those faults led to his firing... but... if he's certainly not garbage.    Easily the best coach this team has had (results wise) since Lindy.   

[TrueBlueGED]

This thread has really gone from one bad thing to another. If that doesn't epitomize Sabres hockey of the past decade, I don't know what does.

[LGR4GM]

To be fair, Pi loves Bylsma as much as I despise Bylsma. Ying and Yang

To be fair they didn’t immediately win cups. They had another coach (Mike Johnston) in between Bylsma and Sullivan.

That's a really fair point actually.

[Randall Flagg]

To the bolded... My take is that the veterans liked Bylsma.. the young players (Eichel, Reinhart, Risto) didn't like him because he was stern, demanding and held them accountable (eg, Reinhart's benching etc).    The experienced vets understood Bylsma and his methods, and they believed in him... this caused a divide in the locker room... which I think has culminated in ROR being shipped out after he probably told Eichel something like "Thanks for running Bylsma out of town and brining in Housley to lead us to the basement... you entitled little prick".      

 

Bylsma may not have adapted his system to the modern NHL, but he did a better job adapting it to the roster.     They had more success with that system than with Housley's.     Coaching is more about adapting to your roster than trying to make round pegs fit in square holes... which is what Housley seems to be doing.

 

I'll concede that idea that Bylsma had his faults and those faults led to his firing... but... if he's certainly not garbage.    Easily the best coach this team has had (results wise) since Lindy. 

Lindy is literally the first coach before Bylsma whose directive was to win hockey games. 

 

The first paragraph is entirely speculation that I'm not super interested in rehashing. It could be correct or completely wrong. 

 

I'm no fan of Phil, so you don't have to convince me of anything there.

[pi2000]

To be fair, Pi loves Bylsma as much as I despise Bylsma. Ying and Yang

That's a really fair point actually.

 

That's fair.   I'll try not to bring him into every argument moving forward.   That said, as a fan of hockey the way it used to played, it's disappointing to see how much hate there is for that man.    When all he really did was do his best to teach hockey the way he knows it.      

[thewookie1]

That's fair.   I'll try not to bring him into every argument moving forward.   That said, as a fan of hockey the way it used to played, it's disappointing to see how much hate there is for that man.    When all he really did was do his best to teach hockey the way he knows it.      

 

Personally, I don't hate the man, I hate the coach. He seems like a good guy, just not interested in bringing much personality to his job.

[Randall Flagg]

Personally, I don't hate the man, I hate the coach. He seems like a good guy, just not interested in bringing much personality to his job.

Completely agreed here. I hope he has success in Detroit. I'd bet assistant coaching is actually perfect for him. He can implement a Bob-Woods-inspired power play and implement skill-building drills I'm sure he has picked up without the pressure of things he's shown to be not good at. 

Edited July 3, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[LGR4GM]

That's fair. I'll try not to bring him into every argument moving forward. That said, as a fan of hockey the way it used to played, it's disappointing to see how much hate there is for that man. When all he really did was do his best to teach hockey the way he knows it.

I don't hate the man, just the coach.

[Jsixspd]

Excellent move.  O'Reilly symbolized the losing culture that had firmly established itself in the team's locker room.   Like a cancer, it had to be cut out, irregardless of expense or cost. 

He could have been a leader, but never truly was;  he spent time crying in his beer rather than making himself, and the team, better.   I won't miss him.        

Edited July 3, 2018 by Jsixspd

[nfreeman]

He took a last place 50 point Sabres team, with a rookie Jack Eichel to 81 points in his first season behind the bench... and followed that up with 78 points playing half the season without Eichel.   

 

Considering how well they played a modern system last season...  In your opinion, what would've been an acceptable result for Bylsma to stick around?   

 

No. Eichel missed 21 games, which is about a quarter of the season.  They went 7-9-5 without him and 26-28-7 with him.  And, on Feb. 18, they were 26-23-10 and on the fringes of the playoff picture -- and then fell off the table, losing 8 out of 9 (and 10 out of 12), and going 7-14-2 to finish the season. 

 

A well-coached team doesn't go to pieces like that.

 

 

To the bolded... My take is that the veterans liked Bylsma.. the young players (Eichel, Reinhart, Risto) didn't like him because he was stern, demanding and held them accountable (eg, Reinhart's benching etc).    The experienced vets understood Bylsma and his methods, and they believed in him... this caused a divide in the locker room... which I think has culminated in ROR being shipped out after he probably told Eichel something like "Thanks for running Bylsma out of town and brining in Housley to lead us to the basement... you entitled little prick".      

 

Bylsma may not have adapted his system to the modern NHL, but he did a better job adapting it to the roster.     They had more success with that system than with Housley's.     Coaching is more about adapting to your roster than trying to make round pegs fit in square holes... which is what Housley seems to be doing.

 

I'll concede that idea that Bylsma had his faults and those faults led to his firing... but... if he's certainly not garbage.    Easily the best coach this team has had (results wise) since Lindy.   

 

OTOH, I can totally see the first paragraph being an accurate theory of how it played out, and you are right that Bylsma got more wins out of the team overall than Phil has so far.

 

But like someone mentioned, the fact that Phil might not have the right stuff doesn't mean that DDB did have it.

[Huckleberry]

I think it was just a solid hockey trade.   STL wanted a top 6 center.    We got two experienced players whom can guide our younger core.

Got one of their better young guys and two high draft picks.   I also see Berglund and Sobotka as two players who make our kids fight for a roster spot.