Weave Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Bellows, #12 overall, and whatever for ROR. Bellows won't be what O'Reilly is, and #12 is a chance at a player that might develop into Ryan O'Reilly (or develop into Tyler Ennis, or Zemgus Girgensons) in 3 years. We likely lose that trade AND it won't be confirmed for 3 years. We need an ROR level player now coming back. Edited June 6, 2018 by We've Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Depends on the first and the prospect. You can't just call it a loss without even knowing who we get. It would have to be a first, a 30 goal scorer, and the best prospect in that respective team's org. That's my price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 "I understand that teams interested in him are being told that it would have to be very similar to the Mike Richards from Philadelphia to Los Angeles style deal that was circa 2012, it was six years ago.” Direct quote from McKenzie, not speculation on what might make sense. Inquiries have been made. The fact the speculation has continued lead me to believe there have been some return calls. I think it would be a mistake to dismiss all the talk as echo chamber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 "I understand that teams interested in him are being told that it would have to be very similar to the Mike Richards from Philadelphia to Los Angeles style deal that was circa 2012, it was six years ago.” Direct quote from McKenzie, not speculation on what might make sense. Inquiries have been made. The fact the speculation has continued lead me to believe there have been some return calls. I think it would be a mistake to dismiss all the talk as echo chamber. That's definitely a thing I didn't see. it's not a thing that appreciably changes my conclusion though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Bellows won't be what O'Reilly is, and #12 is a chance at a player that might develop into Ryan O'Reilly (or develop into Tyler Ennis, or Zemgus Girgensons) in 3 years. We likely lose that trade AND it won't be confirmed for 3 years. We need an ROR level player now coming back.Or 12 could be Barzal, Boeser, Pastrnak, Karlsson, and the list goes on. Idk what you mean by bellows won't be what ROR is. A center? A 60pt player? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Or 12 could be Barzal, Boeser, Pastrnak, Karlsson, and the list goes on. Idk what you mean by bellows won't be what ROR is. A center? A 60pt player? I think We've is right, though, that at this juncture we can't afford to trade one of our three good NHL forwards, the second-best one, the one we won't see another one in the same mold of for a long time (Peca -> Drury -> ROR), for 3 things, two of which are that who-knows factor (and a pick like 12 has a much higher rate of failure than rate of turning into a top line guy like those guys) which will take years to reach good-NHL-player status if they ever do at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Or 12 could be Barzal, Boeser, Pastrnak, Karlsson, and the list goes on. Idk what you mean by bellows won't be what ROR is. A center? A 60pt player? Could being the operative word. We know what O'Reilly is and unless management believes that HE is a major issue in the dressing room, there is no way he should be traded for a package that COULD in THREE (or more) years be more valuable than ROR is NOW. (& ftr, haven't seen anything yet convincing enough to believe that management believes he's creating issues holding this team back.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Or 12 could be Barzal, Boeser, Pastrnak, Karlsson, and the list goes on. Idk what you mean by bellows won't be what ROR is. A center? A 60pt player? You're right. 12 could be all that too. I don't want to gamble with a player like ROR. We need an ROR level player coming back, not a lottery ticket. I don't expect Bellows to develop into the player of the stature O'Reilly has become. IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. I might even stop getting mad in here if this comes to pass. Or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. Hadn't thought about that, but I think you're right. How long did it take the Flyers to rebound from the Carter/Richards trades? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 You're right. 12 could be all that too. I don't want to gamble with a player like ROR. We need an ROR level player coming back, not a lottery ticket. I don't expect Bellows to develop into the player of the stature O'Reilly has become. I might even stop getting mad in here if this comes to pass. Or not. What do you mean? He won't be a 60pt player? He won't be good 5v5? Maybe a better question and I guess more to what I want to know, what is ROR. Also there's this https://www.thescreen.co/single-post/2018/06/05/Turns-Out-Good-Players-Play-Better-With-Other-Good-Players-The-Sam-Reinhart-and-Ryan-OReilly-Story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsb Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Skinner, Hanifin, 2nd round pick for ROR & Bailey/Girgensons, anything less than that is a no no in my book. You then have Risto-Dahlin-Guhle-Hanifin as your top 4 of the future, pick up a UFA center to get you thru until Casey is ready to be a #2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. I think if the McKenzie quote is to be taken seriously, Botterill is looking for players of an age with Sam and Jack, more so than picks. Hanifin and Lindholm would fit the profile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winston Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Go big or go home... ROR for PK #hockeytrade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 I think if the McKenzie quote is to be taken seriously, Botterill is looking for players of an age with Sam and Jack, more so than picks. Hanifin and Lindholm would fit the profile. Sign me up for Hanifin and Lindholm, probably with some kind of an add from our side. If it's only one or the other, I'm likely not interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 That trade happened in 2011, the Flyers made the 2nd round of the playoffs the season after the trade happened. They haven't made it out of the 1st roudn since and missed completely 3 times. Hmmm way better than I thought. Still there are other factors with that. FA, their stockpile of prospects and talent before the trade, etc. Still, gives me hope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Go big or go home... ROR for PK #hockeytrade I think...I think it moved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Go big or go home... ROR for PK #hockeytrade Sign me up for Hanifin and Lindholm, probably with some kind of an add from our side. If it's only one or the other, I'm likely not interested I think...I think it moved. Our forwards are abysmal and we're getting Dahlin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darryl Shannon's +/- Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. Depends on how you define compete. I hope our gm counts that as being able to contend for the cup, and not limping into the playoffs. If that's the case, we are 2-3 away. And ROR is not part of that picture. Trade him while his value is high, and also when the real money remaining on his contract will be a windfall to an owner worried about cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Our forwards are abysmal and we're getting Dahlin This is true, but Subban is straight up better than O'Reilly. You make the move then figure out a subsequent move to balance it, with Risto being the most logical chip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) This is true, but Subban is straight up better than O'Reilly. You make the move then figure out a subsequent move to balance it, with Risto being the most logical chip. It would depend a lot on who that is. Risto and RoR are signed long term here and are relatively cheap. Subban carries a $9M cap hit through 2021. Edit: A team can't just be a collection of superstars, you have to have cheap talent and depth throughout Edited June 6, 2018 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Go big or go home... ROR for PK #hockeytrade Honestly, that doesn't interest me. I really need a big time winger if we're trading O'Reilly. It needs to be Aho from Carolina. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 It would depend a lot on who that is. Risto and RoR are signed long term here and are relatively cheap. Subban carries a $9M cap hit through 2021 Which is fine for a Norris-caliber defender. I'm really curious as to what Risto's market value would be for a young forward. It would depend a lot on who that is. Risto and RoR are signed long term here and are relatively cheap. Subban carries a $9M cap hit through 2021. Edit: A team can't just be a collection of superstars, you have to have cheap talent and depth throughout Right, but we're not sacrificing depth in the hypothetical here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Which is fine for a Norris-caliber defender. I'm really curious as to what Risto's market value would be for a young forward. Right, but we're not sacrificing depth in the hypothetical here. I think any move trading Risto means an enormous sacrifice in cheap depth. I really, really don't want to move him. And it seems any RoR trade necessitates that, so I don't want to move RoR either as a consequence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Honestly, that doesn't interest me. I really need a big time winger if we're trading O'Reilly. It needs to be Aho from Carolina. Only way I'm moving O'Reilly for a winger is if the winger is better than O'Reilly is at center. Has to be an player upgrade to offset the reduced positional value. Aho fits the bill, but no way Carolina moves him. I think any move trading Risto means an enormous sacrifice in cheap depth. I really, really don't want to move him. And it seems any RoR trade necessitates that, so I don't want to move RoR either as a consequence Risto isn't cheap depth. He's paid to be a top pair defender. How many teams have 2-3 defensemen making more than him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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