Buffalo Bills 2018-2019

[WildCard]

2 minutes ago, SwampD said:

I only see one. And even that, the receiver made no effort to play D.

 

 

[SwampD]

10 minutes ago, WildCard said:

lol meh all ya want, here's all 12 of them. I count 3 deflected. The rest? Terrible passes (overthrows) and like I described above, bad throws to the outside or from distances; one of the Chargers' one, the Ramsey one, and the two Texans' picks

https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2018/11/13/18092454/nathan-peterman-buffalo-bills-interception-ranking

This is exactly what I'm talking about. This is an NFL throw an NFL qb has to make. He simply can't. It's not McDermott's fault, or anyone else's, that he doesn't have the arm to make this throw

 

 

I disagreed with 8 and 9 and I know of another that I couldn't view that wasn't his fault, so I think the whole piece is crap.

I'm guessing you've already decided on Allen and that he is crap.

McClappy sux.

[WildCard]

24 minutes ago, SwampD said:

I disagreed with 8 and 9 and I know of another that I couldn't view that wasn't his fault, so I think the whole piece is crap.

I'm guessing you've already decided on Allen and that he is crap.

McClappy sux.

How is that what you've inferred from this discussion?

Edited November 15, 2018 by WildCard

[That Aud Smell]

Potshots at N. Peterman from J. Peterman are weak sauce, but hardly bullying.

Words matter. Their meanings matter. Peterman is not being bullied there. He’s being mocked in a mean spirited, and fairly unfunny, way.

[That Aud Smell]

6 hours ago, SwampD said:

We'll never know, because the group of people who have universally been slammed for not knowing their ass from a hole in the ground when it come to offense, were in charge of his development to this point.

McDermott’s bad with the O. But, Holy Moses Jesus in a Christmas basket, he’s not Peterman-might-actually-be-good bad with the O. A washed up journeyman off the street came in and did stuff with the same plays and personnel on a week’s notice.

[Eleven]

I'm not sure which is dumber: the video itself or the "controversy" about it.

[LTS]

40 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I'm not sure which is dumber: the video itself or the "controversy" about it.

I do think it speaks volumes as to what passes for entertainment these days.  The fact that SI feels the need to go in that direction is a testament to what people look for out of their media outlets.  Nathan Peterman deserved a wrap-up article describing his inability to perform as a QB in the NFL.  He doesn't deserve this kind of treatment.  He was never supposed to be a gifted football player.  He was never supposed to be a starting QB of the highest order. He wasn't drafted #2 overall.

He was asked to be a QB of a pathetic football team and when he failed he was mocked.  The O-Line is crap, the WR are crap, the offensive coordinator is crap and the coach like to clap. Sadly Nathan Peterman is being made the punchline of the joke that is the Buffalo Bills.

The way I see it.  The guy had a dream of playing in the NFL.  He achieved the dream. He wasn't good at it.  He might have been able to be decent at it if he was on a team that wasn't loaded with non-football talent.  He might not have been.  However it works out, he made it to the NFL.  Move on.  Mocking his performance does nothing more than remind all fans of just how sad their football team really is.

3 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

McDermott’s bad with the O. But, Holy Moses Jesus in a Christmas basket, he’s not Peterman-might-actually-be-good bad with the O. A washed up journeyman off the street came in and did stuff with the same plays and personnel on a week’s notice.

Against a pathetic team.  Let's be real here.  The Jets are a bigger joke than the Bills.  The Jets had the ultimate in never gonna make it QBs playing for them.  McCown is the measuring stick of Nathan Petermans in the NFL.  They have no defense, no offense.  It's not like there was much to overcome.

[That Aud Smell]

2 minutes ago, LTS said:

Against a pathetic team.  Let's be real here.  The Jets are a bigger joke than the Bills.  The Jets had the ultimate in never gonna make it QBs playing for them.  McCown is the measuring stick of Nathan Petermans in the NFL.  They have no defense, no offense.  It's not like there was much to overcome.

The idea that Peterman would have performed about the same in that game is laughable. 

I understand and even agree with people having some sympathy for the guy -- Sal Capaccio at WGR spoke well to the issue -- but I'm perplexed by the emerging narrative that Peterman could have been, might still be a good NFL quarterback, and, to this point in time, has had that opportunity dashed by McDermott & Co.

Also: The Jets D is dispirited from what I can tell, but they have some decent personnel on that side of the ball.

[LTS]

2 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

The idea that Peterman would have performed about the same in that game is laughable. 

I understand and even agree with people having some sympathy for the guy -- Sal Capaccio at WGR spoke well to the issue -- but I'm perplexed by the emerging narrative that Peterman could have been, might still be a good NFL quarterback, and, to this point in time, has had that opportunity dashed by McDermott & Co.

Also: The Jets D is dispirited from what I can tell, but they have some decent personnel on that side of the ball.

I didn't say he would perform the same.  Not sure what you are laughing at.

I didn't say he could be a good NFL QB.. I said decent.

And the Jets D, despite whatever "decent" personnel they have.. still got lit up by a team that sucks.  

My whole point is that using the Jets as a measuring stick for your "schlub off the street" isn't really saying much.  The Jets blow... hard.  How much better do you think the Bills would have been with your schlub if he had played against the Bears?

[shrader]

3 hours ago, That Aud Smell said:

Potshots at N. Peterman from J. Peterman are weak sauce, but hardly bullying.

Words matter. Their meanings matter. Peterman is not being bullied there. He’s being mocked in a mean spirited, and fairly unfunny, way.

I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, but at least to me, all the Peterman stuff has been a bit over the top.  I've heard comments from a few people, things along the lines of "he's the worst QB I've ever seen", yet they never actually watched a game.  It's all a bit pointless.

[LGR4GM]

Why are we even still talking about him? He's gone, good riddance. 

[That Aud Smell]

1 hour ago, LTS said:

I didn't say he would perform the same.  Not sure what you are laughing at.

I didn't say he could be a good NFL QB.. I said decent.

Well, I'm definitely unsure of what you're saying, then.

My point is as stated above: Peterman's demonstrated himself to be spectacularly incapable of playing QB in the NFL. (And there is no shame in that.)

The fact that McDermott and his coaches on the O-side of the ball have failed in putting together a modern NFL offence doesn't, to me, suggest that Peterman's lost out on an opportunity to become an NFL QB (because he was drafted by and played for McDermott). On the contrary, the fact that McDermott selected and then believed in Peterman as an NFL QB is symptomatic of the incompetence that McDermott has exhibited with regards to offence in the NFL.

[inkman]

59 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said:

Well, I'm definitely unsure of what you're saying, then.

My point is as stated above: Peterman's demonstrated himself to be spectacularly incapable of playing QB in the NFL. (And there is no shame in that.)

The fact that McDermott and his coaches on the O-side of the ball have failed in putting together a modern NFL offence doesn't, to me, suggest that Peterman's lost out on an opportunity to become an NFL QB (because he was drafted by and played for McDermott). On the contrary, the fact that McDermott selected and then believed in Peterman as an NFL QB is symptomatic of the incompetence that McDermott has exhibited with regards to offence in the NFL.

And your use of the letter "c" in the word offense is symptomatic of being Canadian. 

[That Aud Smell]

10 minutes ago, inkman said:

And your use of the letter "c" in the word offense is symptomatic of being Canadian. 

Merely an honourary one, I hope.

[Hoss]

21 hours ago, FuhrUrsinne said:

 

Or maybe he's just providing an alternative point of view for a message board that tends to be heavily biased against this current regime...much more so than the average Bills fan.

I would argue that they're doing a very good job, except for the singular - and absolutely catastrophic - decision to treat Nate Peterman as if he's a capable NFL QB. The vast majority of poor on-field performances and off-field executive moves stem from the nightmare that is/was Nate Peterman.

I mean the WR corps, lack of a good offensive line and lack of depth at corner are all other areas where they’re not doing a good job in. Also, Nate Peterman is not the lone bad decision made at quarterback.

[inkman]

47 minutes ago, Hoss said:

I mean the WR corps, lack of a good offensive line and lack of depth at corner are all other areas where they’re not doing a good job in. Also, Nate Peterman is not the lone bad decision made at quarterback.

Based on the current decision making, I'm trying to figure out who decided to trade Tyrod. You'd think McBeane would love them some TT. Maybe Kim made that decision.

[JohnRobertEichel]

4 hours ago, Hoss said:

I mean the WR corps, lack of a good offensive line and lack of depth at corner are all other areas where they’re not doing a good job in. Also, Nate Peterman is not the lone bad decision made at quarterback.

Fine, but are you also willing to acknowledge that Beane and McDermott can't address every position adequately in two off-seasons? I'm pretty sure the plan has been to fully deal with WR, OL, and the #2 CB in the spring when they will have $90 million cap space and 10 draft picks to use.

Can you also acknowledge that the sudden unexpected retirements of Wood, Incognito, and Vontae Davis might have further constrained their plans? Or that Kelvin Benjamin's strange, precipitous drop from top-25 NFL WR to lazy, marginal practice squader affects how the rest of the WR corps perform? And are you able to give a little credit for Beane and McDermott attempting to improve the WR's by adding Foster, McKenzie, and Thompson for their speed? Or how about the emergence of Wyatt Teller at LG? Or Johnson at slot CB? Or White as a top-5 NFL CB? Levi Wallace at outside CB? Or for that matter, how about the job he's done at creating the #1 NFL defense after facing a very difficult first-half schedule?

I definitely should have reworded my post so as not to suggest Peterman was the only bad decision they've made. However, all of the bad decisions at QB that they've made are kind of related to him. Benching Tyrod last year, trading Tyrod, trading McCarron before the first game, starting Allen too early in his career, forcing Anderson onto the field a week after picking him up off the streets...they all kind of stem from the singular, wrong idea that Peterman is a capable NFL QB. Even the worst-in-NFL-history WR corps and OL looked adequate when Barkley took over behind center.

I just want to reiterate that I'm not a Beane/McDermott apologist; however, there is certainly valid room for opinions on this message board that are looking at the long-term picture and are waiting to pass judgment until more data is gathered. I'll revisit this topic after the next 6 games are played. I expect to see non-trivial improvement from the offense and from Allen after all the bye week changes have been made. I also expect more wins now that we are playing the easier half of the schedule. If not....well then....

 

 

[Samson's Flow]

15 hours ago, FuhrUrsinne said:

Fine, but are you also willing to acknowledge that Beane and McDermott can't address every position adequately in two off-seasons? I'm pretty sure the plan has been to fully deal with WR, OL, and the #2 CB in the spring when they will have $90 million cap space and 10 draft picks to use.

Can you also acknowledge that the sudden unexpected retirements of Wood, Incognito, and Vontae Davis might have further constrained their plans? Or that Kelvin Benjamin's strange, precipitous drop from top-25 NFL WR to lazy, marginal practice squader affects how the rest of the WR corps perform? And are you able to give a little credit for Beane and McDermott attempting to improve the WR's by adding Foster, McKenzie, and Thompson for their speed? Or how about the emergence of Wyatt Teller at LG? Or Johnson at slot CB? Or White as a top-5 NFL CB? Levi Wallace at outside CB? Or for that matter, how about the job he's done at creating the #1 NFL defense after facing a very difficult first-half schedule?

I definitely should have reworded my post so as not to suggest Peterman was the only bad decision they've made. However, all of the bad decisions at QB that they've made are kind of related to him. Benching Tyrod last year, trading Tyrod, trading McCarron before the first game, starting Allen too early in his career, forcing Anderson onto the field a week after picking him up off the streets...they all kind of stem from the singular, wrong idea that Peterman is a capable NFL QB. Even the worst-in-NFL-history WR corps and OL looked adequate when Barkley took over behind center.

I just want to reiterate that I'm not a Beane/McDermott apologist; however, there is certainly valid room for opinions on this message board that are looking at the long-term picture and are waiting to pass judgment until more data is gathered. I'll revisit this topic after the next 6 games are played. I expect to see non-trivial improvement from the offense and from Allen after all the bye week changes have been made. I also expect more wins now that we are playing the easier half of the schedule. If not....well then....

 

 

I'm as frustrated as the next guy, but I would echo a lot of what Fuhr mentioned here. The offensive ineptitude was kind of a snowball effect where the OL retirements/injurys really hurt the ability to rely on the running game, which exposed the WR's when they couldn't pick up the slack. At the beginning of the offseason there was a realistic opportunity to have a middling offense (#20-15 type rank) by playing a ball control & minimize mistakes strategy. That isn't sexy, but it would have been good enough for us to be competitive in every game. 

The sudden deterioration and/or loss of Incognito, Wood, McCoy and Benjamin really hurt the Bills, and I don't think they could have anticipated all of those happening in the same season. (Maybe McCoy's struggles as he hits the 30yr old wall + last years high carry count).

The QB decisions were and continue to be an unmitigated disaster, but remember we were singing their praises in the offseason for not overpaying for Bradford, Keenum, etc. which appears to have been a good assessment.

I'm not ready to fire everyone just yet...

[LGR4GM]

If you are going to draft a rookie QB, the first thing you do, make sure your Oline is solid. 

[JohnRobertEichel]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

If you are going to draft a rookie QB, the first thing you do, make sure your Oline is solid. 

Ideally? Yes, of course. External factors, however, will dictate the order in which a roster can be built. Namely, the draft year in which franchise QB's can be selected. Beane and McDermott weren't impressed with the QB options in 2017 or 2019, but they were for 2018. Should they not have sat at #10 and picked Mahomes last season even though the OL wasn't properly constructed?

[TrueBlueGED]

On 11/15/2018 at 5:31 PM, FuhrUrsinne said:

Fine, but are you also willing to acknowledge that Beane and McDermott can't address every position adequately in two off-seasons? I'm pretty sure the plan has been to fully deal with WR, OL, and the #2 CB in the spring when they will have $90 million cap space and 10 draft picks to use.

Can you also acknowledge that the sudden unexpected retirements of Wood, Incognito, and Vontae Davis might have further constrained their plans? Or that Kelvin Benjamin's strange, precipitous drop from top-25 NFL WR to lazy, marginal practice squader affects how the rest of the WR corps perform? And are you able to give a little credit for Beane and McDermott attempting to improve the WR's by adding Foster, McKenzie, and Thompson for their speed? Or how about the emergence of Wyatt Teller at LG? Or Johnson at slot CB? Or White as a top-5 NFL CB? Levi Wallace at outside CB? Or for that matter, how about the job he's done at creating the #1 NFL defense after facing a very difficult first-half schedule?

I definitely should have reworded my post so as not to suggest Peterman was the only bad decision they've made. However, all of the bad decisions at QB that they've made are kind of related to him. Benching Tyrod last year, trading Tyrod, trading McCarron before the first game, starting Allen too early in his career, forcing Anderson onto the field a week after picking him up off the streets...they all kind of stem from the singular, wrong idea that Peterman is a capable NFL QB. Even the worst-in-NFL-history WR corps and OL looked adequate when Barkley took over behind center.

I just want to reiterate that I'm not a Beane/McDermott apologist; however, there is certainly valid room for opinions on this message board that are looking at the long-term picture and are waiting to pass judgment until more data is gathered. I'll revisit this topic after the next 6 games are played. I expect to see non-trivial improvement from the offense and from Allen after all the bye week changes have been made. I also expect more wins now that we are playing the easier half of the schedule. If not....well then....

 

 

So I disagree with a lot of this, but it was a good post. So credit where it's due. 

One thing that simply has to be acknowledged is the team had so many holes to fill because of choices McBeane made. McDermott declined Watkins' 5th year option, and collectively he and Beane decided to move Watkins and Darby for a pair of expiring contracts they decided to let walk. They chose to trade Glenn, Dareus, and Tyrod. It's not like they were just handed a bunch of holes--they actively created some. Now, maybe that works out long term and maybe any kind of "culture change" truly was necessary, but I think it's important context to note that several of the holes were self-created.

I don't think Benjamin was ever a top-25 WR. He was certainly better than he's been for us, but he always had problems creating separation and catching the ball; his total stats have declined every year since he was a rookie. He also had a bum knee when acquired. It's not shocking that he isn't a #1. As far as credit elsewhere goes, Foster has had 1 single decent NFL game, as has Wyatt Teller. Mayhaps it's a bit premature to give credit for them? McKenzie has done squat, and do we really want to give Beane credit for Thompson when he was like choice #15 at WR? I don't think so.

McDermott and Beane have done some legit work on the defensive side of the ball. But their offensive decisions remain highly questionable, and they've objectively made the team worse through their decisions since last season ended. It may well work out long term, but right now, there's more to criticize than to celebrate.

[Hoss]

Adam Schefter reporting the Browns are interested in interviewing Condoleezza Rice for their head coaching spot.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25310452/cleveland-browns-want-interview-condoleezza-rice-head-coaching-job

[TrueBlueGED]

5 minutes ago, Hoss said:

Adam Schefter reporting the Browns are interested in interviewing Condoleezza Rice for their head coaching spot.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25310452/cleveland-browns-want-interview-condoleezza-rice-head-coaching-job

I'd say this can't be real life. But it's the Browns. It's definitely real. 

[Hoss]

2 minutes ago, TrueBlueGED said:

I'd say this can't be real life. But it's the Browns. It's definitely real. 

With her experience behind the scenes in football it’d make way more sense for her to be assistant GM or something along those lines

[TrueBlueGED]

13 minutes ago, Hoss said:

With her experience behind the scenes in football it’d make way more sense for her to be assistant GM or something along those lines

Right. Somewhere in the front office makes sense. But head coach? Only the Browns.