GDT: Dallas Stars @ Buffalo Sabres, 1/20/2018, 1pm ET, MSG

[SwampD]

Also, our goals against average is on pace to be worse.

[Randall Flagg]

You also didn't mention that in that year, we had a couple of three game win streaks and even a four game win streak that had all the pro tankers clamoring to fire Nolans for trying. I don't think we've had one three game win streak this year.

 

You are giving this years team way too much credit. They are AWFUL.

While I'm not expecting any streaks, there are still 36 games left to put one or two in. ANd I think a 14 game regulation losing streak is far more a black mark than a 3 game winning streak is a gold star. That team got backups probably 60 times that season, too. 

 

I don't mean to sound like I'm cutting these guys any slack, so I'll word it differently. 

 

There is a chasm in between this team and 2014-15. It's not huge, but it exists and is big enough that this team doesn't give me IBS and heartburn like that team literally did.

 

This team is without a doubt the most disappointing team I've ever seen, and probably the most disappointing and 2nd worst team in franchise history, unless somebody who's watched every season says otherwise, I can't speak for a lot of those teams otherwise.

 

I harp the point about 14-15 so badly because that team had a profound affect on my mental and physical health. But in the end it's functionally useless for me to continue to do so. 

[dudacek]

You also didn't mention that in that year, we had a couple of three game win streaks and even a four game win streak that had all the pro tankers clamoring to fire Nolans for trying. I don't think we've had one three game win streak this year.

 

You are giving this years team way too much credit. They are AWFUL.

They are awful. This is AWFUL

https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/BUF/2015.html

[SwampD]

I would say that this team is unwatchable, but now I have to watch just to see how much worse it wil get,… ya know, for the comedy of it all.

[Thorner]

I think Randall’s above posts do a good job of showing how bad we were and how far we had to go.

Objectively, is the talent level of this team 40 to 50 points worse than the Knights?

It’s not just talent.

I’ll ask you the same question I asked Flagg that he won’t respond to cause I feel like I’m on his ignore list: Do you think the largest issue is an overall talent problem? Or do you think there is a larger issue?

[Randall Flagg]

Also, our goals against average is on pace to be worse.

I mentioned that. It's the single stat amongst popular ones (points in standings, wins, goals for, power play, penalty kill, shots for, shots allowed, and any possession number that exists on the planet) that we're going to be worse in.

 

So the score is 17-18 Sabres: 8

14-15 Sabres: 1

Edited January 20, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[hockeyhound]

I have no idea what its going to take and I'm sure there has been some improvements since last year.

 

For what its worth, Good Luck Sabres, I hope you can get this thing turned around.

[Randall Flagg]

I’ll ask you the same question I asked Flagg that he won’t respond to cause I feel like I’m on his ignore list: Do you think the largest issue is an overall talent problem? Or do you think there is a larger issue?

My bad bro, I would never intentionally ignore you  :wub:

 

There's a talent problem that won't let this team be a playoff team and some combo of culture/mental fragility/goaltending psyche/coaching that makes this team historically bad IMO

 

I have no idea what the other thing is and Botterill's future here depends on if he can figure it out and fix it I guess

Edited January 20, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[calti]

Next game, count the number of times Reinhart is down on the seat of his pants.

 

Next game, count the number of times Reinhart is down on the seat of his pants.

he is way too soft. there was another guy the sabres had many many yrs ago who was just like reinhardt.....cant think of the name but it goes way back..

[Thorner]

My bad bro, I would never intentionally ignore you  :wub:

 

There's a talent problem that won't let this team be a playoff team and some combo of culture/mental fragility/goaltending psyche/coaching that makes this team historically bad IMO

 

I have no idea what the other thing is and Botterill's future here depends on if he can figure it out and fix it I guess

I can get on board with that.

[Randall Flagg]

Another random stat: This year we average being out-shot one SOG per game, it was over 11 that season. We finished near -1000 in shot differential and are pacing for being ten times better in that department this season. As far as hockey between the whistles goes this team still clowns that one. They're just pathetic mentally and were supposed to be so much better than they are.

[Thorner]

One positive is that sometimes you see a marked difference just by changing a few pieces. Look no further than the Avs.

 

With the Sabres more than anything it’s how long they’ve been incredibly bad for, not that they are getting worse. They are slightly better, but still terrible, so in that way this team feels way more disappointing than others.

Edited January 20, 2018 by Thorny

[Randall Flagg]

It's 67 degrees and sunny out here. I'll see you peeps Monday night. 

This fanbase deserves so much better.

[SwampD]

I mentioned that. It's the single stat amongst popular ones (points in standings, wins, goals for, power play, penalty kill, shots for, shots allowed, and any possession number that exists on the planet) that we're going to be worse in.

 

So the score is 17-18 Sabres: 8

14-15 Sabres: 1

How are we on pace for more points and wins this year, when we don't have more of those than at this point in that season?

Edited January 20, 2018 by SwampD

[calti]

dale McCourt

[Tondas]

Players who really gave a damn today (not saying they played well necessarily):

 

Gorges

Falk

Jack

Kane

Nolan

 

All but one will not be on the team next year.  The guys who give a sh!t will be gone.  Next year, with many of the same leftover players, should we expect different results??  Insanity.

[Jacque Richard]

dale McCourt

traded ole number 6 for him, sad day in sabres history

[Cisse]

This is a horrible season and getting worse.

[Tondas]

traded ole number 6 for him, sad day in sabres history

 Number 18 as well.  A sad day indeed.

[Jacque Richard]

winning breeds winning. the sabres used to have a winning franchise until Pegula showed up.

seymour is rolling over. Sad what this franchise is about

[calti]

traded ole number 6 for him, sad day in sabres history

and we got sam reinhardt in the deal....

[Jacque Richard]

Number 18 as well. A sad day indeed.

i remember schoney crying When he talking to rick azar Edited January 20, 2018 by Jacque Richard

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Also Sauve (for a conditional pick that never happened ... that one hurt) and Smith went to the Wings that day.

 

For Foligno and McCourt and Peterson.

 

Overall I think the Sabres won that deal, but a it is a sad day when fan favourites, even ageing and wearing out ones, are traded.

[dudacek]

I’ll ask you the same question I asked Flagg that he won’t respond to cause I feel like I’m on his ignore list: Do you think the largest issue is an overall talent problem? Or do you think there is a larger issue?

I don’t have the answer. I think it’s a complex mix of too many passengers and poor leadership and the talent issue intertwines with each. To be more specific as it applies to the team at this very moment:

 

1) Our ownership historically has coddled the players and helped create an environment where losing is tolerated.

2) Our GM is playing a long game in his plan to fix the mistakes of the previous regime.

3) Our coach is focused on a positive reinforcement development plan aimed at the small handful of players that will be here in a few years; too many of the rest don’t expect to be back and have no incentive to buy in.

4) Our coach (and, I believe, our GM) prefers a style of play not well-suited to the talent at hand.

5) Our veteran leadership Okposo, Pominville, Gorges haven’t been good enough for their example to resonate in the room.

6) The young veterans that should be our leaders - Kane, O’Reilly, Lehner, Bogosian - are ill-suited to that role.

7) Our best young talents -Reinhart, Risto and Eichel - have yet to show the maturity to seize leadership, although we are seeing signs from Eichel. On the ice, Jack has been very good, Risto OK and Reinhart bad.

8) Our second wave of young players - the guys you hope show Improvement like Beaulieu, Antipin, McCabe, Girgensons, Larsson, Rodrigues - have been completely unproductive, and in most cases not NHL calibre. Mostly talent, partly environment.

9) Our third wave of youngsters -Ullmark, Guhle, Smith, Nylander, Baptiste, Bailey, Fasching - has been deliberately shielded from the NHL mess by our GM in a bid to eliminate the environment concern

10) The group our GM brought in to shield them - Pouliot, Wilson, Nolan, Josefson, Falk, Johnson,Tennyson, Scandella - has largely been bad as well. With the exception of Scandella, they are journeymen fringe players just happy to be collecting NHL paycheques. All teams have them we have too many of them.

11) Our goalie has been mostly good, sometimes bad, but never good enough to win; he also does not seem to have the mental makeup that inspires confidence in the team in front of him.

 

In short, our depth of talent is bad, our top talent is not good enough to overcome that and it is all playing in an environment where losing has long been expected.

 

Most posters are responding to seven years of ineptitude. Botterill has had seven months to fix it.

He has a lot to fix and I think it will done incrementally.

 

He’s already decided to move on from Kane and most of us suspect Lehner. oReilly and Bogosian are open questions.

He’s figuring out which young pieces are worth developing around Jack and Risto and the older guys are just filling holes.

 

We will see 10 different players in next years starting lineup, and, unlike this year’s a number will actually be faces Botterill hopes will be here for more than cup of coffee.

 

Unlike the rest of us, JBot hasn’t been suffering for years.

Like it or not, this year is about evaluation for him. His team will start taking shape next year.

Edited January 20, 2018 by Mick O’Manly

[Doohicksie]

That's noon for me.  The DFW Bills Backers are having a watching party at a bar (not our normal Bills Backers location).

That was fun getting together with my friends from Buffalo but ugh what a terrible game.