Sabres Prospects 2017-2018

[GASabresIUFAN]

I want Olofsson to prove he can score in the AHL before dreaming of the NHL.

[Doohicksie]

Funny, I think JBot will want that too.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Do y’all realize that the Sabres prospect pool is not only limited on NHL potential D men, but we have virtually zero goal scorers.

 

We only have 4 prospects with over 10 goals YTD. NCAA FA Smith has 12 but is primarily a playmaker. 3rd rd pick Pu has 19 to go with 32 assists and then we have two 7th rd picks with 21 goals each in Glotov and Olofsson. Both are undersized and neither has been known as a goal scorer before this season. I am not sure any of these guys projects as a top 6 goal scorer in the NHL or even if a guy like Glotov will even play in the NHL.

 

Pitiful!

[pi2000]

Do y’all realize that the Sabres prospect pool is not only limited on NHL potential D men, but we have virtually zero goal scorers.

 

We only have 4 prospects with over 10 goals YTD. NCAA FA Smith has 12 but is primarily a playmaker. 3rd rd pick Pu has 19 to go with 32 assists and then we have two 7th rd picks with 21 goals each in Glotov and Olofsson. Both are undersized and neither has been known as a goal scorer before this season. I am not sure any of these guys projects as a top 6 goal scorer in the NHL or even if a guy like Glotov will even play in the NHL.

 

Pitiful!

 

If MIttlestadt was in junior he'd have atleast 200 goals by now.

 

Part of this is also that their best prospects, highest picks in the last 5 years are Eichel and Reinhart... who are no longer prospects.

[GASabresIUFAN]

If MIttlestadt was in junior he'd have atleast 200 goals by now.

 

Part of this is also that their best prospects, highest picks in the last 5 years are Eichel and Reinhart... who are no longer prospects.

We have drafted 14 forwards in the 1st 3 rds since 2013. Jack and Sam are in the NHL, Compher and Lemieux were traded away, but the rest are still in our system, plus we added Smith and acquired Fasching. We should have plenty of decent scorers percolating through the system beside Mittlestadt, and even he is a pass first guy.

1st rd picks - Nylander and Mittelstadt. Both pass first guys. Nylander is edging toward bust status

2nd rd picks - Bailey, Hurley (bust), Cornel (bust), Karabacek (bust), Asplund (pass first), Davidsson unknown)

3rd rd picks - Pu (potential), Baptiste (bottom 9 grinder)

Other - Smith (pass first), Fasching (bottom 9 grinder)

 

We also drafted 10 forwards after the 3rd rd since 2013 and our two leading goal scoring threats are from the bottom of this group.

Edited February 2, 2018 by GASabresIUFAN

[pi2000]

We have drafted 14 forwards in the 1st 3 rds since 2013. Jack and Sam are in the NHL, Compher and Lemieux were traded away, but the rest are still in our system, plus we added Smith and acquired Fasching. We should have plenty of decent scorers percolating through the system beside Mittlestadt, and even he is a pass first guy.

1st rd picks - Nylander and Mittelstadt. Both pass first guys. Nylander is edging toward bust status

2nd rd picks - Bailey, Hurley (bust), Cornel (bust), Karabacek (bust), Asplund (pass first), Davidsson unknown)

3rd rd picks - Pu (potential), Baptiste (bottom 9 grinder)

Other - Smith (pass first), Fasching (bottom 9 grinder)

 

We also drafted 10 forwards after the 3rd rd since 2013 and our two leading goal scoring threats are from the bottom of this group.

 

I wouldn't consider any 2nd and 3rd picks "busts"... that's not how the NHL draft works.    Top 15 1st round guys should hit maybe 50% of the time?    

[inkman]

I wouldn't consider any 2nd and 3rd picks "busts"... that's not how the NHL draft works. Top 15 1st round guys should hit maybe 50% of the time?

Yerp

[dudacek]

Serious question: what should we be using to define goal scorers?

Especially in an NHL where half the teams didn’t have a 30-goal man last year?

 

I mean Baptiste and Bailey historically produced. Nylander scored in his draft year. Middelstadt.

Olofsson is leading his league in goals.

 

I mean I don’t think any of these guys are mike Bossy style natural snipers, but how many prospects are? 10? 15?

[Derrico]

If MIttlestadt was in junior he'd have atleast 200 goals by now.

 

 

Oh man, I laughed out loud for that one.

[Thorner]

Do y’all realize that the Sabres prospect pool is not only limited on NHL potential D men, but we have virtually zero goal scorers.

We only have 4 prospects with over 10 goals YTD. NCAA FA Smith has 12 but is primarily a playmaker. 3rd rd pick Pu has 19 to go with 32 assists and then we have two 7th rd picks with 21 goals each in Glotov and Olofsson. Both are undersized and neither has been known as a goal scorer before this season. I am not sure any of these guys projects as a top 6 goal scorer in the NHL or even if a guy like Glotov will even play in the NHL.

Pitiful!

  

 

Nitpick - Pu has 21g and 37a so far on the season.

 

We have drafted 14 forwards in the 1st 3 rds since 2013. Jack and Sam are in the NHL, Compher and Lemieux were traded away, but the rest are still in our system, plus we added Smith and acquired Fasching. We should have plenty of decent scorers percolating through the system beside Mittlestadt, and even he is a pass first guy.

1st rd picks - Nylander and Mittelstadt. Both pass first guys. Nylander is edging toward bust status

2nd rd picks - Bailey, Hurley (bust), Cornel (bust), Karabacek (bust), Asplund (pass first), Davidsson unknown)

3rd rd picks - Pu (potential), Baptiste (bottom 9 grinder)

Other - Smith (pass first), Fasching (bottom 9 grinder)

 

We also drafted 10 forwards after the 3rd rd since 2013 and our two leading goal scoring threats are from the bottom of this group.

Serious question: what should we be using to define goal scorers?

Especially in an NHL where half the teams didn’t have a 30-goal man last year?

I mean Baptiste and Bailey historically produced. Nylander scored in his draft year. Middelstadt.

Olofsson is leading his league in goals.

I mean I don’t think any of these guys are mike Bossy style natural snipers, but how many prospects are? 10? 15?

But I completely get what GA is saying here.

 

We are indeed lacking goal-scorers, both on the team, and in the system. We are HEAVILY weighted towards playmakers. Eichel, Reinhart, O’Reilly, Mittelstadt, Nylander, Pu, etc etc are all pass-first players.

 

The list of shoot first players we have in the system includes who, Olofsson....anyone else?

[Taro T]

Nitpick - Pu has 21g and 37a so far on the season.

 

But I completely get what GA is saying here.

We are indeed lacking goal-scorers, both on the team, and in the system. We are HEAVILY weighted towards playmakers. Eichel, Reinhart, O’Reilly, Mittelstadt, Nylander, Pu, etc etc are all pass-first players.

The list of shoot first players we have in the system includes who, Olofsson....anyone else?

But that's why the Sabres passed on Sergachev & Chychrun; to get a finisher.

 

Oh, ... Really?

 

Well, as Emily Lutella used to say, nevermind. :censored:

[Formerly Allan in MD]

How big is he?  If he's going to "take it to the net," as he says, he better have some size to do it up here.

[GASabresIUFAN]

But that's why the Sabres passed on Sergachev & Chychrun; to get a finisher.

 

Oh, ... Really?

 

Well, as Emily Lutella used to say, nevermind. :censored:

This is further evidence why BPA is a bunch of crap.  Our organization needed a finisher or a D and TM gave us neither, or was Nylander.

 

I actually think Jack has the potential to be a great finisher, but once Kane is gone, he'll be our only one.

 

What about Mittelstadt you say.  He was a BPA type pick that I'm happy about.  I'll concede that point but only to a certain extent.  I like to look at tiers and quality of player per tier.  I had Mittelstadt in my 1B tier and there was such a gap between him and the next guy on the list.  I also think of him as Jack light.  Someone who can set up others, but someone who could also take on the scoring role is necessary.  If you back up to the Nylander pick, when we drafted I had Nylander, Sergachev, Chychrun, Keller and Joulevi in the same tier.  Joulevi and Keller were already gone.  So it was a choice between another playmaker, which we didn't need or two D which we did.    

[Thorner]

But that's why the Sabres passed on Sergachev & Chychrun; to get a finisher.

Oh, ... Really?

Well, as Emily Lutella used to say, nevermind. :censored:

Ha.

 

I mean, it may end up that we have enough guys that can finish, that it won’t matter. But I do find it interesting that I’d label the vast majority of players in the system as playmakers before finishers.

 

This is further evidence why BPA is a bunch of crap.  Our organization needed a finisher or a D and TM gave us neither, or was Nylander.

 

I actually think Jack has the potential to be a great finisher, but once Kane is gone, he'll be our only one.

 

What about Mittelstadt you say.  He was a BPA type pick that I'm happy about.  I'll concede that point but only to a certain extent.  I like to look at tiers and quality of player per tier.  I had Mittelstadt in my 1B tier and there was such a gap between him and the next guy on the list.  I also think of him as Jack light.  Someone who can set up others, but someone who could also take on the scoring role is necessary.  If you back up to the Nylander pick, when we drafted I had Nylander, Sergachev, Chychrun, Keller and Joulevi in the same tier.  Joulevi and Keller were already gone.  So it was a choice between another playmaker, which we didn't need or two D which we did.

 

I can get on board with this. I believe position should/does get factored in in cases where the adjudged talent differential is minimal.

[dudacek]

Again, how common are these score-first prospects?

How many on Boston’s list? MOntreal’s? Toronto’s?

 

How many were picked in the entire first round last year?

Owen Tippett maybe?

[GASabresIUFAN]

In recent draft?  Vesalainen in 2017 also comes to mind.  Laine, Puljujarvi and Tkachuk near the top in 2016  Maybe even Keller also.  DeBrincat also comes to mind

 

In 2014 Ehlers and Pastrnak come to mind.  Boeser, Connor,  Beauivillier and Aho in 2015.

 

These shot first guys are around and cam be found.  We just don't seem to find them.  Granted Boeser, Aho and Beauivillier could all have been Sabres had TM kept our draft picks. 

Edited February 3, 2018 by GASabresIUFAN

[Randall Flagg]

Aho, Connor, Puljujarvi are most definitely not shooters

 

There was a running joke about how long it took Aho to get a goal this year

[GASabresIUFAN]

Aho, Connor, Puljujarvi are most definitely not shooters

 

There was a running joke about how long it took Aho to get a goal this year

You realize that Aho has 18 g this season and had 24 last year and his ratio of goals to assists for his career is nearly 1 to 1. That my friend is the definition of a goal scorer and not a playmaker. Oh yeah, Aho converts on about 13% of his shots. The Sabres convert at about 8%. Edited February 3, 2018 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

In recent draft? Vesalainen in 2017 also comes to mind. Laine, Puljujarvi and Tkachuk near the top in 2016 Maybe even Keller also. DeBrincat also comes to mind

 

In 2014 Ehlers and Pastrnak come to mind. Boeser, Connor, Beauivillier and Aho in 2015.

 

These shot first guys are around and cam be found. We just don't seem to find them. Granted Boeser, Aho and Beauivillier could all have been Sabres had TM kept our draft picks.

 

None of these guys are prospects.

Beyond that, you list 12 of them in four years, by nine teams and half of those are top 10 picks.

 

I guess we coulda shoulda taken Pastrnak over Reinhart, but not even the Bruins were doing that at the time. The only guy that realistically we missed was Boeser.

 

I’d never call Sam Reinhart a shoot first guy, but he has scored only nine fewer NHL career goals than Elhers and Laine and has more goals than every other player on your list except Pastrnak. In fact, he is one of two Sabres on the list of top 10 goal-scoring draft picks since 2014

The guy with the second most goals over those four years is a kid named Eichel.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Mick O’Manly

[Randall Flagg]

You realize that Aho has 18 g this season and had 24 last year and his ratio of goals to assists for his career is nearly 1 to 1. That my friend is the definition of a goal scorer and not a playmaker. Oh yeah, Aho converts on about 13% of his shots. The Sabres convert at about 8%.

Have you watched Sebastian Aho play? He's NOTHING like Boeser or any other pure goal scorer. The dude prefers to pass OUT of high danger areas. Just because he's on one of the most offensively anemic teams in the league and therefore doesn't have high assist totals, doesn't mean the mid-20s goals he's going to finish with are indicative of him being a sniper. On a better team, he becomes a 20-27G scorer with 40+ assists. 

 

It took 16 games for him to get a goal this year, and since that stretch he's had goal-less stretches of 5 and 8 games. He's on pace for like 25 non-empty-net goals. A great number for a young guy, and 2 more than rookie Sam Reinhart and his muffin shot. He's capable shooting the puck, but he is not the player you describe.

Edited February 3, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[TrueBlueGED]

This is further evidence why BPA is a bunch of crap.  Our organization needed a finisher or a D and TM gave us neither, or was Nylander.

 

I actually think Jack has the potential to be a great finisher, but once Kane is gone, he'll be our only one.

 

What about Mittelstadt you say.  He was a BPA type pick that I'm happy about.  I'll concede that point but only to a certain extent.  I like to look at tiers and quality of player per tier.  I had Mittelstadt in my 1B tier and there was such a gap between him and the next guy on the list.  I also think of him as Jack light.  Someone who can set up others, but someone who could also take on the scoring role is necessary.  If you back up to the Nylander pick, when we drafted I had Nylander, Sergachev, Chychrun, Keller and Joulevi in the same tier.  Joulevi and Keller were already gone.  So it was a choice between another playmaker, which we didn't need or two D which we did.    

 

If Alex was playing like Willie did after getting drafted, I really don't think there would be much lamentation about him not being a defenseman or a pure goal scorer. Put differently, we're more mad that Alex looks like he could be headed towards pure busthood than we are about what position he plays, or the style in which he plays it.

[The Dominator]

If Alex was playing like Willie did after getting drafted, I really don't think there would be much lamentation about him not being a defenseman or a pure goal scorer. Put differently, we're more mad that Alex looks like he could be headed towards pure busthood than we are about what position he plays, or the style in which he plays it.

 

Agreed with this. I know personally, the traits of a winger that I wanted to be paired with Eichel/ROR are the traits Nylander was supposed to have.  

[MattPie]

BPA: having a player that makes the NHL takes precedence over taking the guy you needed that has a higher chance of not making the NHL. Given how non-deterministic NHL drafting is, you just have to pick the guy that's the best chance of making it. Loading up on AHL snipers is the same as passing on those draft picks.

[Sabel79]

Leaving a player on the board who even you admit is better than the one you just took is bordering on malpractice. At the very least make a trade and get something back for passing on the best guy left on the board. Or draft him then make a trade.

[pi2000]

Why isn't CM on the Olympic roster? Borgen made it, Dahlin is in, some other young players too.