Expansion draft and league-wide wheeling and dealing

[3putt]

Larsson can play center or wing. He seems to play well with everyone. How is he worse then Carrier?

As a wing he finishes at about the same rate and doesn't take possession away nearly as much nor is he as physical.  I think Carrier is faster.  Larrson does play center and kills penalties which is a plus but I never even thought about plugging him in on the wing with Jack or Sam.  he fails the eye test to me i that role where I thought Carrier was perfect, provided there was another finisher on the line. 

[That Aud Smell]

Strome?!

 

Huh.

 

They should've spoken to Eichel about this. He'd have told them: Strome is a turnover machine.

 

 

(:44 mark)

Edited June 22, 2017 by That Aud Smell

[matter2003]

Yup. Pretty sure he wanted out of there and to the west coast anyways 

Edmonton isn't exactly West Coast...closer to Siberia

[GASabresIUFAN]

Liger don't try to argue with 3Putt on Carrier. He is under the impression that Carrier is potentially a top 6 forward despite the fact he can't score. He thinks he can be another Foligno, despite Foligno being at best a 3rd line LW.

 

He even said that Bailey, who had 34 goals in his last jr season and now has had back to back 20 goal seasons in the AHL, has hands of stone.

 

Bailey (AHL) 122gm 43g 38a 81pts

Carrier (AHL) 127gm 23g 33a 56pts

Foligno (AHL) 93gm 26g 40a 66pts

[That Aud Smell]

Wrong Strome.

 

Ah, nuts.

Was it Dylan?

 

Or Griffin?

[GASabresIUFAN]

I like the Eberle for Strome deal for both teams. Strome wasn't really blossoming in NY and NY needed to get Taveras a good winger. Edm needed to create cap, but also I think Strome to start again and may be able to take a leap in production playing with McJesus.

[LGR4GM]

Liger don't try to argue with 3Putt on Carrier. He is under the impression that Carrier is potentially a top 6 forward despite the fact he can't score. He thinks he can be another Foligno, despite Foligno being at best a 3rd line LW.

 

He even said that Bailey, who had 34 goals in his last jr season and now has had back to back 20 goal seasons in the AHL, has hands of stone.

 

Bailey (AHL) 122gm 43g 38a 81pts

Carrier (AHL) 127gm 23g 33a 56pts

Foligno (AHL) 93gm 26g 40a 66pts

Check out Larssons last 2 AHL years.

[Thorner]

It's poor value for Edmonton, but such is life with Chiarelli as GM.

 

Also, they were never going to get Hamonic for Eberle. Good forwards don't have near as much value as good defencemen, currently. Being shown time and time again.

 

You want a good Dman? Draft him.

 

You want a good forward? Draft a Dman.

[LGR4GM]

Good wingers don't = good defenders.

Centers certainly = defenders.

Edited June 22, 2017 by LGR4GM

[Thorner]

Good wingers don't = good defenders.

Centers certainly equal defenders

But that's not really bearing itself out in the current market.

[LGR4GM]

But that's not really bearing itself out in the current market.

What established center has been traded for an established defender?

[Thorner]

What established center has been traded for an established defender?

O'Reilly for Zadorov? ;)

[TrueBlueGED]

But that's not really bearing itself out in the current market.

Johansen for Jones. I don't think we see more of these deals because there are rarely teams with excess centers and excess defensemen to trade.

[Thorner]

Johansen for Jones. I don't think we see more of these deals because there are rarely teams with excess centers and excess defensemen to trade.

Good one, forgot this deal.

[sabresith]

What established center has been traded for an established defender?

Ryan Johanson for Seth Jones, I guess. Sorry blue beat me to it.

Edited June 22, 2017 by sabresith

[LGR4GM]

O'Reilly for Zadorov? ;)

Lol

 

My point being wingers aren't as valuable as defenders but centers are. Johansson for Jones comes to mind.

Johansen for Jones. I don't think we see more of these deals because there are rarely teams with excess centers and excess defensemen to trade.

And that's my point. Defenders right now seem to equal Centers. We can't group all forwards together.

[Thorner]

Lol

My point being wingers aren't as valuable as defenders but centers are. Johansson for Jones comes to mind.

And that's my point. Defenders right now seem to equal Centers. We can't group all forwards together.

Which makes pigeonholing Reinhart as a wing even more baffling.

[That Aud Smell]

Dylan

 

Or was it Keith?

[Huckleberry]

It's poor value for Edmonton, but such is life with Chiarelli as GM.

 

Also, they were never going to get Hamonic for Eberle. Good forwards don't have near as much value as good defencemen, currently. Being shown time and time again.

 

You want a good Dman? Draft him.

 

You want a good forward? Draft a Dman.

 

Its more like a cap dump, they need free space in a year for all their RFA contracts.

They'll need the 6 mill a year to start paying their kids.

Schlemko to the canadiens for a 5th round pick.

Edited June 22, 2017 by Huckleberry

[Randall Flagg]

If you gave William "can't score" Carrier Jack's point pace in Will's ice time, he'd have upped his production from 8 points to...10 points. 

 

He was a top six player on Buffalo in terms of even strength points per sixty minutes played. Ahead of Okposo, Larsson, Ennis, Zemgus, etc. 

 

Just sayin'. 

 

He's also the only Sabres forward to be a positive possession player with Rasmus Ristolainen on the ice. 

Edited June 22, 2017 by Randall Flagg

[Samson's Flow]

If you gave William "can't score" Carrier Jack's point pace in Will's ice time, he'd have upped his production from 8 points to...10 points. 

 

He was a top six player on Buffalo in terms of even strength points per sixty minutes played. Ahead of Okposo, Larsson, Ennis, Zemgus, etc. 

 

Just sayin'. 

 

He's also the only Sabres forward to be a positive possession player with Rasmus Ristolainen on the ice. 

I do remember making a fairly lengthy post earlier this offseason extrapolating out Carrier/Bailey/Baptiste's point totals per ice time to that of an average winger. They all extrapolated out to 30+ points IIRC.

 

It was just fun with math, and by no means a real "projection". It was more to show how painfully ineffective Ennis and Moulson were last year

Edit: found it! http://forums.sabrespace.com/topic/24910-2017-18-lineup-prediction/?view=findpost&p=942108

[Randall Flagg]

I do remember making a fairly lengthy post earlier this offseason extrapolating out Carrier/Bailey/Baptiste's point totals per ice time to that of an average winger. They all extrapolated out to 30+ points IIRC.

 

It was just fun with math, and by no means a real "projection". It was more to show how painfully ineffective Ennis and Moulson were last year

With my hopefully last post on the topic, I would just like to say that I don't think the misuse of the player in question should be held against that player in overall fan evaluation of the player, which is why the "psh 8 points" argument doesn't do it for me, because as I said, you give him our most dynamic, highest scoring player's point pace and you only add two points to that lousy total on the season. 

Aaaaaaand I think he's better than Foligno and will be what we hoped Foligno would, on a cheaper deal to boot, so I'd have exposed Marcus first. 

 

But not Larsson, I like Larry and hope he can help ease ROR's minutes next season. 

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaand now I'm done. Let the Sabrespace rejoicing begin.

[Samson's Flow]

and this one: http://forums.sabrespace.com/topic/24910-2017-18-lineup-prediction/?view=findpost&p=942095

With my hopefully last post on the topic, I would just like to say that I don't think the misuse of the player in question should be held against that player in overall fan evaluation of the player, which is why the "psh 8 points" argument doesn't do it for me, because as I said, you give him our most dynamic, highest scoring player's point pace and you only add two points to that lousy total on the season. 

Aaaaaaand I think he's better than Foligno and will be what we hoped Foligno would, on a cheaper deal to boot, so I'd have exposed Marcus first. 

But not Larsson, I like Larry and hope he can help ease ROR's minutes next season. 

 

Aaaaaaaaaaaaand now I'm done. Let the Sabrespace rejoicing begin.

I like it when you get going Randall  :wub:

[Randall Flagg]

He added the 13th pick and the 15th pick and Theodore and Tuch — that's four guys they can build with.

He also grabbed four second rounders — the best liquid currency in the NHL

 

Haula, Karlsson, Miller, Carrier, Merrill, Nosek, Pulkkinen, Van Reimsdyk, Leipsic, Reinhart and Schmidt are all young enough to emerge and cheap enough to discard if they don't.

He's got a ton of veteran defencemen who likely will be flipped for more assets.

He's got a handful of scoring forwards who can also be flipped for more assets.

He's got a goaltending combo that is as good as any in the league.

 

He's basically set himself up with more assets than we had after the teardown for the tank.

 

He's also got a whack of cap space in a league struggling to find it.

And they are bad enough to be in the lottery the next couple years to add his Eichel and his Marner.

 

I think he did a hell of a job.

I just think there were like 10 players that he chose without side deals that were not the best option available for making the team better now, have lower value than someone else they could have gotten, and wouldn't have changed all the futures he did acquire. 

 

Griffin Reinhart and Luca Sbisa? It's not as if those teams had great guys exposed but they each had several better hockey players with more value. Pulling those from the top of my head

[Brawndo]

The Isles asking price for Hamonic is 2 1st Rounders

 

Per Dreger

Edited June 22, 2017 by BRAWNDO