Hypothetically, Hischier or Patrick make Reinhart expendable?

[sabills]

I'm still wondering if we even need to trade for a defenseman. In theory firing Bylsma should be a big help​ for our D. A coach who asks Risto, Bogo, McCabe, and Guhle to activate offensively​ should get a lot more out of that group than Dan has/will.

 

Ok, I want Dan out, but this idea that he's the worst coach of all time or something is a little much. This defense has needed help for YEARS and everyone has known it. If Ghule immediately steps in and becomes a Top-Pair d-man thats great, but I don't think that expectation is reasonable. The defense this year was abysmal, and thats not all DB. What your describing is a defense that looks something like:

 

Risto-Guhle

McCabe-Bogo

Falk-Fedun

Borgen?

 

Thats not good enough for me to make any sort of run in the playoffs, regardless of coach.

[TrueBlueGED]

And in theory that move should come cheaper. Basically I want to replace Gorges with someone better. I think that's doable.

 

And then you remember it took Hall to get Larsson and cry. I sincerely hope the market moves beyond that trade.

[darksabre]

Ok, I want Dan out, but this idea that he's the worst coach of all time or something is a little much. This defense has needed help for YEARS and everyone has known it. If Ghule immediately steps in and becomes a Top-Pair d-man thats great, but I don't think that expectation is reasonable. The defense this year was abysmal, and thats not all DB. What your describing is a defense that looks something like:

 

Risto-Guhle

McCabe-Bogo

Falk-Fedun

Borgen?

 

Thats not good enough for me to make any sort of run in the playoffs, regardless of coach.

I get that our defense isn't great, but his garbage strategy with the defense makes them objectively worse for no good reason.

 

I think Guhle is going to be here in the top 4 next year. And we have to live with Bogo not going anywhere so he's gotta get used better. One of Falk/Fedun on the 3rd pair is totally fine. Just find me that shutdown guy like Blue is talking about and maybe you can get some flexibility in the top 4 where you can shuffle Guhle/Bogo around.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I'd say yes, especially if we can get Hischier. I know the Q doesn't have the same reputation as the other major junior leagues up there, but those Halifax Moosehead players seems to do alright in the NHL. Plus it would make NS happier than a shirtless Randy with a lifetime supply of cheeseburgers.

 

Post of the decade candidate right here!!

 

:lol:

[darksabre]

Our D could be: 

Risto-xxx
McCabe-Bogo

Falk-Guhle

What if we can get Dumba into that top pair?

[Drunkard]

Post of the decade candidate right here!!

 

:lol:

 

Wasn't sure if you'd fully appreciate the reference since you don't watch Trailer Park Boys. One of these days when you have some spare time you've gotta check it out. All 11 seasons, 3 or 4 movies, and several live shows are available on Netflix. I'd recommend starting with the first movie (called Trailer Park Boys the Movie). Even though it technically takes place after season 3 of the show (give or take I can't remember) it will give you the best overview of the show with about 90 minutes of time investment.

[qwksndmonster]

Man, Risto has been coached so horribly. The dude still has no idea how to keep the puck and rush it himself. He's so painfully methodical that he dumps it in even when there's space. And he doesn't even need that much space! We've seen his hands. Risto needs a coach that believes in him and encourages him to free-wheel.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Wasn't sure if you'd fully appreciate the reference since you don't watch Trailer Park Boys. One of these days when you have some spare time you've gotta check it out. All 11 seasons, 3 or 4 movies, and several live shows are available on Netflix. I'd recommend starting with the first movie (called Trailer Park Boys the Movie). Even though it technically takes place after season 3 of the show (give or take I can't remember) it will give you the best overview of the show with about 90 minutes of time investment.

 

Yeah.  I'm not a Trailer Park Boys guy, so thanks, but no.

[Randall Flagg]

Patrick Stefan - oft injured (prior to the draft and after)bust of a top overall pick in 1999 who Atlanta for some reason took over the Sedins. Stefan is most famous for missing an empty net on a breakaway while playing with the Stars. Comparing Nolan Patrick to Patrick Stefan is implying that Nolan is likely to be a similar bust as a NHL player. Does this help?

 

I don't want Nolan either.

 

As to trading Reinhart. If I can get Nico and turn Reinhart into Hanifan and a pick or prospect, I'd consider it.

Same vibes from Nolan for me. 1 healthy season in his past 6, already had hernia surgery. He might become what Reinhart will. And if we're trading Reinhart Hanifin is who I look at as well (I still have hope he can pass Slavin in a few years, he looks really really good when he's playing with competent RHD)

 

But overall, if I take Nico then I look to trade not Reinhart but Alex Nylander for defense help. And I wouldn't be afraid of adding next year's first. 

 

 

Win the lottery, we trade the pick to Carolina for Justin Faulk or Noah Hanifin (add flavour to the deal as needed)

I don't like Justin Faulk for this team actually. I know he's got a bomb from the point but I like Risto piling up assists from that spot with J. Eichel getting those goals instead a little more. And I think Hanifin has a much better ceiling on his two-way game

Our D could be: 

 

Risto-xxx

McCabe-Bogo

Falk-Guhle

 

What if we can get Dumba into that top pair?

Dumba is a real offensive specialist from what I see when I watch them (which isn't that often) so I like that in theory because you give him and Risto favorable matchups, but you really have to be able to trust the bottom four defensively in this scenario. 

 

I wonder what Scandella's two-way play is like, I wish I knew more about him

The good thing about Dumba is, with the expansion stuff, he's probably very easy/realistic to acquire.

[dudacek]

The general problem for trading a goaltender for a Defenseman is that Defensemen are WAY more valuable at this point. Look at what it took for Edmonton to get Adam Larsson for Pete's sake. I don't think Lehner and the #1 is as valuable as it needs to be to get a top-3 d-man.

This Larsson/Hall trade set the market meme is really starting to annoy me:

1) maybe Larsson had a lot more value around the league than he did with Internet hockey fans

2) maybe Hall had a lot less value around the league than he did with internet hockey fans.

3) don't see NJ or Edm complaining about the results of that trade, so maybe the GMs are smarter than the internet.

4) the trade doesn't appear to have followed any trends, or set any trends.

[darksabre]

Same vibes from Nolan for me. 1 healthy season in his past 6, already had hernia surgery. He might become what Reinhart will. And if we're trading Reinhart Hanifin is who I look at as well (I still have hope he can pass Slavin in a few years, he looks really really good when he's playing with competent RHD)

 

But overall, if I take Nico then I look to trade not Reinhart but Alex Nylander for defense help. And I wouldn't be afraid of adding next year's first.

 

 

I don't like Justin Faulk for this team actually. I know he's got a bomb from the point but I like Risto piling up assists from that spot with J. Eichel getting those goals instead a little more. And I think Hanifin has a much better ceiling on his two-way game

 

Dumba is a real offensive specialist from what I see when I watch them (which isn't that often) so I like that in theory because you give him and Risto favorable matchups, but you really have to be able to trust the bottom four defensively in this scenario.

 

I wonder what Scandella's two-way play is like, I wish I knew more about him

 

The good thing about Dumba is, with the expansion stuff, he's probably very easy/realistic to acquire.

Yup, that's why I suggested​ it. Either way, I think we can fix our defense without killing ourselves.

[dudacek]

Oh my. Our rational, level-headed Dudacek has been possessed by the ghost of Wookie's past. :p

I should have left it as "a Carolina defenceman" but the point was you flavour the deal depending on which defenceman they are willing to give up. I think contracts mean it's likely they dump one of the four and if they don't, they might be interested in moving Bean or Fleury.

 

I also don't think moving Faulk is out of the question, if they think Hanifin can pick up his offence.

Canes are cheap and need frontline forwards.

Hirschier has to have some appeal.

 

 

Not a fan of Dumba. He's a Bogosian type - he's got the tools but is lacking the toolbox.

He is, however, sadly the type of defenceman Murray seems to like.

Edited April 13, 2017 by dudacek

[Drunkard]

Yeah.  I'm not a Trailer Park Boys guy, so thanks, but no.

 

You are seriously missing out. It's got to be one of the top 10 shows ever made.

[TrueBlueGED]

This Larsson/Hall trade set the market meme is really starting to annoy me:

1) maybe Larsson had a lot more value around the league than he did with Internet hockey fans

2) maybe Hall had a lot less value around the league than he did with internet hockey fans.

3) don't see NJ or Edm complaining about the results of that trade, so maybe the GMs are smarter than the internet.

4) the trade doesn't appear to have followed any trends, or set any trends.

1) Maybe.

 

2) I just think the value of scoring wingers is a lot lower than people tend to think.

 

3) Do you mean fans or the franchises?

 

4) None of the available defensemen moved after that trade. I think it very well may have set a trend, just that other GMs weren't willing to pay the price Chiarelli did.

Edited April 13, 2017 by TrueBlueGED

[Huckleberry]

I'm all for trading a top 3 pick for Hannifin.   Would be a fair trade to, Hurricanes need a top 6 center badly, we could use that top 4 LHD.

And seeing Hannifin has had a poor season, don't think we should add much even.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

If we are smiled upon and somehow end up drafting #1, or #2 (I really think probably #1 is what it will take at this point) and draft Nico that does not make Samson expendable.

 

Nico would be on Eich's wing, which would mean that Samson would move to where he always should have been ... at #3 centre, maybe even #2 if ROR moved to Eich's other wing.

 

Imagine that a top line of ROR - Eich - Nico.  A #2 of Kane - Samson - Nylander (?).

[JJFIVEOH]

Why would anybody want to trade the "knowns" (Lehner and Reinhart) and replace them "unknowns" (draft pick and Peterson)?

[Sabre fan]

I guess one only needs to look at the Larsson/Hall trade...wouldn't Sam for Hanifin be basically the same thing? You gotta give something real good to get something real good. we got real lucky  stealing OReilly but that was once in a lifetime deal. For that real good top 2 d-man we are gonna have to give something good like Sam. If we deal Sam then we can sign kane maybe for 3-4 years?

[Huckleberry]

I guess one only needs to look at the Larsson/Hall trade...wouldn't Sam for Hanifin be basically the same thing? You gotta give something real good to get something real good. we got real lucky  stealing OReilly but that was once in a lifetime deal. For that real good top 2 d-man we are gonna have to give something good like Sam. If we deal Sam then we can sign kane maybe for 3-4 years?

 

You still have to pay that good #2 D as well :p

[Sabre fan]

do we not lose some cap next year? of course we gotta pay Jack and that alone will be what, 8 mill?

[Beer]

I don't know anything about this draft class. I'm still holding on to the idea that Sam is a very important part of this franchise going forward.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Why would anybody want to trade the "knowns" (Lehner and Reinhart) and replace them "unknowns" (draft pick and Peterson)?

The world is ending I'm agreeing with JJ. Oh well!

 

For those who want a Tallinder/Lydman type, a thought I completely agree with, how about UFA Karl Alzner?

[TrueBlueGED]

The world is ending I'm agreeing with JJ. Oh well!

 

For those who want a Tallinder/Lydman type, a thought I completely agree with, how about UFA Karl Alzner?

I have a feeling Alzner is going to command almost twice as much as I'm willing to pay, in term if not dollar amount. Can I get 3 years, $12-14 million. Sign me the hell up. For some reason I expect he'll get something like 5 years $25M+, to which I sprint as quickly as possible in the opposite direction.

[LGR4GM]

do we not lose some cap next year? of course we gotta pay Jack and that alone will be what, 8 mill?

No their cap hit won't kick in till that contract starts so 2018.

 

 

Ps who says I'm lgr4gm... maybe I'm not... waa haha...

[Brawndo]

I have a feeling Alzner is going to command almost twice as much as I'm willing to pay, in term if not dollar amount. Can I get 3 years, $12-14 million. Sign me the hell up. For some reason I expect he'll get something like 5 years $25M+, to which I sprint as quickly as possible in the opposite direction.

His metrics match a 4-5 D Man, the Sabres already over pay for one of those. I would stay away.

 

I believe that a Reinhart for Hanifin deal could happen this summer. Reminds me of the Seth Jones for Ryan Johansen Deal where both players needed a change of scenery. That deal with Guhle being NHL Ready and the possible signing of Antipin would overhaul 50% of the Top Six and allow Gorges to be the seventh D Man.

 

Since this is Buffalo, they will be drafting somewhere between 5-8, this deal will allow them to draft BPA. Makar entering the prospect pool would be a great addition, as would Owen Tippett.