GDT: Buffalo at Toronto 7:30p ET 1/17/17

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Should have never showed up Thanks

 

DAMN!!

[Taro T]

Sabres are now 5 games behind .500.  Toronto, OTOH, with 21 wins and 42 games played, is a legitimate .500 team.  And they started rebuilding after us!  We LOL'd and gloated a bit that Babcock wouldn't be accustomed to the years of pain and suffering and losing losing losing that would be needed to build up the team.  Apparently he didn't need to be accustomed to it -  that team's turnaround is clearly faster and better than ours.   

 

And now the season series is 2-0 in Toronto's favor. IF they win one more, they win the season series.  

Again, where is this fast turnaround Murray promised in the first year of his rebuild?  We're three years in, and playing at an 80-82 pt pace.  Again.

 

Toronto has been bad since '05-'06. Since that time they have been in the playoffs exactly once & the only reason for that was there was no regular season games to allow their annual post-game 50 collapse.

 

90, 91, 83, 81, 74, 85, 80, 57, 84, 68, 69.

 

Guess what those were? You seriously going to tell me the Loafs only tanked 1 year? They were DFL only once but bottom 4 at least 3 times & except for the short lockout year never finished above 12th in the conference after Black Sunday.

 

Pretty fast ####ing turnaround. Only took from '04 until now for them to be "relevant." And, until they manage to not suck the last 30 games of the season, that should be the expectation. Because, when you're a Loaf you play 50 game seasons, it's what you do. (Wouldn't have money on them doing their normal end of season swoon, but certainly won't worry about them being in the 2nd round yet either.)

[TrueBlueGED]

Save percentage drops something like ten percent when a goalie starts the second game of a back-to-back after playing the first. So naturally we do that with a guy who just came back from a nasty bout of flu yesterday. Unbelievable.

 

Carrier might have had the worst shift of the season of any Sabre at one point in the second period, I believe. There were two terrible turnovers in the neutral zone/top of the defensive zone and then he lost the puck almost right in front of his own net. He played well otherwise though.

 

Eichel was infuriating. I think it was his worst game of his career. I see he's taken on the Buffalo quality of coming up small in games that get a lot of media attention. Sigh. Oh, and I saw the Taro call-out in the last GDT - so twice this year Eichel's long stick has helped enough for someone to mention me, but twice last game he couldn't take a puck away from his feet the way any other player with any other stick could, the second time leading directly to the Leafs possession that led to the Matthews goal :P

 

SwampD is right that the Leafs actually dumped the puck a little more than we did that game, because our players were doing a very good job snuffing them out in the neutral zone. My Bylsma system views have shifted away from focusing on the D&C part, and I'll elaborate in the Bylsma thread. There is a huge difference though, and that was the puck support that the Leafs forwards gave.

 

SwampD is wrong that that game was fun to watch if you're a Sabres fan. Losing in regulation to the darling Leafs to get them to De Luca .500 and see us fall back to ten games below it will never be enjoyable no matter the quality of hockey, and that hockey was at best meh quality.

 

Better goaltending could have won the game for the Sabres, though.

 

[/b] Matthews is a tier or two above Jack, unfortunately. It doesn't have to stay that way though, Jack needs to commit to getting better in a way that Matthews/McDavid/Crosby would.[/b]

1) I've said it before in (I think) the Bylsma thread, but it's not that dump and chase can't work, it's that Bylsma's version can't work. How an NHL coach can think that combining dump and chase with a conservative forecheck is a good idea is utterly beyond my comprehension.

 

2) I think you're too down on Jack here. On pace for 37 goals is not two tiers below Matthews, IMO. Especially handicapping for coaching. I think it's clear Matthews is better, I'm just not comfortable saying how wide of a gap there is without seeing Jack play for someone else.

[Randall Flagg]

2) I think you're too down on Jack here. On pace for 37 goals is not two tiers below Matthews, IMO. Especially handicapping for coaching. I think it's clear Matthews is better, I'm just not comfortable saying how wide of a gap there is without seeing Jack play for someone else.

I think Matthews' hockey sense is absurdly good, and I don't know if there's ever been a better two-way teenage center. While doing that he's on pace for over forty goals. It's not being down on Jack, it's just that Matthews is absurdly good. And I saw a stickhandling comment earlier - Auston's hands (and stick length :) ) are sublime. Jack's stickhandling is nice when he has lots of open space and no pressure. When there's a guy on him or pressing him to the boards, he either stops doing it and goes into protect the puck mode (which he's INCREDIBLY good at) or he keeps trying to stickhandle and totally screws up because that space isn't there for him to hold it out where he usually does. Whereas Auston can do it anywhere with anyone on him. Again, this is Auston being incredible more than Jack disappointing. 

[darksabre]

Toronto has been bad since '05-'06. Since that time they have been in the playoffs exactly once & the only reason for that was there was no regular season games to allow their annual post-game 50 collapse.

 

90, 91, 83, 81, 74, 85, 80, 57, 84, 68, 69.

 

Guess what those were? You seriously going to tell me the Loafs only tanked 1 year? They were DFL only once but bottom 4 at least 3 times & except for the short lockout year never finished above 12th in the conference after Black Sunday.

 

Pretty fast ####ing turnaround. Only took from '04 until now for them to be "relevant." And, until they manage to not suck the last 30 games of the season, that should be the expectation. Because, when you're a Loaf you play 50 game seasons, it's what you do. (Wouldn't have money on them doing their normal end of season swoon, but certainly won't worry about them being in the 2nd round yet either.)

I agree. The Leafs turnaround has not been fast at all. They've been cultivating their farm for years. They were bound to build enough talent up eventually. 

[Huckleberry]

Did Bylsma actually Yank Lehner from the game because he was waving at that kid on a phone during a TV time out ? 

If so , dreary dan you suck.

[darksabre]

Did Bylsma actually Yank Lehner from the game because he was waving at that kid on a phone during a TV time out ? 

If so , dreary dan you suck.

No, he yanked him because he never should have started him in the first place. Stupid coaching decision. 

[Jsixspd]

0-6 versus Boston and leafs

That's just this season.  Under Bylsma, the Sabres have now lost 6 straight games to the Bruins - the last time the Sabres won against Boston was November 2015 I believe.  

 

Nolan's tank lineup had a better record against Boston!

[TrueBlueGED]

I think Matthews' hockey sense is absurdly good, and I don't know if there's ever been a better two-way teenage center. While doing that he's on pace for over forty goals. It's not being down on Jack, it's just that Matthews is absurdly good. And I saw a stickhandling comment earlier - Auston's hands (and stick length :) ) are sublime. Jack's stickhandling is nice when he has lots of open space and no pressure. When there's a guy on him or pressing him to the boards, he either stops doing it and goes into protect the puck mode (which he's INCREDIBLY good at) or he keeps trying to stickhandle and totally screws up because that space isn't there for him to hold it out where he usually does. Whereas Auston can do it anywhere with anyone on him. Again, this is Auston being incredible more than Jack disappointing.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Matthews. I just think saying he could be two tiers above Eichel means Eichel is more RNH than Seguin. There are only so many tiers, ya know!

[Jsixspd]

Toronto has been bad since '05-'06. Since that time they have been in the playoffs exactly once & the only reason for that was there was no regular season games to allow their annual post-game 50 collapse.

 

90, 91, 83, 81, 74, 85, 80, 57, 84, 68, 69.

 

Guess what those were? You seriously going to tell me the Loafs only tanked 1 year? They were DFL only once but bottom 4 at least 3 times & except for the short lockout year never finished above 12th in the conference after Black Sunday.

 

Pretty fast ####ing turnaround. Only took from '04 until now for them to be "relevant." And, until they manage to not suck the last 30 games of the season, that should be the expectation. Because, when you're a Loaf you play 50 game seasons, it's what you do. (Wouldn't have money on them doing their normal end of season swoon, but certainly won't worry about them being in the 2nd round yet either.)

Sorry, a team could be bad for 30 years - to me a 'rebuild' starts when a GM and Coach take over, and start to SHAPE the team, and apply their vision to the team and make roster and hockey decisions.

 

Shanahan started as President in spring 2014 - he hasn't even been there 2 years.   Babcock was hired  May 20th, 2015.  Lamoriello - the current GM of the Leafs - was hired July 2015!   

 

Rebuild clock STARTED July 2015.   Ok, or even when Shanahan started  but that hasn't even been 2 years yet!

 

Wasn't too much 'suffering' to endure during the Lamoriello/Babcock rebuild.  They're showing real results already.   Meanwhile, Sabres are 27th in the league 3 seasons in Murray's rebuild, and 2 seasons into Bylsma's stint.  Sabres suffering continues -  bottom 5 NHL isn't exactly a happy place to be!  

 

And YES,, there's gonna be existing talent on the roster that every new GM and Coach combo takes over to work with - the Sabres were not talentless when Murray took charge either.  

 

What you're implying actually makes where the Sabres are seem WORSE by comparison - Leafs had been bad for years and years and years - a new GM and coach come in during 2015, and leap frog over a Sabres team that was BETTER than the Leafs when the current Murray regime assumed command!  

Edited January 18, 2017 by Jsixspd

[Huckleberry]

No, he yanked him because he never should have started him in the first place. Stupid coaching decision. 

 

Was thinking the same last night, back to backs with a goalie coming back from the flu.

[Randall Flagg]

I think my favorite part about this season from hell is how fried Ristolainen is already. I'm really glad he got all those minutes he's not ready for. It really helped us get to where we are.

[woods-racer]

They're on an 82 point pace. 

Yes, there has been injuries but I also expect there will continue to be injuries in the second half. 

Let's assume the injuries are significantly less impactful (+3 points vs pace)

Assume trade deadline losses are offset by Rochester guys playing well (net 0 point impact)

Risk of goalies not playing as well as they have (-2 points vs. pace) (I know people are down on Lehner for some reason but the two keepers save % is pretty darn good and maybe not sustainable)

Young team improving over time (+2 points vs. pace)

Better in shootouts (+1 points vs. pace)

 

82 + 3 - 2 + 2 + 1 = 86 points which is really like saying a 81-91 point range. 

 

 

I really like how you put this.

 

How would you judge strength of schedule for the rest of the season in you analysis?

 

The second half of the season is tougher than the first opponent wise, plus a really tough western swing.

Am I crazy or do our defensemen act like they're stapled to their own end while trying to break out? Why do they never carry the puck or let a winger drop back to cover D to make the transition quicker?

 

You know the answer to this.

 

Let the DD hate flow through you.

 

Use the d4rk-force.

Please god fire Dan Bylsma.

 

It's flowing well I see. :devil:

[darksabre]

I really like how you put this.

 

How would you judge strength of schedule for the rest of the season in you analysis?

 

The second half of the season is tougher than the first opponent wise, plus a really tough western swing.

 

 

You know the answer to this.

 

Let the DD hate flow through you.

 

Use the d4rk-force.

 

 

It's flowing well I see. :devil:

I was suspicious of Bylsma on day one. He's done nothing to change my mind.

[woods-racer]

I was suspicious of Bylsma on day one. He's done nothing to change my mind.

 

I know, but reading through the GDT the next day becomes more fun when I can have some fun with posts. 

 

Sorry it was you.

 

If it helps, no matter how your day goes, you will always have that *at least I made one person feel better today* feeling.  :D

Edited January 18, 2017 by Woods-Racer

[darksabre]

I know, but reading through the GDT the next day becomes more fun when I can have some fun with posts.

 

Sorry it was you.

 

If it helps, no matter how your day goes, you will always have that *at least I made one person feel better today* feeling. :D

:lol:

[Stoner]

Did Bylsma actually Yank Lehner from the game because he was waving at that kid on a phone during a TV time out ? 

If so , dreary dan you suck.

He had already been pulled, which makes the stunt more disturbing, because he was showing up his coach, IMHO.

[Weave]

He had already been pulled, which makes the stunt more disturbing, because he was showing up his coach, IMHO.

 

Are you sure you have the timeframe right?  My understanding was that the wave at the pretty lady was before he let in 3 goals and got pulled.  I seem to recall some commentary that the interaction with the fan was a sign that he wasn't focused properly to play. 

Edited January 18, 2017 by We've

[Stoner]

Are you sure you have the timeframe right?  My understanding was that the wave at the pretty lady was before he let in 3 goals and got pulled.  I seem to recall some commentary that the interaction with the fan was a sign that he wasn't focused properly to play. 

You are right. My bad.

 

This clip is what threw me off. They show Lehner after being pulled, then show him waving at the gal in the dreaded flashback.

 

[Buffalo Wings]

You are right. My bad.

 

This clip is what threw me off. They show Lehner after being pulled, then show him waving at the gal in the dreaded flashback.

 

 

If he was really ticked off at Bylsma for pulling him, then I say sit him for a week. Nilsson has been the better goalie, anyway.

[7+6=13]

The Leafs dump the puck with speed. We don't. 

 

That's right.  We do it because of the lack of speed/skill.  Huge difference. 

 

The strange thing is we have lines/players with plenty enough speed to not dump in as much as we do - Bylsma,  it appears,  refuses to abandon his scheme regardless of which line is out there.   I see absolutely nothing wrong with allowing 2 top lines to play different than 2 puck control lines.