Let the Fire Bylsma Watch begin

[Wyldnwoody44]

I wasn't all in on Bylsma ever, but I am all in on him being let go, as of this morning even.

 

Take Jack ##### Eichel of the ### #### PP you #### moron, piece of #####, why don't you bring up Cal O ##### reiley to take his place on the ### #### roster while you're at it!!!!

 

Just keep losing, in this same fashion, please.... We have too much talent to be this bad

[Mig22]

Making a statement to young Jack and the rest of the team.  I'm fine with that.  

 

50 games left.  Need 13 points out of each 10 games.  Let's see how the next 10 go.  

[Eric in Akron]

Making a statement to young Jack and the rest of the team.  I'm fine with that.  

 

50 games left.  Need 13 points out of each 10 games.  Let's see how the next 10 go.  

 

No offense but we said let's see what we are like at the end of December.  We keep waiting to see how the next games go and then waiting again.  I'm sorry - I've seen enough to know that right now that the system is not working.

[PromoTheRobot]

I don't blame Bylsma for tonight's poor showing. The Sabres have a culture problem. The players left over from the tank years are dragging this team down. This particular collection of players we call a "team" will suffer no matter who is behind the bench.

 

Bylsma mentioned in his post game presser that he was completely baffled why this team came out so flat at home against a team they're within reach of in the standings.

 

If you read between the lines of the player interviews, there are clues that suggest not everybody is buying in, not doing what they need to do to be successful.

 

Yeah it sucks, but thats what happens, and why rebuilds can take a bit longer than you'd expect. It's not just assembling talent, it's building a culture of winning by having eveybody buy in to going above and beyond what is expected of them.

It certainly looks like an effort problem to me. Our guys consistently get beat to pucks, except for the brief few moments in the game we turned on the jets. We also can't control a puck. Did you notice how aggressive the Canes were closing on the puck carrier? That would normally be a suicide move, the puck carrier would find the guys left open. But nobody on Carolina seemed to be worried we could do that.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I think that Disco is a good coach in certain situations.  It is hard to tell if the Sabres as they are constructed is a good situation for him.

 

The GM hired him knowing Disco's style and reputation and he assembled the roster with all this in mind, IMO.

 

So, it seems reasonable to think that many of the players do not like the style of this coach.  It would appear that they have given up on the coach and, dare I say, want him gone.  Everyone knows that the GM can't and won't *fire* his players, but I think when / if some of the players are replaced the results will be better. There is very little hustle in this group of players, some of that may be because of youth and inexperience in what it takes to be a good and well rounded player at the NHL level.  The puck possession stinks, at best.

 

I have to believe that the GM believes in this coach. 

 

I expect some dramatic roster adjustments this trade deadline and off-season.  I do not expect Disco to be fired this season, nor the coming off-season.  At the end of next season?  Maybe.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Sabres Fan In NS

[Mig22]

No offense but we said let's see what we are like at the end of December.  We keep waiting to see how the next games go and then waiting again.  I'm sorry - I've seen enough to know that right now that the system is not working.

I hear you but my point was that if they continue at the points pace they have had since Jack's return, they will be on the edge of making the playoffs.  This is exactly what most fans expected coming into the season:  a borderline team.   If they continue to be in 25th place and out of the playoff hunt with Jack and a reasonably healthy D corp then yeah, Bylsma should go.  That's why I am fine with a wait-and-see attitude.

[Stoner]

Anyone who thinks Bylsma (or Ryan) is going to go would be wise to recollect Terry's comment at his initial Sabres presser. When asked whether Lindy and Darcy were staying, he quoted the late owner of the Steelers, Art Rooney, who said "panic doesn't seem to work."  (Attributed to Art in coverage of Terry's comment but apparently said by Art II, the grandson.)

 

Also wise to check out a story in USA Today back in October.

 

 

HOUSTON — Terry Pegula says the word “ultimatum” like he can’t believe it’s coming out of his own mouth.

 

A little more than two years after he and wife Kim bought the Buffalo Bills, Pegula laughs at some of this stuff. But he clearly is annoyed by what he feels is a media-driven perception of him as an impatient, sometimes intrusive owner.

 

And Pegula knows that perception — real or imagined — isn’t beneficial for anybody when every bit of bad news and every loss renews speculation about coach Rex Ryan and/or general manager Doug Whaley losing their jobs.

 

“You have to have continuity,” Pegula told USA TODAY Sports during the NFL meetings this week. “I don’t care if you’re drilling oil in gas wells or you’re running a sports team. If you keep changing things, nothing’s going to work.”

If Terry was/is annoyed, he might think he has only himself to blame, given the LaFontaine affair, Black out/Brandon in, other Sabres execs leaving, the Roman firing, etc. So he might be about to double down on his original philosophy of giving things time.

 

The situation does beg the question of whether Murray can fire Bylsma by himself, or if Terry has to sign off.

 

The other wild card here is Russ Brandon. If he's smart, and he is, he sees the secondary ticket market collapsing, the empty seats, the message boards where fans would rather talk about Swedish pancakes and colonoscopies than the Sabres. He's a master marketer. How do you sell Bylsma Hockey?

Edited December 23, 2016 by PASabreFan

[woods-racer]

I would say it matters not on who's hockey/football it is as long as the respective teams are winning.

 

But since neither have won is so long and attendance has remained very good, I would say Russ is a master at selling hope and not coaches/players.

 

So the true question for me is...

 

Can Russ give the fans hope again to keep ticket sales good?

[Sabel79]

 

If Terry was/is annoyed, he might think he has only himself to blame, given the LaFontaine affair, Black out/Brandon in, other Sabres execs leaving, the Roman firing, etc. So he might be about to double down on his original philosophy of giving things time.

 

The situation does beg the question of whether Murray can fire Bylsma by himself, or if Terry has to sign off.

So John Scott was on Marek/Wyshinski's podcast last week.  He was asked what a player would think about the mess in Florida right now, and made a comment to the effect that he went through something similar when Patty walked away after having been lied to by ownership (I'm paraphrasing, but that was what I found to be the gist of what John said).  I found that rather interesting, and have no reason to doubt that was the view in the room.  Not sure what it's worth, but it's really the only candid quote from anyone remotely close to the situation I've ever heard. 

[That Aud Smell]

The situation does beg the question of whether Murray can fire Bylsma by himself, or if Terry has to sign off.

 

Good stuff here, all of it.

 

To this, I think absolutely the owner(s) have to approve a decision to separate Bylsma.

 

Which isn't the case with other franchises, is it? Didn't we hear a story about another franchise ... which was it. The Predators? The GM talked about how he made the Weber/Subban deal, and then had to tell the owners? Or was that someone telling another similar story in re the Weber/Subban deal? Anyway - the Pegulas would want to be consulted before Bylsma is fired.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Good points, PA.

 

I would hope by now that Mr. Pegula would be hands off, at least with the Sabres.  The initial *high* of owning an NHL franchise must be worn off by now and he has a 'hockey guy' (at least it would appear so) running the team in Mr. Murray.

 

I do think that Disco is 'Murray's guy', but I do not think that the roster is quite there, mostly because I think some of the players have given up on the coach.

[sodbuster]

What franchise over where?

The one in Orchard Park, I assume.

[Randall Flagg]

 

 

We also are under the illusion that our style is keeping us from scoring. There seems to be a mountain of evidence that may suggest some of these forwards we have don't have the acumen of putting the puck IN the net. Does Kane do everything right, NO in fact no-one does but if everyone on this team gave his effort and ROR's for that matter, we wouldn't be having this discussion or watch that atrocious game.

We have five guys that potted twenty last year, and two on top of that who are on pace for twenty this year. Seven guys with the talent to score twenty, and the third-highest-scoring defenseman in the league. Canes had three. There's talent on this team and the system doesn't get them into high danger areas with the puck often enough because its purpose is to get rid of the puck and then flip a coin to decide whether they get it back, and when we play teams with mobile, smart defensemen, we don't ever get the puck back and look like fools, like last night.

 

It certainly looks like an effort problem to me. Our guys consistently get beat to pucks, except for the brief few moments in the game we turned on the jets. We also can't control a puck. Did you notice how aggressive the Canes were closing on the puck carrier? That would normally be a suicide move, the puck carrier would find the guys left open. But nobody on Carolina seemed to be worried we could do that.

In my big post I mentioned how the Canes aren't that skilled, but have spent over a hundred games and more practices working on those quick decisions with oodles of puck support, and that's how they open teams up and keep the puck. We practice crashing into the corners. We panic when pressured and can't find the open guy, even though we're more skilled than the Canes are on paper. 110+ games of not playing that style will do this to you. And we lose the races to the pucks when we play teams that know how to move it quickly and efficiently because we prefer to give the puck to them behind their net and give them a head start because we can't be offsides.

[inkman]

I think blaming effort is a cop out. It's never that simple. Just because every player doesn't look like Matt Ellis with arms and legs flailing everywhere whilst not really getting anywhere doesn't mean they aren't trying.

 

I'd like to think it's paralysis by analysis.

The one in Orchard Park, I assume.

No one has been fired yet. Pure speculation by everyone.

[PromoTheRobot]

I think blaming effort is a cop out. It's never that simple. Just because every player doesn't look like Matt Ellis with arms and legs flailing everywhere whilst not really getting anywhere doesn't mean they aren't trying.

 

I'd like to think it's paralysis by analysis.

 

No one has been fired yet. Pure speculation by everyone.

Hard to not think effort plays a part when the Sabres stand still as much as they do.

[Stoner]

I think blaming effort is a cop out. It's never that simple. Just because every player doesn't look like Matt Ellis with arms and legs flailing everywhere whilst not really getting anywhere doesn't mean they aren't trying.

 

I'd like to think it's paralysis by analysis.

"Desperation" is another one. We weren't "desperate."

Hard to not think effort plays a part when the Sabres stand still as much as they do.

I've always defended players by saying guys who quit don't make it to the NHL. Unless there's an all-out rebellion against the coach, it makes no sense.

 

Roby used to try and explain it by saying sometimes you'd be on the bench and you just didn't have "it." He said it was a terrible feeling and there was nothing you could do.

[jsb]

We have five guys that potted twenty last year, and two on top of that who are on pace for twenty this year. Seven guys with the talent to score twenty, and the third-highest-scoring defenseman in the league. Canes had three. There's talent on this team and the system doesn't get them into high danger areas with the puck often enough because its purpose is to get rid of the puck and then flip a coin to decide whether they get it back, and when we play teams with mobile, smart defensemen, we don't ever get the puck back and look like fools, like last night.

I don't disagree with you but as an example of yesterday's game, we had 23 SOG, 7 by Jack and 6 by Kane. I would venture to say nearly half of those were when they played on the same shifts. That means for 60 minutes of that game we had 10 total shots on goal by everyone else. Our shooting percentage needs to be thru the roof to make up for that abysmal showing.

 

I think blaming effort is a cop out. It's never that simple. Just because every player doesn't look like Matt Ellis with arms and legs flailing everywhere whilst not really getting anywhere doesn't mean they aren't trying.

I was speaking to yesterday's game which appears to have inflamed the masses, otherwise I tend to agree with you

[inkman]

Hard to not think effort plays a part when the Sabres stand still as much as they do.

I think you are making my point for me. Just because the players aren't flying 100 mph doesn't mean they lack effort. They may be playing exactly as their coach wants them to. We like to write the narrative based on the results. It's just never that easy.

[That Aud Smell]

I've always defended players by saying guys who quit don't make it to the NHL. Unless there's an all-out rebellion against the coach, it makes no sense.

 

Roby used to try and explain it by saying sometimes you'd be on the bench and you just didn't have "it." He said it was a terrible feeling and there was nothing you could do.

 

My thoughts as well. And I imagine if your coach -- whose mantra is that the hardest thing to do on the ice is turn around on D and retrieve a puck*** and that's why his team dumps/chips, chases, crashes, and bangs -- had a system that was inhibiting the team, you might often find yourself lacking "it."

 

***It occurred to me last night: That mantra of Bylsma's -- it's rooted in his experience 20 years ago. Plus, he sucked. Jokes aside (it's not entirely a joke, btw), I think the reality is that modern NHL defencemen are WAY better at retrieving and controlling those pucks than they were even 10 (let alone 20) years ago. Times change; Bylsma has not.

[dudacek]

It does seems like Dans philosophy is rooted in his own playing experience: only the most special of players can create, everyone else must do a very low risk version of exactly what's expected, when expected.

[Brawndo]

I'll admit I was excited about DD being hired because of his time with Pittsburgh. The more I see, I realize he had the benefit of having two superstars on his team and they where able to overcome his system to make the playoffs every year.

 

He is an average coach who had too much talent in Pittsburgh not to make the playoffs year after year.

 

He reminds of a certain Bills Coach, albeit Levy had a winning record, who rode the talent he had to the HOF. Yet he his coaching staffs could not make the adjustments necessary against Parcells, Gibbs and Johnson to get over the hump

[inkman]

I'm not sure DD is even average

[Randall Flagg]

Without superstar performances that aren't condoned, we continue to score at historically bad rates.

[Jacque Richard]

70 goals and counting

[Brawndo]

I'm not sure DD is even average

I was being generous given it's Christmas