2017 NHL Draft -- General NHL Thread

[Guest]

I'm pretty sure this is exactly why they picked Nylander.

He can't dipsy-doodle like Marner or Patrick Kane, but he is fast, he can think the game at Jack's level and his hands are sublime.

 

I think we have to go D, even if it means sliding up or down.

Ideally, I'm trading that pick  in a package for a young defenceman whose team might have trouble fitting him into the pay scale because of his next contract or the guys around him.

Fowler, Vatanen, Justin Faulk (Pesce, Slavin and Hanifan all come due at the end of next year), Ryan Murray, Matt Dumba (not a fan personally, but he fits the profile) — there are guys like that out there.

I think they picked Nylander partly as Kane insurance.  Didn't he get into trouble the day before the draft?  Regardless, based on his track record with the Jets and during the 2015-16 season, my guess is GMTM was hedging his bets that he'd have to trade Kane or let him walk when his contract ended. 

 

I went and looked at 8 draft rankings from sources like the ISS, McKeens, Espn from the last 4 weeks and came up with the following average rankings

The top 8 are as follows, but there are ranking gaps after no. 2, no.6, No 8 and No 16.

1) Patrick

2) Hischier

3) Tippett

4) Vilardi

5) Liljegren (only D in top 10)

6) Mittlestadt

7) Tolvanen

8) Necas

GAP

9) Rasmussen

10) Glass

11) Petterson

12) Heiskanen (LD)

13) Maker (RD)

14) Kostin

15) Valimaki (LD)

16) Andersson

 

D Maker and Valimaki are the guys moving up in the more recent rankings, with Heiskanen slipping.  

 

From 17 to 30 there is a real split on who people like and in what order. Guys like Yamamoto has grades from 10 to 29, while Suzuki goes from 12 to 26 and Cal Foote varies from 13 to 28 but appears on all 8 rankings.  However the top 30 is surprisingly universal with every guy appearing on at least 6 of the rankings.  

 

Right now the Sabres have the 8th draft pick before the lottery.  If GMTM misses out on Liljegren, does he settle for another forward or trade down to get Valimaki or Maker (Valimaker?).

Edited March 20, 2017 by yse325

[Crusader1969]

By the time we get to June, Makar will be a consensus top 10 pick. Already seeing him on some rankings in top 10. Craig Button of TSN has him going 5th.

 

It's unfortunate that he is a late 98 or else he could have played in the under 18 tourney. Last season, that tourney solidified Fabbro and Jost as 1st rounders. They also played in junior A in their draft year.

[3putt]

Makar is NCAA bound correct?

[Crusader1969]

Yes, Makar didn't go to the WHL to keep his NCAA eligibility. He is committed to UMass.

 

He played last night in his teams 9-1 playoff victory and had a goal and 2 assists. I`ve linked the highlights. You see his explosive first step at the :33 minute mark, his one time slap shot at 3:04 but you must watch his goal at 5:10.

 

http://www.brooksbandits.ca/media-centre/news-archives.html?nID=11135

[Guest]

By the time we get to June, Makar will be a consensus top 10 pick. Already seeing him on some rankings in top 10. Craig Button of TSN has him going 5th.

It's unfortunate that he is a late 98 or else he could have played in the under 18 tourney. Last season, that tourney solidified Fabbro and Jost as 1st rounders. They also played in junior A in their draft year.

I'll be thrilled if we draft Maker or Valimaki regardless if the make the top 10 or not. I like the idea of Risto being a positive influence on Valimaki and we end up with a dominating L R Finish pair.

[Crusader1969]

New Craig Button draft rankings

 

http://www.tsn.ca/craig-s-list-lots-of-talent-after-patrick-hischier-1.702428

 

maker now #1 dmen on his list

[ct fab]

Valimaki just sounds like a successful name

[Guest]

New Craig Button draft rankings

 

http://www.tsn.ca/craig-s-list-lots-of-talent-after-patrick-hischier-1.702428

 

maker now #1 dmen on his list

I tend to discount Button.  Each year around this time I start looking at the rankings and follow what various sites and services say and each year Button list isn't close to the other services, MacKenzie or how the draft actually went.    Here is an example of why I discount Button; 8 guys he had in his top 30 right before the draft didn't come close to the actual first.  Some, like Bitten, Dineen and Abramov, did go until the 3rd round.   Obviously GM's list are subjective, but if he is giving 1st rd grades to guys every NHL GM thinks are 3rd round players you kind of have to question his list creation.

 

That said I like maker and agree he'll be in the top 10 or close by season's end, but I don't think he'll pass Liljegren as the No. 1 D.  I also like Valimaki better as well. 

Edited March 22, 2017 by yse325

[5th line wingnutt]

The Wingnutt ranking for late March        

  ## Player B-date HT WT Pos Sh Team League

  1 Patrick, Nolan 09/19/98 6'3" 198 C/RW R Brandon Wheat Kings WHL

  2 Hischier, Nico 01/04/99 6'0" 174 C L Halifax Mooseheads QMJHL

  3 Liljegren, Timothy 04/30/99 6'0" 198 D R Rögle Bk SHL

  4 Mittlestadt, Casey 11/22/98 6'1" 201 C/LW L Green Bay Gamblers USHL

  5 Vilardi, Gabriel 08/16/99 6'2" 192 C R Windsor Spitfires OHL

  6 Tippett, Owen 02/16/99 6'2" 203 RW R Mississauga Steelheads OHL

  7 Tolvanen, Eeli 04/22/99 5'10" 179 LW L Sioux City Musketeers USHL

  8 Necas, Martin 01/15/99 6'0" 168 C R Hc Kometa Brno Czech

  9 Rasmussen, Michael 04/17/99 6'5" 203 C L Tri-City Americans WHL

  10 Kostin, Klim 05/05/99 6'3" 196 RW L Dynamo Moskva KHL

  11 Pettersson, Elias 11/12/98 6'2" 161 C/LW L Timrå Ik Allsvenskan

  12 Heiskanen, Miro 07/18/99 6'0" 174 D L Hifk Liiga

  13 Valimaki, Juusso 10/06/98 6'2" 201 D L Tri-City Americans WHL

  14 Andersson, Lias 10/13/98 5'11" 198 C/LW L Hv71 SHL

  15 Foote, Callan 12/13/98 6'4" 209 D R Kelowna Rockets WHL

  16 Vesalainen, Kristian 06/01/99 6'4" 207 LW/RW L Frölunda Hc SHL

  17 Comtois, Maxime 01/08/99 6'2" 201 LW L Victoriaville Tigres QMJHL

  18 Poehling, Ryan 01/03/99 6'3" 185 C L St. Cloud State Univ. NCAA

  19 Hague, Nicholas 12/05/98 6'6" 214 D L Mississauga Steelheads OHL

  20 Popugayev, Nikita A. 11/20/98 6'6" 203 RW R Moose Jaw Warriors WHL

  21 Bowers, Shane 07/30/99 6'0" 170 C L Waterloo Black Hawks USHL

  22 Glass, Cody 04/01/99 6'2" 170 C R Portland Winterhawks WHL

  23 Suzuki, Nicholas 08/10/99 5'11" 183 C R Owen Sound Attack OHL

  24 Vaakanainen, Urho 01/01/99 6'1" 187 D L Jyp Liiga

  25 Yamamoto, Kailer 09/29/98 5'8" 159 C/LW R Spokane Chiefs WHL

  26 Makar, Cale 10/30/98 5'10" 176 D R Brooks Bandits AJHL

  27 Strome, Matthew 01/06/99 6'3" 201 LW L Hamilton Bulldogs OHL

  28 Brannstrom, Erik 09/02/99 5'10" 172 D L Hv71 J20 SuperElit

  29 Ratcliffe, Isaac 02/15/99 6'5" 194 LW L Guelph Storm OHL

  30 Davidsson, Marcus 11/18/98 6'0" 192 C/W L Djurgårdens If SHL

  31 Lodnia, Ivan 08/31/99 5'10" 181 RW R Erie Otters OHL

 

 

[GoPre]

I'm pretty sure this is exactly why they picked Nylander.

Think it had more to do w/ Nylander actually falling to the Sabres. Many did not think he would still be on the board.

[Crusader1969]

Best Sabres can do is finish 10th last. Looking more like somewhere between 5th and 8th. I guess the good news is that Murray should get to take 1st dmen off the board. Will be interesting to see if he wins one of the lottery slots.

[North Buffalo]

Best Sabres can do is finish 10th last. Looking more like somewhere between 5th and 8th. I guess the good news is that Murray should get to take 1st dmen off the board. Will be interesting to see if he wins one of the lottery slots.

Eh, no longer.  Sabres best can do is finish 9th including Vegas.  P.S. Passed Dallas tonite and remained tied with Detroit. Buffalo could beat out Jersey if Jersey wins their last 3 games.  So realistically 5 is the best the Sabres can do point wise.   3 more losses should lock it up.

[Sabre fan]

When all is said and done, I think maybe this guy, Callan Foote (Adam's son) may be our best bet...sounds just what we need back on D...

 

"An assertive two-way defenceman that reads plays quickly and understands both the offensive and defensive sides of the roles he is put into. He plays a consistent game, and can be trusted to create chances from the back end on special teams. He uses his size to gain leverage against other players, though he isn't an overly physical force. His hockey sense is outstanding, and his ability to not just read but start and, on the odd occasion, finish plays is overtly indicative of his high talent level. (Curtis Joe, EP 2017)"

[bob_sauve28]

Would not surprise me if we trade down and pick a d man. So hard to get a quality d-man that we might have to not pick the best player available and reach for a guy we hope can fill the void. 

[That Aud Smell]

The Wingnutt ranking for late March        

  ## Player B-date HT WT Pos Sh Team League

  15 Foote, Callan 12/13/98 6'4" 209 D R Kelowna Rockets WHL

When all is said and done, I think maybe this guy, Callan Foote (Adam's son) may be our best bet...sounds just what we need back on D...

 

"An assertive two-way defenceman that reads plays quickly and understands both the offensive and defensive sides of the roles he is put into. He plays a consistent game, and can be trusted to create chances from the back end on special teams. He uses his size to gain leverage against other players, though he isn't an overly physical force. His hockey sense is outstanding, and his ability to not just read but start and, on the odd occasion, finish plays is overtly indicative of his high talent level. (Curtis Joe, EP 2017)"

Would not surprise me if we trade down and pick a d man. So hard to get a quality d-man that we might have to not pick the best player available and reach for a guy we hope can fill the void. 

 

[dudacek]

I'd be shopping that first pick hard for a defenceman.

[North Buffalo]

I'd be shopping that first pick hard for a defenceman.

I'd rather use it on a Defenseman and shop some of Sabres forwards for another off someone's roster... a two-fer

[Trettioåtta]

I'd rather use it on a Defenseman and shop some of Sabres forwards for another off someone's roster... a two-fer

 

If we draft a d-man, he isn't on this team for 3 years.

[That Aud Smell]

If we draft a d-man, he isn't on this team for 3 years.

 

Probably right.

 

But it also seems foolish to get into the business of mortgaging the future for more immediate results.

[pi2000]

Looking like a top 8 pick is a certainty.

 

ALWAYS go BPA when drafting that high if you can't trade the pick.

[That Aud Smell]

Looking like a top 8 pick is a certainty.

 

ALWAYS go BPA when drafting that high if you can't trade the pick.

 

Always?

 

I saw some tiering analysis that seemed to suggest that the players from, say, 6-15 were all essentially the same in terms of their prospects for success. In that event, if there's someone that another team really wants at 8, I'm good with the team trading back if they think they can get a solid D prospect at, say, 12 or 14, or whatever.

 

OTOH, what are you likely to get in exchange for allowing another team to move up a few spots?

[TrueBlueGED]

Always?

 

I saw some tiering analysis that seemed to suggest that the players from, say, 6-15 were all essentially the same in terms of their prospects for success. In that event, if there's someone that another team really wants at 8, I'm good with the team trading back if they think they can get a solid D prospect at, say, 12 or 14, or whatever.

 

OTOH, what are you likely to get in exchange for allowing another team to move up a few spots?

 

Probability of success is essentially equal in that draft range, but I'm of the mind that teams always have guys they like in that range more than others. Same level of talent, but different skill sets, or something along those lines.

[Sabre fan]

I am just not convinced we can get a top 2 d-man with our pick and a player named kane and I am not so sure we really should give up a key part of our offense...I know everybody says like give our 1at and like Ennis or Moulson or something like that but the truth is there are like 20 teams after these few available (if they are) top defensemen so it will not be easy getting any of them...I know we get restless about this rebuild but it isn't easy and doesn't happen overnight unless you get lucky and everything clicks and you steal away a coach named Babcock that was suppose to go to your rivals...

[That Aud Smell]

Probability of success is essentially equal in that draft range, but I'm of the mind that teams always have guys they like in that range more than others. Same level of talent, but different skill sets, or something along those lines.

 

Right. And if the Sabres have their #4 overall guy sitting there at #8, and he's a forward, they're taking him.

[TrueBlueGED]

I am just not convinced we can get a top 2 d-man with our pick and a player named kane and I am not so sure we really should give up a key part of our offense...I know everybody says like give our 1at and like Ennis or Moulson or something like that but the truth is there are like 20 teams after these few available (if they are) top defensemen so it will not be easy getting any of them...I know we get restless about this rebuild but it isn't easy and doesn't happen overnight unless you get lucky and everything clicks and you steal away a coach named Babcock that was suppose to go to your rivals...

 

What Murray should be looking for is a guy who is not yet a top-4 Dman (whether due to age or simply stuck behind a bunch of other guys), but who he believes can be as soon as next season. Sort of like what Florida did with Pysyk. He has to find an undervalued commodity because, quite frankly, we're not getting a top-valued commodity without giving up assets we aren't likely to be willing to give up.

 

Right. And if the Sabres have their #4 overall guy sitting there at #8, and he's a forward, they're taking him.

 

For sure. As it should be.