Vesey signs with Rangers; huge thread now moot

[WildCard]

For the purposes of saying we didn't get him or that none of the teams did?

Gotta disagree with this. He took less money to stay with his team. That's pretty different from losing out on a UFA.

He had his pick of anyone to go to, how is it any different than if he was a UFA and decided to stay in TB still?

[beerme1]

He had his pick of anyone to go to, how is it any different than if he was a UFA and decided to stay in TB still?

 

As Eleven would say FFS clearly because he never actually hit FA status. Innit, c'mon and everything else.

[WildCard]

As Eleven would say FFS clearly because he never actually hit FA status. Innit, c'mon and everything else.

So are you reading my posts or what? It was LIKE he hit FA

[GASabresIUFAN]

Well if you figured that maybe you shouldn't have brought that weak sauce to this thread about Buffalo not getting UFAs.

 

This whole woo is me poor Buffalo thing is just b#lls#it.

No one said Poor Buffalo.  We said that Buffalo needs to win before becoming a premier destination.  

 

"Weak Sauce"  The only weak thing here was your inability to disprove my facts of Vesey, Cagguila, Babock and Stamkos turning down the Sabres over the last two years.  Remember you asked for the list!  Babcock was the top FA in 2015.  Don't believe me, how about Pierre LeBrun from ESPN http://www.espn.com/blog/nhl/post/_/id/32329/will-mike-babcock-enter-free-agency.  

[Thorner]

No one said Poor Buffalo.  We said that Buffalo needs to win before becoming a premier destination.  

 

"Weak Sauce"  The only weak thing here was your inability to disprove my facts of Vesey, Cagguila, Babock and Stamkos turning down the Sabres over the last two years.  Remember you asked for the list!  Babcock was the top FA in 2015.  Don't believe me, how about Pierre LeBrun from ESPN http://www.espn.com/blog/nhl/post/_/id/32329/will-mike-babcock-enter-free-agency.

 

Pointing out FAs we missed on to prove we can't sign FAs is the weak sauce. Tiger Woods lost a hell of a lot more Majors than he ever won. Does listing all the losses prove he couldn't win them? You can't win them all. You can't sign em all. It's a numbers game. Most of the time, we AREN'T going to get the Free Agent. And guess what: most time the Rangers are in the hunt for a guy, they won't get the guy either.

 

Welcome to the wonderful world of math. Top guys = many suitors = Low chance of success.

 

You just gotta win sometimes. Hello Okposo. Hello ROR.

[Alaska Darin]

With the same JV scenario with the Sabres as a perennial playoff team I'd say 5-10% chance, but a real free agent scenario with our deep pocketed owner allows us to sweeten the deal enough to compensate for much of because Buffalo eventually. It's always going to be an issue on some level for the Sabres IMO.

I don't think it is.  The Red Wings never had any problem getting players to Detroit when they were the class of the league and the city of Detroit is an absolute hole.

 

With the Pegula's dough, a first class organization (which we pretty much already have), and a team that consistently wins, "Because Buffalo" becomes a pretty tiny problem.

[nfreeman]

He had his pick of anyone to go to, how is it any different than if he was a UFA and decided to stay in TB still?

We're kinda splitting hairs here, but in the context of whether the Sabres were able to land a big FA, I guess I think that guys who decide to stay where they are are in a different category from guys who decide to leave -- because the Sabres didn't really have a shot at the guys who decided to stay.

[Weave]

We're kinda splitting hairs here, but in the context of whether the Sabres were able to land a big FA, I guess I think that guys who decide to stay where they are are in a different category from guys who decide to leave -- because the Sabres didn't really have a shot at the guys who decided to stay.

In the case of Stamkos, he was actively seeking options. Choosing TB didnt mean the other teams never had a shot. It means he didnt like the total package elsewhere any more than the total package in TB. Just as Vesey prefered the total package in NYR over the others offered. Seems like the same animal to me.

[nfreeman]

In the case of Stamkos, he was actively seeking options. Choosing TB didnt mean the other teams never had a shot. It means he didnt like the total package elsewhere any more than the total package in TB. Just as Vesey prefered the total package in NYR over the others offered. Seems like the same animal to me.

I might say Stamkos was interested in seeing what was out there, with the idea that if something blew him away then he would consider it, but that his default was to stay. Again, splitting hairs but I don't think that's quite the same as actively seeking options.

[Weave]

I might say Stamkos was interested in seeing what was out there, with the idea that if something blew him away then he would consider it, but that his default was to stay. Again, splitting hairs but I don't think that's quite the same as actively seeking options.

I suspect that most FAs know where they want to go and are doing the same.

[GASabresIUFAN]

No has said Buffalo can't land free agents, what we are saying is that it will be easier for the Sabres to land top FA's once we have a winning program.  Nothing more nothing less.  Okposo was a huge get this year and is a wonderful fit for this team.  However, the challenge laid down was to show whether we missed on some of the top FA's over the last few years and it is indisputable that we have.  Y'all can split hairs all you want about Stamkos, but once a player talks to other teams he is certainly acting like a free agent whether he signs elsewhere or not.  The truth is that once a player plays out the final of his contract he is a free agent.  His current team has exclusive negotiating rights until the week before July 1 and then other teams can actually sign him July 1.  Just because he can't sign with another team until July 1 that doesn't change the fact that he is no longer contractually bound to his current team once the season ends and is free to seek employment elsewhere therefore making him a free agent.  This is why Stamkos "re-signed" with TB and is listed amongst the FA signings by the FA trackers on various websites.

 

On the other hand, ROR's contract was "extended."  He signed his extension with a year left on his current deal and the added years and money were an extension of the deal already in place.  In this case ROR never hit free agency.

[stenbaro]

I dont really care all that much about free agents.. The best players the Sabres or for that part most any team have had come through the Draft or trades.  Free agents are a bonus if u land a once in a lifetimer,  more often than not they are roster fillers.  If they don't want to come to Buffalo big deal. Hell I live here and just the drive around the 290 to 190 and around makes me want to commit suicide the way people drive around here.  

[Hoss]

I dont really care all that much about free agents.. The best players the Sabres or for that part most any team have had come through the Draft or trades.  Free agents are a bonus if u land a once in a lifetimer,  more often than not they are roster fillers.  If they don't want to come to Buffalo big deal. Hell I live here and just the drive around the 290 to 190 and around makes me want to commit suicide the way people drive around here.  

Agreed. I don't really care that Buffalo becomes a free agent destination. I want them to become an extension destination.

[SDS]

Could the posters talking about generic free agency destinations please start a new thread about it so other people can join in? No one is going to go to the Vesey thread to discuss this topic.

[Hoss]

Could the posters talking about generic free agency destinations please start a new thread about it so other people can join in? No one is going to go to the Vesey thread to discuss this topic.

By "no one" do you mean the over ten people who have come to this thread to discuss it? :P

 

I wanted to start a "what's next" thread for a while but I'm to lazy to do so haha.

Edited August 21, 2016 by Hoss

[beerme1]

So are you reading my posts or what? It was LIKE he hit FA

 

 

Yes! Sometimes though comprehension and spelling aren't my strengths.  ;)

[WildCard]

2 NHL execs weigh in on Vesey's decision

We may never know why Vesey truly chose New York, but some NHL executives had ideas.

 

“He was promised big money after his entry-level deal,” said one executive, who requested anonymity while also expressing a buyer-beware sentiment on Vesey.

 

“He wants the big stage like Hayes,” said another. “Be careful what you ask for. That city will eat him alive.”

 

http://www.todaysslapshot.com/one-timers/craigs-list-vesey-makes-curious-choice-maloney-moves-on/

 

Rob Vollman weighs in on Vesey's potential using analytics

But how good can Vesey be in the NHL, especially right away?

 

A historical statistical analysis suggests 30 points is a reasonable target in his rookie season, followed by a career as a capable second-line forward.

https://www.nhl.com/news/jimmy-vesey-nhl-path-behind-the-numbers/c-281367470

Edited August 21, 2016 by WildCard

[North Buffalo]

These are not objective facts you would put in a question and answer thread. Everyone has a theory on what happened and they're pretty equally valid. (But it's been so long, maybe that's exactly what happened and you can link to solid sources.)

Yeh and the story I heard was Drury always wanted to go to NYC and had no intention of signing a contract... who knows maybe some combo.

[inkman]

Yeh and the story I heard was Drury always wanted to go to NYC and had no intention of signing a contract... who knows maybe some combo.

False

[LTS]

First game in Buffalo. Boos every time he touches the puck. You know it will happen.

 

Can't be booed if you are not on the ice. :)

 

But honestly...

 

So there they were (Sabres leadership) sitting around thinking.. how much do we want to spend on marketing this summer?  There was a lot of muttering and discussion and then Murray clears his throat.  The room falls silent.  Why would Tim Murray want to chime in on marketing?

 

Tim says, "I've got this third round pick I don't need.  You're talking about spending a good amount of money on advertising.  What if I go out and trade for the rights to this kid Vesey.  People can talk about Buffalo as being in on a huge name and our name will be out there."

 

"Do you want him?"

 

"No, I don't want him.  He's not my kind of player.  We'll pitch him.  Tell everyone the choice is his and when he goes elsewhere we can move on."

 

"Hmmmm.."

 

This morning at the water cooler.

 

"81 pages... those guys at the fan forum hit 81 pages talking about this."

 

<Tim Murray Face>

 

 

Bottom line? I was off the grid when the news broke.  Didn't care, still don't. He's on his way now...

[Stoner]

LTS, I don't think you're that far off from the truth.

[pi2000]

LTS, I don't think you're that far off from the truth.

 

It's ludicrous.    Many across the hockey world thought he would sign shortly after BUF acquired his rights.     GMTM wanted him, it wasn't just a publicity stunt... gimme a break.      

 

Two weeks until world cup games, can't get here soon enough.

[Stoner]

It's ludicrous.    Many across the hockey world thought he would sign shortly after BUF acquired his rights.     GMTM wanted him, it wasn't just a publicity stunt... gimme a break.      

 

Two weeks until world cup games, can't get here soon enough.

I should have written more. It wasn't the case with Murray, but plenty of small-market teams "get in on" the hottest free agent coach or player knowing they have zero chance, just to lead the fan base on a bit. So, no Richards?

[dudacek]

I should have written more. It wasn't the case with Murray, but plenty of small-market teams "get in on" the hottest free agent coach or player knowing they have zero chance, just to lead the fan base on a bit. So, no Richards?

Your good point notwithstanding, aren't you kind of glad you didn't get it across well on first attempt?

It was kind of nice to see Pi responding incredulously to somebody's post for once, instead of the other way around.

[North Buffalo]

I should have written more. It wasn't the case with Murray, but plenty of small-market teams "get in on" the hottest free agent coach or player knowing they have zero chance, just to lead the fan base on a bit. So, no Richards?

False

Was gonna get snarky stating my info was based on inside info but decided to not but for you inkman pftttttt!<}#<!%