Steven Stamkos stays in Tampa Bay, 8.5mil x 8yrs

[LastPommerFan]

No way we're paying foligno 2.5M to play on the fourth line.

[IKnowPhysics]

When you have three scoring lines, your 4th line is your 3rd line.

[TrueBlueGED]

No way we're paying foligno 2.5M to play on the fourth line.

So we're trading him? Because he's not getting less than that. I'm fine with moving him, for the record.

When you have three scoring lines, your 4th line is your 3rd line.

Indeed.

So we can expect a third-round pick for him? Somewhere around pick 69 (or less)?

I laughed.

[...]

I think Girgensons and one of Gorges or Franson gets packaged for a trade, ideally for some picks.

 

I would prefer Ennis be involved in that trade, too.

This year, if we get Stamkos and Vesey, GMTM gets his forward ranks completed (essentially) and has to wait until next season to finish up the D.

[TrueBlueGED]

I think Girgensons and one of Gorges or Franson gets packaged for a trade, ideally for some picks.

 

I would prefer Ennis be involved in that trade, too.

This year, if we get Stamkos and Vesey, GMTM gets his forward ranks completed (essentially) and has to wait until next season to finish up the D.

I'll be so mad if we dump Girgensons for picks. Gorges, sure. Ennis I wouldn't, but I get it.

 

Edit: I think you're right on Murray's thinking. He tried to fix the defense this year, the market wasn't right and he couldn't, so he'll turn his attention to helping what he still can. I'm choosing to be optimistic that he knows the defense still needs help.

Edited June 25, 2016 by TrueBlueGED

[Brawndo]

Since it's now confirmed we're making a run at Stamkos, let's have some fun with money. We currently have 9 projected NHL forwards under contract (I'm excluding Cal O'Reilly, Rodrigues, and McCormick), four defensemen, and 1 goaltender. Our cap space (after subtracting those we will bury in Rochester or stash on LTIR) is ~$22.5 million, and we need to sign 4 forwards, 3 Dmen, and a goalie. I will also work under the assumption we retain all of our RFAs, which will take care of three forward and three defensemen spots. Just for the sake of it, I will also assume we sign Vesey and that we're not adding a meaningful piece outside of Stamkos.

 

Girgensons: $2M x2

Foligno: $2.5M x3

Ristolainen: $5.3M x6 (you could argue to bridge here, but I don't see any way his camp agrees to it)

McCabe: $2M x3

Nelson: $925k x2

Vesey: $925k x2

Backup goalie: $1.5M x2

==$15.15M

Total cap space = $7.35M

 

So if we go with the Stamkos at $11M figure, we need to free up ~$4M without opening up any holes in the roster. For hockey purposes I think it'd be best to send Moulson to Rochester and replace him with an ELC, but that exercise doesn't actually save money. Buying him out would save ~$1.1M more than burying him, so it's an option, though I don't think a good one (raise your hand if you want him on the books for $900k for three more seasons to save $1M now). So let's set Moulson aside for now.

 

The obvious first step is looking to the Gorges/Franson combo on the blue line. Gorges makes $3.9M and Franson $3.325M. If we could trade both of them without retaining salary while replacing both with an ELC, boom, done. I'm not sure how realistic that is. Buying out Franson would save $1.3M this year, but most of that savings would probably be eaten up by his replacement (not to mention the $670k cap hit next season). Doable, but not super attractive in my estimation. I don't think we can get rid of both Gorges and Franson without retaining any salary and/or replace them with pure $1M players, but let's just go with the optimistic scenario we can because I'm tired of typing. Roster would look something like:

 

O'Reilly-Stamkos-Ennis

Vesey-Eichel-Reinhart

Kane-Girgensons-Fasching

Foligno-Larsson-Gionta

Deslauriers

 

Kulikov-Ristolainen

McCabe-Bogosian

Scrub #1-Nelson

Scrub #2

 

Lehner

Backupnobodycaresaboutuntillehnergetshurtagain

 

**Note: I didn't put a ton of thought into the lines, just threw them together quick. And yes. Moulson is in Rochester for Fasching.

 

As expected, that forward group is utterly stacked. Wowza. Not sure how anyone could look at that group and not get excited. But holy hell that blue line makes me want to go over the Falls in a cardboard barrel. Playoff team? I think so. Swept in the first round? Quite possibly :lol:

Just a gut feeling, Guhle makes the team out of TC.

 

And Rip is going to be pissed when he has to fit that backup's name on the back of a jersey

[TrueBlueGED]

Just a gut feeling, Guhle makes the team out of TC.

 

And Rip is going to be pissed when he has to fit that backup's name on the back of a jersey

If Guhle makes it I hope it's because he earned it, not because Murray priced himself out of all other options.

[IKnowPhysics]

By the way, Stamkos would already be 4th on the list of all time Sabres goal scorers behind Perrault, Martin, and Andreychuk and 5th in all time points behind that same list plus Ramsay.  His 60 goal campaign would have put him firmly behind only AMo's 76 goal campaign for most goals in a season.  He's won the Richard twice.

 

Top NHL salaries.  Toews and Kane both make $10.5M.  Kopitar $10M.  Ovechkin and Malkin $9.5M.  And those were all deals signed to stay with their home clubs, not on the open market.

 

I think you pay Stamkos top dollar ($10.5M) for maximum term and then have to pay a 20% premium for free agency ($2M ish).  You're buying a Hall of Famer for $12.5M/year.  Then you work out the roster.  And then you hope that the salary cap goes up.

Edited June 25, 2016 by IKnowPhysics

[Brawndo]

Interesting comparison Murray who is vocal about his desire to get Stamkos and Ken Holland who says I don't see the merit of revealing our UFA Plans to the world.

 

http://espn.go.com/blog/nhl/post/_/id/42820/rumblings-whats-steven-stamkos-going-to-do-next

[IKnowPhysics]

List of teams besides BUF and TBL interested in Stamkos:

 

Historically: TOR, VAN, MTL, CAL, NYI, DET, STL

 

Today: TOR, VAN, MTL, NYI, DET, BOS, NYR

 

I see five of the seven other teams in our division lining up for Stamkos and two more teams in the East.  I really want GMTM and the Pegulas to up someone else's day.  And by someone else, I mean the entire division.  And by day, I mean their next seven years.

[7+6=13]

I'd pay Stamkos 12mil per season.  We're instantly a playoff team and then Murray would only need to make a couple moves to make us a contender.  Stamkos isn't just a bonus - he immediately changes and accelerates the team to having a shot at contending.  Without Stamkos this team isn't a contender for several years - we're just too weak at the middle and bottom of the lineup.

 

We're a young team so obviously there's another way to become a contender but it's just going to take longer.  Eichel will have to become an NHL star but that's probably 2 more seasons away. 

 

Stamkos would allow us to do it now - waiting for Eichel is going to be a progression.  What's so incredible to think about is when Stamkos is slowing down a bit Eichel will be in his prime and this can go on for a very long time.  We'd be one of those playoff every year teams - that when it all clicks could win it any season for the next 10. 

[TrueBlueGED]

Eichel will be a star this season. Two years my tookus.

[7+6=13]

Eichel will be a star this season. Two years my tookus.

 

Maybe, but I think he's probably a couple seasons from being a 70+ point guy. 

[TrueBlueGED]

Maybe, but I think he's probably a couple seasons from being a 70+ point guy.

He put up 56 as a rookie while only playing a third of the year with a linemate he had chemistry with. Add a year of development for him and Reinhart, with a better second winger, and he can't add 14 points? Pshaw I say! Stamkos hit 90 as a sophomore after having a worse rookie season than Eichel. And Eichel won't hit 70? You underestimate our franchise player.

[Brawndo]

I have seen Sabres Twitter mention that Eichel should move to Stamko's Wing if he is signed.

 

No just no.

 

Put him with ROR, and keep Jack on his own line. Stamkos and Eichel are puck carriers having them together is of little benefit.

 

ROR can take Faceoffs and Stamkos can handle the zone entries.

[7+6=13]

He put up 56 as a rookie while only playing a third of the year with a linemate he had chemistry with. Add a year of development for him and Reinhart, with a better second winger, and he can't add 14 points? Pshaw I say! Stamkos hit 90 as a sophomore after having a worse rookie season than Eichel. And Eichel won't hit 70? You underestimate our franchise player.

 

Of course I hope he is - but I'm not ready to say he's as good as Stamkos.  Are you saying you think Jack will be in the 90's next year?

Edited June 25, 2016 by 7+6=13

[lowghen]

On just the salary variable, I will legitimately be upset if he goes to another team because the Sabres were willing to offer $10.5-$11mil compared to ~$12mil. Stamkos is 26 years old, has playoff experience, and a proven goal scorer. 

 

In terms of active player stat leaders, here's where Stamkos sits:

 

• Points/Games Played - #6 (.988)
• Total Goals -  #18, 312 Goals (569 Games Played)
  • Every player above him except Crosby has at least 200 more games played
  • Crosby - 338 Goals (707 Games Played)
• Powerplay Goals - #12, 108 Goals

A player this young with these kind of stats (Crosby, Toews, Kane, Malkin), rarely become free agents. Stamkos will make an immediate impact and make the Sabres an offensive powerhouse. Pay the man!

[TrueBlueGED]

Of course I hope he is - but I'm not ready to say he's as good as Stamkos. Are you saying you think Jack will be in the 90's next year?

90? No, the league has changed. Maybe 80, confident in 70.

[7+6=13]

90? No, the league has changed. Maybe 80, confident in 70.

 

Ok.  I think it's possible but with young teammates I lean towards that being lofty.  

 

My main point is with a 19-20 year old Eichel - there's room for Stamkos to be the man now and Jack transitioning into it.  If you want to contend now vs a bit later.

[IKnowPhysics]

In any case, I think we've all been long in agreement that accumulating all of the elite talent the Sabres would need to go over the top and guarantee Cup wins would require us to go beyond drafting and growing our own talent.  We would need to trade or go free agency on offense to acquire elite parts to complement our high draft picks.

 

Stamkos is as an elite talent as you'll ever see available.  And he's in free agency, which means no major assets have to be moved out to get him.  This is the best possible scenario for acquiring a zany amount of elite talent to win Cups.  And as I mentioned before, boning the rest of the division out the opportunity to land him is worth major ($) consideration.

 

Edited June 25, 2016 by IKnowPhysics

[inkman]

On just the salary variable, I will legitimately be upset if he goes to another team because the Sabres were willing to offer $10.5-$11mil compared to ~$12mil. Stamkos is 26 years old, has playoff experience, and a proven goal scorer.

 

In terms of active player stat leaders, here's where Stamkos sits:

 

• Points/Games Played - #6 (.988)
• Total Goals - #18, 312 Goals (569 Games Played)
  • Every player above him except Crosby has at least 200 more games played
  • Crosby - 338 Goals (707 Games Played)
• Powerplay Goals - #12, 108 Goals

A player this young with these kind of stats (Crosby, Toews, Kane, Malkin), rarely become free agents. Stamkos will make an immediate impact and make the Sabres an offensive powerhouse. Pay the man!

Money won't be the issue

[3putt]

I think Stamkos is looking for payday and he has earned it. But I think his experience with Cooper is coloring his decision a bit. With that in mind I am sure he will be on the horn to Crosby and Tavares to get their input on Bylsma and Capuano respectively. He knows Babcock from Hockey Canada ( I think). If we are looking for a dark horse in this race I think it's the Isles. I would say Toronto is the front runner.

[7+6=13]

Money won't be the issue

 

I don't think this will be the deciding factor either.  I doubt someone offering $500K more gets him - this is going to be about showing him everything about the organization.  So crazy because it's this type of energy the NHL is missing.

[qwksndmonster]

I've been pretty all in on Stamkos. Learning that he is "a center and only a center" really disappoints me. I guess we move Reinhart for a stud D-man? That'd still make our team a lot better, but it'd be so hard to give up Samson.

[sabills]

I've been pretty all in on Stamkos. Learning that he is "a center and only a center" really disappoints me. I guess we move Reinhart for a stud D-man? That'd still make our team a lot better, but it'd be so hard to give up Samson.

No, because Samson is a winger.