TRADE: Jamie McGinn traded to Anaheim

[Weave]

I don't get the lament that a competent NHLer was traded for a guy unlikely to make the NHL.

 

Murray is stockpiling assets again so that he can acquire NHL talent.

 

I'll chuckle if anyone on Team McGinn Lamentation laments this summer that GM TM gave away too much for an NHLer of his choice.

 

1.  You don't get that some folks want to watch quality hockey?  That they don't sit in front of the TV to cheer for an undefined future?  That they are not willing to accept non-competitive players as a means to an end?  I'm in it to be entertained.  there is nothing remotely entertaining about 20 games of Cal O'Reilly and Markus Foligno in the top 6.

 

2.  I think you'll find I wasn't one of those that complained about what price was paid.

I'm a consumer as much as I am a fan.  I won't accept an inferior product.

[pastajoe]

This team has been competitive and entertaining. That last game vs LA was a great game. Lehner has been playing well since his return. In those 3 Cal. Games they were outscored by a total of 4-3. Of course we want more goals and wins, but they're competitive in most games. And Marcus and Cal aren't getting top 6 minutes unless there's more injuries.

[hsif]

It would be nice to watch a team that has a chance  prayer.... Not that Mcginn would have led the sermon.

 

roll video of Miller getting run..... Gionta getting pinwheeled ....... Bogo headfirst into the boards..... "ARE YOU NOT ENTERTAINED?"

[That Aud Smell]

1. You don't get that some folks want to watch quality hockey? That they don't sit in front of the TV to cheer for an undefined future? That they are not willing to accept non-competitive players as a means to an end? I'm in it to be entertained. there is nothing remotely entertaining about 20 games of Cal O'Reilly and Markus Foligno in the top 6.

 

2. I think you'll find I wasn't one of those that complained about what price was paid.

 

I'm a consumer as much as I am a fan. I won't accept an inferior product.

I understand that sentiment in "1" above, I just think it's a bit penny wise and pound foolish.

 

I used to home brew because I love to drink interesting beer. (Mine was rarely "good", but at least it was interesting.) I could've started drinking after week 2, or whatever, because I love to drink beer, but if I waited until week 5 or whatever, I'd get a much better experience.

 

I know it's a poor metaphor, and verges on Jeremy White's Two Marshmallow campaign, but you take my meaning.

 

I'm not really relishing the remaining games either. But I am looking forward to future glories.

[Weave]

I understand that sentiment in "1" above, I just think it's a bit penny wise and pound foolish.

 

I used to home brew because I love to drink interesting beer. (Mine was rarely "good", but at least it was interesting.) I could've started drinking after week 2, or whatever, because I love to drink beer, but if I waited until week 5 or whatever, I'd get a much better experience.

 

I know it's a poor metaphor, and verges on Jeremy White's Two Marshmallow campaign, but you take my meaning.

 

I'm not really relishing the remaining games either. But I am looking forward to future glories.

 

It's a lousy metaphor because there are other ways.

[Claude_Verret]

There was an opportunity for other ways to rebuild, but the moment DR started selling off the old core and speaking of suffering the die was cast. We must stay the course, and yes three years in is still part of the original timeline, and no it's not guaranteed to work.

[Weave]

There was an opportunity for other ways to rebuild, but the moment DR started selling off the old core and speaking of suffering the die was cast. We must stay the course, and yes three years in is still part of the original timeline, and no it's not guaranteed to work.

 

Darcy's sell off had nothing to do with yesterday.

 

I've stated it before, and upthread, the whole players for assets thing is something I find distasteful as a whole.  I don't like Toronto doing it either.  It lessens the product they put on the ice against Buffalo as well.  I think it is a thing to sell to fans.  I know it won't change, but I don't have to like it, or not vent when it happens.

[Radar]

Frankly I don't think this team has not been competitive. Also yesterdays trade is relatively insignificant in the whole scheme of things as far as quality of entertainment unless , of course, you're a member of his family. Expectations for this team were too high among some to begin with. Yes, we expected improvement. I think we've seen that. Other teams improving should not have been overlooked in our expectations either.

[Claude_Verret]

Darcy's sell off had nothing to do with yesterday.

 

I've stated it before, and upthread, the whole players for assets thing is something I find distasteful as a whole. I don't like Toronto doing it either. It lessens the product they put on the ice against Buffalo as well. I think it is a ###### thing to sell to fans. I know it won't change, but I don't have to like it, or not vent when it happens.

DR's selling off was the beginning of the process that led to deals like we saw yesterday. It would be happening if DR, TM or any other GM was here running the show.

 

I get not liking the players for assets trades, but it is how things are done in the NHL these days for better or worse. Like others have said if this rebuild progresses as planned we'll soon be on the other side of these deals by shipping out some of the stockpiled futures for real NHLers.

[SwampD]

I don't get the lament that a competent NHLer was traded for a guy unlikely to make the NHL.

 

Murray is stockpiling assets again so that he can acquire NHL talent.

 

I'll chuckle if anyone on Team McGinn Lamentation laments this summer that GM TM gave away too much for an NHLer of his choice.

 

Nobody is lamenting the loss of McGinn. We are lamenting the loss of yet another season, with no end sight to Darcy's suffering anywhere on the horizon.

[LGR4GM]

Nobody is lamenting the loss of McGinn. We are lamenting the loss of yet another season, with no end sight to Darcy's suffering anywhere on the horizon.

I see the horizon. 

 

I really don't understand why even if we didn't add anything from outside the system to this team next year, we wouldn't expect to be better?  Jack Eichel will be the same player at 20 he was at 19 and Reinhart has obviously plateaued right? I mean that seems to be the belief whether it is voiced or not. The reason this team won't be Edmonton East is because we have 2 way players, we have vets, we have ROR for crying out loud. Murray could have sold every UFA we had yesterday yet veterans like Legwand are still here because this isn't a tank year. However it is the first year post tank and to expect us to magically go from 50 some odd points in the standings to 90 some odd points in the standings in one off season I think is insane.

 

For me this team has been as entertaining as possible in the current "lucky bounce" era of the NHL where most games are decided by volume not skill. We have lost something like 16 1 goal games now. If we had won just half of those we would be talking about playoff chances most likely. We are that close. Next year I expect, demand, playoffs.

Edited March 1, 2016 by LGR4GM

[Claude_Verret]

Nobody is lamenting the loss of McGinn. We are lamenting the loss of yet another season, with no end sight to Darcy's suffering anywhere on the horizon.

See this is where I disagree as I still see an end to the suffering in sight, but I know it's largely colored by individual perspective and expectations. To me this season has not resembled the past two by any reasonable measure. I know the improvement hasn't been enough for some, but I don't think anyone can argue there hasn't been improvement. Lowest of low bars and all, but improvement nonetheless. If we don't see marked progress again next season then ill be ready to be concerned about the rebuild.

[That Aud Smell]

It's a lousy metaphor because there are other ways.

 

It was the best I had ready at hand. 

 

Like I said, I understand where you're coming from. And it's clear you have a strong distaste for this practice generally.

 

For my part, I'm willing to sacrifice marginally better hockey games in the remainder of a non-playoff season in favor of building a cache of assets that should help the team contend in the coming years.

 

Nobody is lamenting the loss of McGinn. 

 

That's not true. Take a look upthread.

 

(Unless you are referring to Nobody the poster?)

[darksabre]

Nobody is lamenting the loss of McGinn. We are lamenting the loss of yet another season, with no end sight to Darcy's suffering anywhere on the horizon.

Lamenting the loss of a season that was never going to end in the playoffs anyway? Good grief. You all need therapy. 

 

Complain all you want about kicking the "hope can" down the road to next season, but that was always the plan anyway. Detach yourself from the Darcy years, for the love of god. Those days are gone. Live in the present. 

 

If we're sellers next year, by all means, lose your mind. I'll be right there with you. But this season was and will continue to be a rebuild season. Where rebuild is a nice way of saying "suckfest". 

 

Playoffs next year. Whatever this year. If being hopeful for the future is too hard for you, then I am sorry. But you wont find much sympathy. Not in the cold, logical wake of the Tank. The course has been set. You can stay on the boat or get off. I'm staying on the boat where trading Jamie McGinn is a complete non-issue. 

[SwampD]

I see the horizon. 

 

I really don't understand why even if we didn't add anything from outside the system to this team next year, we wouldn't expect to be better?  Jack Eichel will be the same player at 20 he was at 19 and Reinhart has obviously plateaued right? I mean that seems to be the belief whether it is voiced or not. The reason this team won't be Edmonton East is because we have 2 way players, we have vets, we have ROR for crying out loud. Murray could have sold every UFA we had yesterday yet veterans like Legwand are still here because this isn't a tank year. However it is the first year post tank and to expect us to magically go from 50 some odd points in the standings to 90 some odd points in the standings in one off season I think is insane.

 

For me this team has been as entertaining as possible in the current "lucky bounce" era of the NHL where most games are decided by volume not skill. We have lost something like 16 1 goal games now. If we had one just half of those we would be talking about playoff chances most likely. We are that close. Next year I expect, demand, playoffs.

I agree with all of this, and I, too, have been happy with the way this season has gone so far (way more than most who are discussing in this thread, ironically). We all know what is going on and how it has to happen, but when the end of another season comes knocking at my door on March 1st, don't ask me to invite it in and offer it a robe and wash it's feet.

[bunomatic]

I agree. This team is in phenomenal shape going forward.

 

21 draft picks in the next two seasons. Ryan O'Reilly, Jack Eichel, Evander Kane, Rasmus Ristolainen and Sam Reinhart solidified as legitimate top-end pieces (whether it's for a good team or not is, admittedly, to be seen).

Lehner, Ennis, Girgensons, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching, Pysyk, McCabe and Bogosian all with potential to have good roles that should be determined within the next two or three years (many sooner).

 

The calls for GMTM's head if the team isn't a playoff team next year is a tad confusing. He has pulled off some great moves. The argument for grabbing the pitchforks so soon after having two of the worst teams in NHL history is because we acquired so much talent so quickly that you can't compare this team to the teams of the last two seasons. That's a CREDIT to GMTM. If the team underachieves it's likely due to growing pains and, possibly, bad coaching. GMTM gets a full two seasons after this season from me. If there's marked improvement in that span then he gets until this team hits a wall or suddenly slumps badly.

 

This offseason will be a great chance to see GMTM flex some muscle. There will be plenty of free agent opportunities to sway wanted players (Stamkos, Okposo, Yandle for starters). And he's got just as much ammo as anybody else in a similar position throughout the league.

Thank you Hoss. The voice of reason and I agree with this sentiment.  

[jsb]

I agree. This team is in phenomenal shape going forward.

 

21 draft picks in the next two seasons. Ryan O'Reilly, Jack Eichel, Evander Kane, Rasmus Ristolainen and Sam Reinhart solidified as legitimate top-end pieces (whether it's for a good team or not is, admittedly, to be seen).

Lehner, Ennis, Girgensons, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching, Pysyk, McCabe and Bogosian all with potential to have good roles that should be determined within the next two or three years (many sooner).

 

The calls for GMTM's head if the team isn't a playoff team next year is a tad confusing. He has pulled off some great moves. The argument for grabbing the pitchforks so soon after having two of the worst teams in NHL history is because we acquired so much talent so quickly that you can't compare this team to the teams of the last two seasons. That's a CREDIT to GMTM. If the team underachieves it's likely due to growing pains and, possibly, bad coaching. GMTM gets a full two seasons after this season from me. If there's marked improvement in that span then he gets until this team hits a wall or suddenly slumps badly.

 

This offseason will be a great chance to see GMTM flex some muscle. There will be plenty of free agent opportunities to sway wanted players (Stamkos, Okposo, Yandle for starters). And he's got just as much ammo as anybody else in a similar position throughout the league.

Good post, I agree with you on just about everything but bad coaching, I think with all the young guys and the never having a full squad has hurt him but as an example these past 3 games we never gave in. I think the guys are slowly but surely figuring out his gameplan and they are playing hard for him. I didn't see any quit whatsoever this entire season. Do all the guys fit in his system is up for debate but I think they've bought in.

 

I'm not fully in about us being a playoff team again next year because again we are going to be a young, inexperienced team with the possible additions of Bailey, Fasching and 1st rounder. It is all going to be on the additions made by GMTM in free agency and trades. I'm making a good guess we aren't going to use 25-33% of those draft choices. It won't be necessarily the big names we go after but the RFA's that other teams may not be able to afford with cap issues.

[That Aud Smell]

Playoffs next year. Whatever this year. If being hopeful for the future is too hard for you, then I am sorry. But you wont find much sympathy. Not in the cold, logical wake of the Tank. The course has been set. You can stay on the boat or get off. I'm staying on the boat where trading Jamie McGinn is a complete non-issue. 

 

I'm already resolved to the idea that they will contend for the playoffs next year; they may not make the cut. A bubble team.

 

I see no need for McGinn Lamenters to get off the boat. They're welcome to stay aboard and complain.

I agree. This team is in phenomenal shape going forward.

 

. . . Ryan O'Reilly, Jack Eichel, Evander Kane, Rasmus Ristolainen and Sam Reinhart solidified as legitimate top-end pieces (whether it's for a good team or not is, admittedly, to be seen).

Lehner, Ennis, Girgensons, Bailey, Baptiste, Fasching, Pysyk, McCabe and Bogosian all with potential to have good roles that should be determined within the next two or three years (many sooner).

 

I think I'd sooner put Bogosian in that cohort than Kane. But I think the way you see it is also the way GM TM sees it. I'm really not sold on the guy (Kane, that is).

[bunomatic]

I see the horizon. 

 

I really don't understand why even if we didn't add anything from outside the system to this team next year, we wouldn't expect to be better?  Jack Eichel will be the same player at 20 he was at 19 and Reinhart has obviously plateaued right? I mean that seems to be the belief whether it is voiced or not. The reason this team won't be Edmonton East is because we have 2 way players, we have vets, we have ROR for crying out loud. Murray could have sold every UFA we had yesterday yet veterans like Legwand are still here because this isn't a tank year. However it is the first year post tank and to expect us to magically go from 50 some odd points in the standings to 90 some odd points in the standings in one off season I think is insane.

 

For me this team has been as entertaining as possible in the current "lucky bounce" era of the NHL where most games are decided by volume not skill. We have lost something like 16 1 goal games now. If we had won just half of those we would be talking about playoff chances most likely. We are that close. Next year I expect, demand, playoffs.

And thank you LGR. Another voice of reason. This season has gone pretty much as I'd hoped it would. Young guns have shown improvement, we are in most games and across the board for the most part we have shown improvement in areas we were deficient in last year. This offseason the draft and the leadup to next season is going to be exciting. More change and more improvement. 

[That Aud Smell]

As much as I am a middle-of-the-road fella, I think the call for "reason" on a message board devoted to fandom is a bit overdone sometimes. I don't begrudge people being angry and upset (irrational, even) over their favourite team's fortunes.

 

Anyhoo. The more I think about it, the more this season turned on three disappearing acts (with various causes and prognoses): Moulson, Ennis, Girgensons.

 

If those guys (or even two of them) perform close to expectation, this team would be right around where I thought they would be.

[darksabre]

I'm already resolved to the idea that they will contend for the playoffs next year; they may not make the cut. A bubble team.

 

I see no need for McGinn Lamenters to get off the boat. They're welcome to stay aboard and complain.

If they want to complain about the loss of McGinn then they need to finish that line of complaint. Take it to its logical end. Renounce the rebuild. Renounce the fruits of the tank. Renounce GMTM. Renounce the entire process that we're in the midst of before it has been seen through.

 

Anything less is just whining. 

[That Aud Smell]

If they want to complain about the loss of McGinn then they need to finish that line of complaint. Take it to its logical end. Renounce the rebuild. Renounce the fruits of the tank. Renounce GMTM. Renounce the entire process that we're in the midst of before it has been seen through.

 

Anything less is just whining. 

 

I'm not inclined to be so dogmatic about other people's complaining. 

 

Anyway, it's a rational position to say that the team had more than enough assets and did not really need to move McGinn, and the team should have kept him in favour of allowing for a stronger finish to the season, better locker room atmosphere (I remain a little concerned over Eichel's evident fondness for McGinn), and the start of a winning culture.

[Weave]

If they want to complain about the loss of McGinn then they need to finish that line of complaint. Take it to its logical end. Renounce the rebuild. Renounce the fruits of the tank. Renounce GMTM. Renounce the entire process that we're in the midst of before it has been seen through.

 

Anything less is just whining. 

 

Oh FFS, Get off your horse.

[SwampD]

I love that the loudest voices all year, complaining about where the team is have turned into these guys.

 

[That Aud Smell]

None of us are advising GM TM, of course.