Early opinions on Lehner after 10+ games?

[Eleven]

Who else was available at that spot to draft anyways?

 

That's where I am.  I know I posted it elsewhere, but you have to go back to 2005 to find an impact player at that spot.  May as well take a flyer on a goalie you like.

 

All that said, it seems he has some maturing to do--gotta be able to shake stuff off--but I like some of his fundamentals a lot.  His positioning is very good, and since Chz pointed it out in another thread, I've taken notice of how he redirects the puck after rebounds, and I like it.

[Peppy22]

Goalies are always a difficult topic.

 

Some goalies are elite if they have to face 35 shots per game and struggle if they only face 27 or less...

 

So right now Lehner has been good. Regarding his injuries and that he is back only for a few weeks now I am pretty happy with how he played.

[mjd1001]

That's where I am.  I know I posted it elsewhere, but you have to go back to 2005 to find an impact player at that spot.  May as well take a flyer on a goalie you like.

 

All that said, it seems he has some maturing to do--gotta be able to shake stuff off--but I like some of his fundamentals a lot.  His positioning is very good, and since Chz pointed it out in another thread, I've taken notice of how he redirects the puck after rebounds, and I like it.

I think that is where I come down on this (at least partially).  You get very few top 6 forwards, top 2 D-men from that point in the draft.  So, strictly from that point of view it was worth taking a shot on a starting goalie.

 

HOWEVER, if you would packaged that pick with next years #2, how much higher in this draft could you have moved up?  Or could you have flipped it to someone else for a future #1 and played the lottery with that pick in future years?

[Eleven]

I think that is where I come down on this (at least partially).  You get very few top 6 forwards, top 2 D-men from that point in the draft.  So, strictly from that point of view it was worth taking a shot on a starting goalie.

 

HOWEVER, if you would packaged that pick with next years #2, how much higher in this draft could you have moved up?  Or could you have flipped it to someone else for a future #1 and played the lottery with that pick in future years?

 

I was and am so sick of the "eternal future," so I am good with the move.

[nfreeman]

I think that is where I come down on this (at least partially).  You get very few top 6 forwards, top 2 D-men from that point in the draft.  So, strictly from that point of view it was worth taking a shot on a starting goalie.

 

HOWEVER, if you would packaged that pick with next years #2, how much higher in this draft could you have moved up?  Or could you have flipped it to someone else for a future #1 and played the lottery with that pick in future years?

 

I think this is a fair point, both on Lehner and on the other GMTM trades -- i.e. in evaluating the trades, one has to consider the assets the Sabres gave up both in terms of the specific trade, and in terms of what those assets might've returned in other moves.  So it's not really a complete analysis to say, for example, that the Sabres got the best player in the Kane trade, that Myers is only a bit better than Bogo and that Lemieux, Armia and the #1 probably won't amount to much.  You also have to consider the fact that Myers, Lemieux, Armia and the #1 each had value on the NHL trade market, and that utilizing them in other deals might have returned more than what the Sabres got in that trade.

 

Having said all of that, I'm still 100% supportive of the Kane trade.  I just think it's important to analyze it from that perspective as well.

[ddaryl]

If he can stay healthy he'll improve on his solid showing so far. He's obviously rusty from 2 years of dealing with injury. He has shown plenty and IMO will improve and get better along side of a team that will do the same around him

[BetweenThePipes00]

HOWEVER, if you would packaged that pick with next years #2, how much higher in this draft could you have moved up?  Or could you have flipped it to someone else for a future #1 and played the lottery with that pick in future years?

 

 

I think this is a fair point, both on Lehner and on the other GMTM trades -- i.e. in evaluating the trades, one has to consider the assets the Sabres gave up both in terms of the specific trade, and in terms of what those assets might've returned in other moves.  So it's not really a complete analysis to say, for example, that the Sabres got the best player in the Kane trade, that Myers is only a bit better than Bogo and that Lemieux, Armia and the #1 probably won't amount to much.  You also have to consider the fact that Myers, Lemieux, Armia and the #1 each had value on the NHL trade market, and that utilizing them in other deals might have returned more than what the Sabres got in that trade.

 

Having said all of that, I'm still 100% supportive of the Kane trade.  I just think it's important to analyze it from that perspective as well.

 

I think I disagree, at least in the case of the Kane deal because there are so many parts ... what you guys are saying isn't crazy, but I think that sends you down a "what if" rabbit hole to which there is no end. How can we even begin to speculate accurately on what the trade market was for Joel Armia on his own? Or then also when packaged with Myers? But not Stafford, because they could have moved him alone to some other team ... or with Lemieux in a separate deal ... and don't get me started on what that first-round pick we threw in might have fetched ... my head hurts.

All this is not to say the analysis is as simple as "We got the best player, we win." I just think you evaluate the deal on what it is, because rarely do we have enough info to say what else COULD have happened. It's not like "they should have taken Bossy instead of Seiling." We don't really know what else might have been available to GMTM for all those parts, and the more guys involved in the deal the less we can know.

(Of course, sometimes it IS possible ... If it's a 1-for-1 and we get a report later that says "They were offered another top prospect, Jimmy Chitwood, who went on to a Hall-of-Fame career, but instead opted for Bump Bailey, who turned out to be a headcase and saw his career come to a tragic end" ... in that case it makes perfect sense. Other than the fictional basketball star being traded for the fictional baseball player.)

[nfreeman]

I think I disagree, at least in the case of the Kane deal because there are so many parts ... what you guys are saying isn't crazy, but I think that sends you down a "what if" rabbit hole to which there is no end. How can we even begin to speculate accurately on what the trade market was for Joel Armia on his own? Or then also when packaged with Myers? But not Stafford, because they could have moved him alone to some other team ... or with Lemieux in a separate deal ... and don't get me started on what that first-round pick we threw in might have fetched ... my head hurts.

All this is not to say the analysis is as simple as "We got the best player, we win." I just think you evaluate the deal on what it is, because rarely do we have enough info to say what else COULD have happened. It's not like "they should have taken Bossy instead of Seiling." We don't really know what else might have been available to GMTM for all those parts, and the more guys involved in the deal the less we can know.

(Of course, sometimes it IS possible ... If it's a 1-for-1 and we get a report later that says "They were offered another top prospect, Jimmy Chitwood, who went on to a Hall-of-Fame career, but instead opted for Bump Bailey, who turned out to be a headcase and saw his career come to a tragic end" ... in that case it makes perfect sense. Other than the fictional basketball star being traded for the fictional baseball player.)

 

Totally fair, and good to see ya, sir!

[Taro T]

Lehner is definitely worth the #21 pick. His potential to be a top goalie is greater than the potential of a skater taken there to be a top liner/ pairing guy. Hopefully he reaches that potential.

 

Plus they got the guy w/ the 175' knuckler. ;)

[StuckinFL]

I posted this in the Columbus GDT, but I would love to say it again:

 

He's absolutely worth the 1st for entertainment value alone. The fact that he's actually good is just gravy. I love every game he starts because it almost feels like we have a caged animal in net that will go berserk at any moment and tear through the opposing team in a flurry of claws and teeth.

 

I can't say whether or not he'll be elite or not and if he'll be our goalie for a cup run or not. I certainly hope he is. Regardless, right now every game he's in is entertaining and I ADORE his intensity. He is the exact opposite personality of Miller in every way. Opposing players are intimidated and afraid of our goalie. It's great seeing the team have his back, but it's amazing to see someone who can handle his **** himself and also have his teammates backs. 

 

One day someone will be stupid enough to drop the gloves with him. On that day angels shall weep for his opponent. 

Edited February 20, 2016 by StuckinFL

[BetweenThePipes00]

Totally agree on his intensity. Lehner is a fun dude to have as your goalie. I would have been more excited about the deal when it was made if I knew he was insane like this.

[Hoss]

If he gives up 8 goals a game from this point on we already won the trade

[Kr632]

I posted this in the Columbus GDT, but I would love to say it again:

 

He's absolutely worth the 1st for entertainment value alone. The fact that he's actually good is just gravy. I love every game he starts because it almost feels like we have a caged animal in net that will go berserk at any moment and tear through the opposing team in a flurry of claws and teeth.

 

I can't say whether or not he'll be elite or not and if he'll be our goalie for a cup run or not. I certainly hope he is. Regardless, right now every game he's in is entertaining and I ADORE his intensity. He is the exact opposite personality of Miller in every way. Opposing players are intimidated and afraid of our goalie. It's great seeing the team have his back, but it's amazing to see someone who can handle his **** himself and also have his teammates backs.

 

One day someone will be stupid enough to drop the gloves with him. On that day angels shall weep for his opponent.

exactly how I feel. He's a nut like Ron hextall. I love it Edited February 20, 2016 by Kr632

[StuckinFL]

Won't be long boys...

 

[matter2003]

I think he has been very good so far...he had one or two bad games but has been very solid, if not spectacular in many of the others...

[thewookie1]

If Lehner continues on growing as he did, I think this questionable trade may even rival that of the O'Reilly deal. Legwand's cap dump was a blessing in disguise to begin with and Lehner has honestly looked like a true #1 goalie.

[Doohicksie]

If Lehner continues on growing as he did, I think this questionable trade may even rival that of the O'Reilly deal. Legwand's cap dump was a blessing in disguise to begin with and Lehner has honestly looked like a true #1 goalie.

 

Legwand has been a terrific veteran presence on the team.  A true senior statesman, along with Gionta.

 

 

Anyway, I thought this belongs here.  I posted it in the GDT, but I think it should be in here too.  If you don't have too much time, just skip ahead to 1:10 in the video.

[thewookie1]

Legwand has been a terrific veteran presence on the team.  A true senior statesman, along with Gionta.

 

 

Anyway, I thought this belongs here.  I posted it in the GDT, but I think it should be in here too.  If you don't have too much time, just skip ahead to 1:10 in the video.

That was hilarious

[Eleven]

Obviously he was the star of the show last night.  And I'm glad that he went into the corner after the Jenner hit.  

 

I am still concerned that his temper will cause him to lose focus again, though.  If that incident had happened at 1-0 in the first rather than 4-0 in the third, I would have been worried about it.

[SwampD]

Obviously he was the star of the show last night.  And I'm glad that he went into the corner after the Jenner hit.  

 

I am still concerned that his temper will cause him to lose focus again, though.  If that incident had happened at 1-0 in the first rather than 4-0 in the third, I would have been worried about it.

I was worried about that as well, but didn't it happen earlier in the game? I think it was Nick Foligno that basically tackled him and he threw a punch then. The BJs were probably told to test that anger early and he passed.

[Eleven]

I was worried about that as well, but didn't it happen earlier in the game? I think it was Nick Foligno that basically tackled him and he threw a punch then. The BJs were probably told to test that anger early and he passed.

 

Good point; I had forgotten about Foligno.

[French Collection]

Lehner is a beast.

[...]

He's not Bruce Banner. He probably has more control over his inclinations than most people, being a disciplined professional athlete. When his team is up 3 or 4 goals and there are only a few minutes left in the game, he probably believed risking his shutout is worth wandering into a scrum to defend a team mate. We need guys like that.

[MODO Hockey]

Lehner is a beast.

He sure is, he has pure rage within, mess with that and u gonna regret it.

[dudacek]

There was time a month or so into the season when we were talking about the play of Ullmark and Johnson, when I observed that the place where good goaltending can really make a difference is on the PK.

 

A top-notch goalie can make the occasional big save, crawl into the shooter's heads and make them overthink things, and give his teammates confidence to push plays.

 

I have no idea if the numbers will back up my theory, but I find it hard to believe it is a coincidence that in the month since Lehner arrived we have climbed from the bottom five in PK to a team flirting with the top 10.

 

That's a pretty amazing statistical leap. We must be killing at well over 90 per cent in that span.