GDT: Buffalo @ Pittsburgh, 7:00 pm edt, 10/29/2015

[Rasmus_]

Through ten games:

 

Love

Ryan O'Reilly

Jack Eichel

Evander Kane (aside from injury)

Samson Reinhart

Rasmus Ristolainen

Mark Pysyk

Jake McCabe

 

Like

Matt Moulson

Jamie McGinn

Nic Deslauriers

Cody Franson

Marcus Foligno

 

Meh

Tyler Ennis

Zemgus Girgensons

Johan Larsson

David Legwand

Carlo Colaiacovo

 

Dislike

Chad Johnson

Brian Gionta

Josh Gorges

 

Hate

Mike Weber

 

TBD

Zach Bogosian

Robin Lehner

Linus Ullmark

Tim Schaller

 

The only things I would switch is to put Zemgus and Larsson in the Like and Carlo in the Hate.  

Ryan O'Reilly's haters before this season can eat a giant can of ***** fill in whatever word you'd like.  He's already the heart and soul of this team.  Ristolainen played a heck of a game and for a change I didn't hate Legwand's play.  I liked Deslauriers and McGinn has gotten his act together.  It was much tighter than I thought it would be.  51 to 29 SOG, is quite a nice stat, though it was in a loss.   Kane's injury sucks.  I want to see less of Moulson/Gionta and more of the grit and speed.  This season has been so much more enjoyable than last year. 

[Neo]

Grateful for the Eichel stick comments. I'll have to see if I can determine the lie of the stick next time I watch. I considered the reach and backcheck aspects, and the in tight aspects. Special insight award to the extra stride vs. reach comment. I had not considered torque and the relation of the puck to his feet. My mind's eye sees a lower lie and the puck further away, deminishing the torque. Perhaps it's a higher lie, closer puck, and more torque. Second nature to some, something to find for me.

 

3Putt's Delta Chi nickname shall be Zdeno.

[LGR4GM]

The only things I would switch is to put Zemgus and Larsson in the Like and Carlo in the Hate.  

Ryan O'Reilly's haters before this season can eat a giant can of ***** fill in whatever word you'd like.  He's already the heart and soul of this team.  Ristolainen played a heck of a game and for a change I didn't hate Legwand's play.  I liked Deslauriers and McGinn has gotten his act together.  It was much tighter than I thought it would be.  51 to 29 SOG, is quite a nice stat, though it was in a loss.   Kane's injury sucks.  I want to see less of Moulson/Gionta and more of the grit and speed.  This season has been so much more enjoyable than last year. 

There were not and never have been "ROR Haters".  We need to let this myth die.  His impact is more than I hoped for and he is earning that new contract he will be getting next year. I am happy with him.

[Rasmus_]

Jack Eichel you're on notice for being 18...and fans not realizing that you're still over extending in certain aspects of your game.  

There were not and never have been "ROR Haters".  We need to let this myth die.  His impact is more than I hoped for and he is earning that new contract he will be getting next year. I am happy with him.

 

Oh there are O'Reilly haters from other franchises.  On other sites its pretty evident :D

[LGR4GM]

Jack Eichel you're on notice for being 18...and fans not realizing that you're still over extending in certain aspects of your game.  

 

Oh there are O'Reilly haters from other franchises.  On other sites its pretty evident :D

Ah, I was gonna say I thought we had a really great convo in the depth of the tank about ROR's skills and limits. so far he is exceeding what I thought his limits were. Blue was right about him.

 

 

As for Jack, he just turned 19, he's a kid. The good news is he is a kid who loves hockey, hates losing, and is never 2nd best... wait til about February before we (Sabres fans) even begin to judge Jack.

Edited October 30, 2015 by LGR4GM

[North Buffalo]

Eich looked not only frustrated, but slow as a result.  In open ice he is fine, but in close he needs to be more physical.  He does it occasionally, but too often he skates away from a forecheck when there is another teammate involved.  IMO he needs to get in there more and dig.  His powerskating has been written about, but he could either use some stamina drills on quick feet or a coach just needs to light a fire under him to get going.  He has to learn that sometime you just have to grind through it to get your sea legs. Almost like he is thinking to much.  He needs to just skate.  Not surprising for a rookie to have this kind of moment, and ironically it is Reinhardt who seems to be coming into his own, playing more physical.  He looks a lot more confident.  Call me impressed.

[SarasotaSabre]

2 things could (should) happen to improve matters:

 

• Bogo returns healthy, stabilizes D corps
• GMTM deals for a goalie; any available targets ?

[woods-racer]

 

2 things could (should) happen to improve matters:

 

• Bogo returns healthy, stabilizes D corps
• GMTM deals for a goalie; any available targets ?

 

 

GMTM believes Lehner is the answer and will not make a trade or deal for another Johnson-ish goalie the only difference being the name on the back of the sweater. I have no problems with the wait and see approach. It is after all what this whole year is about.

[North Buffalo]

 

2 things could (should) happen to improve matters:

 

• Bogo returns healthy, stabilizes D corps
• GMTM deals for a goalie; any available targets ? 

 

Bogo return should help a lot, but I am leery about any trades involving the young core or including someone like Ennis.  At this point, I think you try out the goalies you have on the farm, unless you can ID a young one in someone else farm that you think might be able to grow with this group.   Save the pics for next year and wait til trade deadline where you can get value for one of the vets.

 

Now Ennis for a goalie prospect and a young gun or D I could go for, but that is not likely until January at the earliest.  So, at this point I am going to enjoy this groups skating and hustle and think lottery...  Guess its time to do some research to update who is doing what for next year's draft.

Edited October 30, 2015 by North Buffalo

[TrueBlueGED]

The only things I would switch is to put Zemgus and Larsson in the Like and Carlo in the Hate.

 

Ryan O'Reilly's haters before this season can eat a giant can of ***** fill in whatever word you'd like. He's already the heart and soul of this team. Ristolainen played a heck of a game and for a change I didn't hate Legwand's play. I liked Deslauriers and McGinn has gotten his act together. It was much tighter than I thought it would be. 51 to 29 SOG, is quite a nice stat, though it was in a loss. Kane's injury sucks. I want to see less of Moulson/Gionta and more of the grit and speed. This season has been so much more enjoyable than last year.

I was thinking this exact thing last night. I don't care what the letters say, O'Reilly is this team's captain, not Gionta.

[PromoTheRobot]

Nothing really matters with this team until we can find goaltending. You just can't overcome soft goals against night in and night out.

What you call soft goals I call defensive lapses. Being a goalie myself, I tend to be more sympathetic. Johnson's largest issue, IMO, is rebound control. But the Sabres D doesn't help much.

[sicknfla]

Crazy? It's not crazy to be annoyed with shot counts that are too high or too low. We know that most games are won by putting 30-40 shots on net. Failing to land in this range is an indicator of places where your system is failing. Too few shots getting to the net is a problem. Too many shots getting to the net is a problem.

I don't buy into that theory. All season we have been talking about puck luck. How it just isn't bouncing our way. My guess, again, is the coaching staff wants the puck put on net. Deflections, rebounds, etc can only come into play if the puck is put on net.

 

How often in the playoffs do you hear the announcer say "just put the puck on the net - good things happen when you put the puck on net" , etc.etc. I have never in my life heard anyone discuss " we have too many shots on goal".

[dudacek]

I am sick of the Nick Des on the top line experiment.  2 games is plenty, it's run its course.  McGinn should be playing up a line instead of Nick.

 

Legwand played a great game tonight.  He's been solid all year, but tonight his excellent hockey IQ shined through almost every shift.  He consistently made the quick easy pass to a player in stride heading up ice.  His passing game was on point, as well as getting many dangerous shots to the net.  Great move by HD to get him on the ice at the end of the game. 

 

Girgensons looked more like himself this game.  I don't think he and Moulson mesh at all, unfortunately.  Gionta was bad bad bad.

 

The O'Reilly line functioned more as a checking line last night against Sid and Geno. Nick has played well, but McGinn might be a better fit long-term.

Each has had his off days, but I really think McGinn Foligno Larsson and Deslauriers is the best group of grinders this team has had in a long time.

 

I really agree on Legwand. Couldn't ask for a better showing in that role. And Schaller looks like he could be a worthy successor there next year.

 

Gionta really has been the place where plays go to die this year. He needs to find his game soon.

 

Moulson and Eichel. Please.

 

I don't know, PA. it looked pretty lazy to me.

 

If not lazy, it was at least selfish. It was a horrible angle (much worse than on his second goal) and he had other guys in way better position to score that he could have given it to.

 

That play was a bummer. I hope he learns from it.

 

This. As soon as he let it go I was all WTF? at the screen. He had a perfect give and go opportunity be dumping it to (I believe) Reinhart in the corner that should have resulted in a glorious chance. Instead we got a textbook shorthanded goal set-up and you can believe he heard about it from his coaches.

 

Jack WILL BE FINE but the past few games he has looked like a frustrated scorer who has been pressing too much and an 18--year-old kid.

Thank god he's now 19. :P

 

GMTM believes Lehner is the answer and will not make a trade or deal for another Johnson-ish goalie the only difference being the name on the back of the sweater. I have no problems with the wait and see approach. It is after all what this whole year is about.

What you call soft goals I call defensive lapses. Being a goalie myself, I tend to be more sympathetic. Johnson's largest issue, IMO, is rebound control. But the Sabres D doesn't help much.

 

Guys, it's been eight games and his save percentage is .881! We are not giving up a ton of chances.

Johnson's flaws become more evident every game.

 

The season will be over long before Lehner is back and in-shape.

The players need to be rewarded for their effort and Chad is not giving them a chance.

 

Give Ullmark another chance and if he doesn't click, make a move.

We have extra third-rounders. Use one.

Edited October 30, 2015 by dudacek

[woods-racer]

 

 

 

 

Guys, it's been eight games and his save percentage is .881! We are not giving up a ton of chances.

Johnson's flaws become more evident every game.

The season will be over long before Lehner is back and in-shape.

The players need to be rewarded for their effort and Chad is not giving them a chance.

We have extra third-rounders. Use one.

 

 

 

What are getting for a third rounder? Another Johnson-ish goalie with a different name on the sweater. If you want to put goalies in the net and hope one looks good, start with the ones in Rochester and see what happens.

Edited October 30, 2015 by Woods-Racer

[dudacek]

 

What are getting for a third rounder? Another Johnson-ish goalie with a different name on the sweater. If you want to put goalies in the net and hope one looks good, start with the ones in Rochester and see what happens.

 

This makes sense if you think Johnson is the same as all the other second-stringers out there. But he's not.

Neuvirth and Enroth went for third rounders. Either is better than Johnson.

.900 is the Mendoza line for goalies. Miller was called mediocre for .914.

Johnson is at .881!

Edited October 30, 2015 by dudacek

[Derrico]

Ah, I was gonna say I thought we had a really great convo in the depth of the tank about ROR's skills and limits. so far he is exceeding what I thought his limits were. Blue was right about him.

 

 

As for Jack, he just turned 19, he's a kid. The good news is he is a kid who loves hockey, hates losing, and is never 2nd best... wait til about February before we (Sabres fans) even begin to judge Jack.

Blue?!  I started that covo with you :P

I wouldn't mind riding Linus for a stretch here.

[darksabre]

I don't buy into that theory. All season we have been talking about puck luck. How it just isn't bouncing our way. My guess, again, is the coaching staff wants the puck put on net. Deflections, rebounds, etc can only come into play if the puck is put on net.

 

How often in the playoffs do you hear the announcer say "just put the puck on the net - good things happen when you put the puck on net" , etc.etc. I have never in my life heard anyone discuss " we have too many shots on goal".

 

You not hearing it doesn't make it not true. There's a lot of evidence for "quality of opportunity" being important. When you take a lot of low quality shots, you're only boosting shot totals, not scoring opportunities; ie: shooting too much. 

 

When you hear someone extol the virtues of "getting the puck to the net" what they're arguing for is an increase in shots because the players are looking too hard for high quality shots, and likely need to mix in some low quality ones that might get a lucky bounce. 

 

A good game will have a mix, and a game that has a good mix typically sees around 30-40 shots on goal. If you're generating more shots than that and not putting them in the back of the net, you might be shooting too much and hoping for a lucky bounce, and you might be impatient. If you're generating far fewer shots but scoring a disproportionate amount, you're probably getting a high level of lucky bounces or quality shots. If you aren't scoring though, you may be too hesitant. 

 

Quality of competition is also important, and likely determines the quality of shots you take. But not always. Sometimes it's your own fault. 

 

But to say that there's no such thing as "too many shots" is to fail to understand the importance of shot quality. And last night, shot quality was a very visible problem. 

[TrueBlueGED]

This makes sense if you think Johnson is the same as all the other second-stringers out there. But he's not.

Neuvirth and Enroth went for third rounders. Either is better than Johnson.

.900 is the Mendoza line for goalies. Miller was called mediocre for .914.

Johnson is at .881!

 

I actually think it's much higher than that in today's NHL, probably around .910. The median goaltender this year with at least 4 starts is at .926. .900 today is good for 31st in the league, and the only goaltenders between Chad Johnson and 31st are Varlamov and Lehtonen. Granted it's really early for this type of analysis, but even last year the median "qualified" goaltender posted a .920 and 30th was .912. 

[Kristian]

Certainly feels odd, to score a lot and have a load of talent, yet we suck in goal.

 

Talk about things being upside down from what's been the standard here, the past 20 years.

[sicknfla]

You not hearing it doesn't make it not true. There's a lot of evidence for "quality of opportunity" being important. When you take a lot of low quality shots, you're only boosting shot totals, not scoring opportunities; ie: shooting too much.

 

When you hear someone extol the virtues of "getting the puck to the net" what they're arguing for is an increase in shots because the players are looking too hard for high quality shots, and likely need to mix in some low quality ones that might get a lucky bounce.

 

A good game will have a mix, and a game that has a good mix typically sees around 30-40 shots on goal. If you're generating more shots than that and not putting them in the back of the net, you might be shooting too much and hoping for a lucky bounce, and you might be impatient. If you're generating far fewer shots but scoring a disproportionate amount, you're probably getting a high level of lucky bounces or quality shots. If you aren't scoring though, you may be too hesitant.

 

Quality of competition is also important, and likely determines the quality of shots you take. But not always. Sometimes it's your own fault.

 

But to say that there's no such thing as "too many shots" is to fail to understand the importance of shot quality. And last night, shot quality was a very visible problem.

After reading your post I have a better understanding where your coming from. I just think with the current group the more shots the better. As we start to gel maybe we can get a little more selective. The truth of the matter is we still are not an overly talented group - especially with Kane and Ennis out.

Certainly feels odd, to score a lot and have a load of talent, yet we suck in goal.

 

Talk about things being upside down from what's been the standard here, the past 20 years.

It isn't just our goalie. Our D is also weak. Both defensively and offensively. And i don't think we could classify ourselves as scoring a lot just yet. The last two games we have 7 goals so that is better. Prior to that we were still under 2 per game i believe.

[woods-racer]

This makes sense if you think Johnson is the same as all the other second-stringers out there. But he's not.

Neuvirth and Enroth went for third rounders. Either is better than Johnson.

.900 is the Mendoza line for goalies. Miller was called mediocre for .914.

Johnson is at .881!

 

I just don't think it matters for the Sabres long term goals. This is not the year to worry about how well the back up goalie is going to do. They are not a playoff team this year and depth at every position is not a necessity.  Your asking them to trade a 3rd so we can finish with a few more wins. Nice, but what does it accomplish?  The Sabres end in 18th place instead of a 21st place  ? Not giving up a third for that when I can have a goalie next summer for nothing or one from Rochester is just fine for me.

 

I didn't eat 5 million hot pockets man, I got time, it's all good.

[darksabre]

After reading your post I have a better understanding where your coming from. I just think with the current group the more shots the better. As we start to gel maybe we can get a little more selective. The truth of the matter is we still are not an overly talented group - especially with Kane and Ennis out.

 

Possibly. I think I want a guy like Eichel making better shot choices though, ya know? 

[LTS]

I get the sense Eichel is playing lazy out there. I feel an "I'm so good I'm not going to try that hard" attitude from him the last few games. Maybe it just seems that way but I watch ROR and I think about what Eichel could do if he tried half as hard. 

 

I wouldn't say lazy.  A few things have happened.  The first is there is a growing video library on him now and players are learning how to defend him.  The second is that I think he's getting tired a bit.  The NHL is a grind like no other and it should be expected that as he gets hit more often he will have less energy.  He'll grow and adapt to that I have no doubt.  But it takes time.  

 

I think at this point we need to Make a move to keep our heads up so early in the season. Ramo is there, his numbers may not be fantastic but at this point a change for sake of change is warranted. Our guys will get discouraged if we put up 40+ and still lose due to 1 or 2 softies a night

 

Making a move might jeopardize the goal of being close but not making the playoffs.  Never happen.

 

I couldn't believe how long his stick was when I first watched him last year. I also wonder what his reasoning is. It certainly helps with poke-checks and defense, but I wonder if it's harder to work with in the o-zone.

 

 

Another advantage is that it creates space between him and the puck.  The defender has to be cautious in not playing one or the other too closely allowing Jack to use his speed to blow by.  The downside isnwhen space tightens or the puck is tighter to your body, it takes more effort and time to move the stick to a position where you can control the puck and shoot.  More exposed stick is easier to defend in tight.  Also a shorter stick should reduce the urge to reach instead of taking the extra stride to get to a puck or man.  JMHO. I am 6 7 and use a short stick.  It forces me to maintain the most athletic posture while skating and shooting. 

 

One of the things that Eichel has in his favor is the speed with which he moves the stick from point A to point B.  He doesn't make a lot of little moves, he makes a few big moves but the speed he does it at is incredible.  The longer stick allows him to increase the distance he can move the puck and thus make it hard to defend.  If he can get an extra 6-9 inches from the left to right side it changes thing dramatically.

 

He is also a very upright skater.  I think a shorter stick will shorten his stride and thus kill his power skating.  He's a north-south skater who will make a few moves to get through.  I don't see him skating wall to wall and circling around the zone for long periods of time. He's skates more like a gazelle than a rabid gerbil.

Edited October 30, 2015 by LTS

[Stoner]

I hope Bylsma and Eichel read this site. They could learn a lot. Great tips.

[sicknfla]

Possibly. I think I want a guy like Eichel making better shot choices though, ya know?

Absolutely. I think he will in due time . A little bit of pressing going on right now. This is the first time in his career he is not dominating and I think it is in his head a little. Also, don't think for a minute he isn't aware what his counterpart in Edmonton is doing. All part of the maturing process.