Patrick Kane: [Updated] D.A. Decides Not to Prosecute; NHL Determines Claims "Unfounded"

[LGR4GM]

Just going to say maybe we should wait to see what the investigation turns up first before we go much further.  We have almost no facts.

[That Aud Smell]

Just going to say maybe we should wait to see what the investigation turns up first before we go much further.  We have almost no facts.

True. There's a strong suggestion that the girl wasn't yet 17. If true, that might be all we really need to know.

[JJFIVEOH]

The point of statutory rape laws is that it is up to the non-minor to make absolutely GD sure that the sex partner is not a minor.  It doesn't matter if she looks 25 or if she's lying about her age.  The onus is on the non-minor -- full stop. 

 

Now, you can believe that the law is wrong -- but there is no doubt about what the law says.

 

Until a law says that we need to present ID's and sign disclaimers before sleeping with somebody, what else is somebody supposed to do when they are approached by somebody dressed as an adult, lying about their age while in an adult establishment?

[darksabre]

Until a law says that we need to present ID's and sign disclaimers before sleeping with somebody, what else is somebody supposed to do when they are approached by somebody dressed as an adult, lying about their age while in an adult establishment?

 

Easy. Weigh the risks of sleeping with someone you don't know and decide if being accused of rape is something you're willing to deal with. 

[LGR4GM]

Until a law says that we need to present ID's and sign disclaimers before sleeping with somebody, what else is somebody supposed to do when they are approached by somebody dressed as an adult, lying about their age while in an adult establishment?

Ask her to do a shot of whiskey then wait and watch... 21yr olds might be able to take it but a 17yr old, highly unlikely. ;)

[That Aud Smell]

Ick.

 

After the Blackhawks won their third Stanley Cup in six seasons in June, Kane made a playful reference to his past behavior when he addressed fans at the championship rally.

"I know you said I've been growing up, but watch out for me the next week," Kane said.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/hockey/blackhawks/ct-patrick-kane-investigation-20150806-story.html

[JJFIVEOH]

I'll say it again. Whether you believe the accuser or not, you have to take the accusation seriously. Crafting hypotheticals that dismiss the seriousness of the accusation is tasteless and pointless. 

 

Nobody's making light of the situation. And if this forum outlawed opinions it probably wouldn't exist.

[WildCard]

Ask her to do a shot of whiskey then wait and watch... 21yr olds might be able to take it but a 17yr old, highly unlikely. ;)

Isn't that what we're debating here?

[LGR4GM]

Isn't that what we're debating here?

Pretty sure we are debating about 25 different hypothetical situations all at once. 

[darksabre]

Nobody's making light of the situation. And if this forum outlawed opinions it probably wouldn't exist.

 

If you don't believe that wookie's language was not taking the allegations seriously then I don't know what to tell you except that you shouldn't make a habit of defending the dumb sh*t other people say. 

[3putt]

Until a law says that we need to present ID's and sign disclaimers before sleeping with somebody, what else is somebody supposed to do when they are approached by somebody dressed as an adult, lying about their age while in an adult establishment?

Get their number and arrange for a dinner date.  If mom meets you at the door and asks why you are taking their HS sophmore daughter out on a date pull the cord and land safely.  Seriously, if in doubt, don't do it.  

[TrueBlueGED]

Until a law says that we need to present ID's and sign disclaimers before sleeping with somebody, what else is somebody supposed to do when they are approached by somebody dressed as an adult, lying about their age while in an adult establishment?

 

You err on the side of caution. 

 

Look, I know some 16/17 year olds can look 18-19-20, but using even a slightly critical eye you can absolutely tell when a girl is young, even if you can't peg the exact age. Probably sooner, but once you start hitting those mid-20s and have a job and real responsibility, it's time to start avoiding those girls. This is especially true if you're in a committed relationship and have a heck of a lot to lose. Adults have a responsibility to think with the right head, and if they choose to think with the other one...well, then that's on them.

[JJFIVEOH]

Easy. Weigh the risks of sleeping with someone you don't know and decide if being accused of rape is something you're willing to deal with. 

 

 

 

No it's not easy if she is posing as an adult.

Get their number and arrange for a dinner date.  If mom meets you at the door and asks why you are taking their HS sophmore daughter out on a date pull the cord and land safely.  Seriously, if in doubt, don't do it.  

 

Standard procedure when courting a woman at an adult establishment.........

[WildCard]

No it's not easy if she is posing as an adult.

And you're hammered. Rob Lowe made this mistake too, though there was two of them.

[That Aud Smell]

Look, I know some 16/17 year olds can look 18-19-20, but using even a slightly critical eye you can absolutely tell when a girl is young, even if you can't peg the exact age. Probably sooner, but once you start hitting those mid-20s and have a job and real responsibility, it's time to start avoiding those girls. This is especially true if you're in a committed relationship and have a heck of a lot to lose. Adults have a responsibility to think with the right head, and if they choose to think with the other one...well, then that's on them.

 

Quite right. It would be a different question is the guy were 21, 22. At 26, you know when you're dealing with a kid. 

[JJFIVEOH]

If you don't believe that wookie's language was not taking the allegations seriously then I don't know what to tell you except that you shouldn't make a habit of defending the dumb sh*t other people say. 

 

Nobody's making a joke out of this. Please make a list of what we're allowed to discuss and what we're not. His opinion is plausible no matter how much you don't want to believe it.

[musichunch]

Maybe a little off topic (but it seems to want to head that way) if the girl is underage and knowingly heads to an adult venue and a grown man has sex with her thinking she is old enough (perhaps she even lied about her age)  at what point are the parents the ones held liable? If she's underage then it's the parents fault she's in that situation. Food for thought. 

 

It's tough to say. Remember these are teenagers, and teenagers do what they want.

 

Let's do a thought experiment. 

 

Let's say she's 17 and she's very attractive (there's a good chance this is the case). That's around the age girls start realizing the power they have over men of all ages. I know from my high school and college days that that's when they start ignoring guys their age and go after college/20-something guys. They start meeting bouncers and bartenders and getting into 21+ places. If you're a regular, who's going to ask questions about your age? She just tells her parents she's sleeping over at her friend's house on the weekends.

 

She might be used to harmless flirting with older guys but can walk away before anything happens or have her friends pull her away. She might think she can handle any guy. 

 

But now let's say somebody like Patrick Kane is there and he's showing interest. She might be excited and thinking about how she'll brag about it to her friends tomorrow. But now he's inviting her back to his place and she doesn't have the courage to say no. Maybe she thinks they'll just make out or something. But then he aggressively has sex with her and she's afraid to speak up for whatever reason.

 

Now I'm drawing a lot of inferences there but I believe the scenario I described is very common. This is arguably what happened to Mark Sanchez although that was more consensual. And legal, oddly. Something to think about. 

 

So is it the parent's fault? 

[darksabre]

No it's not easy if she is posing as an adult.

 

Standard procedure when courting a woman at an adult establishment.........

 

It doesn't matter. Adults get accused of non-statutory rape too. 

 

Don't wanna get accused of rape? Don't have sex with people you don't know when you're drunk. Welcome to the 21st Century everyone. It's called accepting responsibility over your own fate. 

[That Aud Smell]

I will add: In my college years and even into my early 20s, my buddies and I used to joke that the fact that high school girls could be so attractive was proof that there is no God. Ha! So funny.  :ph34r:

 

20 years later, I see those same girls and all I get are paternal impulses.

[3putt]

No it's not easy if she is posing as an adult.

 

Standard procedure when courting a woman at an adult establishment.........

Interesting choice of words.  If courting, time is not of the essence.  

[JJFIVEOH]

Ask her to do a shot of whiskey then wait and watch... 21yr olds might be able to take it but a 17yr old, highly unlikely. ;)

 

Why are you dragging him into the discussion? :flirt:

[That Aud Smell]

Let's say she's 17  

 

17 is the legal age of consent when the other person involves is over 21.

 

(Maybe I missed your point.)

Edited August 6, 2015 by That Aud Smell

[JJFIVEOH]

It's tough to say. Remember these are teenagers, and teenagers do what they want.

 

Let's do a thought experiment. 

 

Let's say she's 17 and she's very attractive (there's a good chance this is the case). That's around the age girls start realizing the power they have over men of all ages. I know from my high school and college days that that's when they start ignoring guys their age and go after college/20-something guys. They start meeting bouncers and bartenders and getting into 21+ places. If you're a regular, who's going to ask questions about your age? She just tells her parents she's sleeping over at her friend's house on the weekends.

 

She might be used to harmless flirting with older guys but can walk away before anything happens or have her friends pull her away. She might think she can handle any guy. 

 

But now let's say somebody like Patrick Kane is there and he's showing interest. She might be excited and thinking about how she'll brag about it to her friends tomorrow. But now he's inviting her back to his place and she doesn't have the courage to say no. Maybe she thinks they'll just make out or something. But then he aggressively has sex with her and she's afraid to speak up for whatever reason.

 

Now I'm drawing a lot of inferences there but I believe the scenario I described is very common. This is arguably what happened to Mark Sanchez although that was more consensual. And legal, oddly. Something to think about. 

 

So is it the parent's fault? 

 

Because she's at a bar hitting on a 26 year old.

Interesting choice of words.  If courting, time is not of the essence.  

 

I caught myself typing that and thinking holy crap I'm not that old. :lol:

[3putt]

Because she's at a bar hitting on a 26 year old.

what if she was the busgirl?  She'd be there legally correct.  

[LGR4GM]

Because she's at a bar hitting on a 26 year old.

Hey I live in a place where I occasionally get hit on by girls under 21 at bars.  I use my adult brain, instead of my penis, and don't take them home or buy them drinks or give them my number.  17yr old girls are clumsy compared to a full grown woman when it comes to how they talk to guys, how they drink, and how they act. 

Edited August 6, 2015 by LGR4GM