Ryan O'Reilly and Jamie McGinn traded to Sabres

[Hoss]

Looking at Ryan O'Reilly it's really interesting that the perception of him is so poor. So many FANS question his character (I haven't seen any professionals coming at him like fans do)... Yet he won the Lady Byng trophy a year ago after the contract squabbles already started. I know that's more of an on-ice sportsmanship thing, but it's not an award you give to a player with character issues.

 

[WildCard]

And ownership wise?  The Sabres turned their back on three captains -- Peca, Drury, and Briere -- during Regier's tenure because ownership didn't want to pay them.  (Along with a bunch of other guys they didn't want to pay.)  One ownership group ended up in jail, leaving the team in bankruptcy and owned by the league with its future in doubt.  Even before that, do people remember the pre-salary cap NHL?  The Sabres couldn't afford to sign their own RFAs, let alone find help via UFA.  

 

We're pretty spoiled now.  The NHL is a fairly level playing field and we have an owner who doesn't care about spending money at all.  

 

Thinking back to what Ruff and Regier did in their first 10 seasons with the deck completely stacked against them is mind-boggling here in 2015.

So, what? We say Connolly deserves to be in there because concussions limited him? Or do we deserve a Cup because the ref's screwed us? Too many ifs and maybes to say what they would have or could have done. I don't disagree that ownership limited Regier, but that doesn't mean he gets a Hall of Fame nod. 

 

I agree we're spoiled now, and I love every second of it. 

[darksabre]

Looking at Ryan O'Reilly it's really interesting that the perception of him is so poor. So many FANS question his character (I haven't seen any professionals coming at him like fans do)... Yet he won the Lady Byng trophy a year ago after the contract squabbles already started. I know that's more of an on-ice sportsmanship thing, but it's not an award you give to a player with character issues.

 

I think the problem is that all we know about him is that the Avs have been trying to get rid of him for what feels like forever. That sends up a lot of red flags. And if he's a good hockey player then they must not have a problem with that, so it's off ice issues then. That's the logical conclusion.

[beerme1]

I think the problem is that all we know about him is that the Avs have been trying to get rid of him for what feels like forever. That sends up a lot of red flags. And if he's a good hockey player then they must not have a problem with that, so it's off ice issues then. That's the logical conclusion.

 

 

I think it's nothing more than the $$$$

[TrueBlueGED]

Looking at Ryan O'Reilly it's really interesting that the perception of him is so poor. So many FANS question his character (I haven't seen any professionals coming at him like fans do)... Yet he won the Lady Byng trophy a year ago after the contract squabbles already started. I know that's more of an on-ice sportsmanship thing, but it's not an award you give to a player with character issues.

 

 

I think it's pretty simple: a good number of fans resent when athletes quibble with teams over money. Think about how Byrd was vilified here for wanting to be paid commensurate with his performance.

 

This is a picture of O'Reilly after the game 7 loss to the Wild. Notice other players have already hung up their pads and bounced, while he's sitting there staring at the floor in full equipment. Anyone who thinks he's all about the money couldn't be more wrong. Reading some stuff from Avs fans, I don't know how anyone could help but love this guy. Stories about staying after games to work out, using a tire to practice his saucer passes, just pure blood and guts to go with the skill. Give him the 8 year contract and never look back.

[K-9]

I think the problem is that all we know about him is that the Avs have been trying to get rid of him for what feels like forever. That sends up a lot of red flags. And if he's a good hockey player then they must not have a problem with that, so it's off ice issues then. That's the logical conclusion.

I prefer to think of it in terms of the Avs have been trying to get him to play for less than he thinks he's worth forever. 

 

There are no off ice issues. 

 

He's outperformed his contract, the Avs operate under the constraints of a set budget, and there the twain shall meet. Or part ways. Or something. 

 

I think his character, especially his hockey character, is beyond reproach. 

 

GO SABRES!!!

[darksabre]

I prefer to think of it in terms of the Avs have been trying to get him to play for less than he thinks he's worth forever.

 

There are no off ice issues.

 

He's outperformed his contract, the Avs operate under the constraints of a set budget, and there the twain shall meet. Or part ways. Or something.

 

I think his character, especially his hockey character, is beyond reproach.

 

GO SABRES!!!

Right. I'm sure he's fine. It's just a perception issue.

[Robviously]

So, what? We say Connolly deserves to be in there because concussions limited him? Or do we deserve a Cup because the ref's screwed us? Too many ifs and maybes to say what they would have or could have done. I don't disagree that ownership limited Regier, but that doesn't mean he gets a Hall of Fame nod. 

 

I agree we're spoiled now, and I love every second of it. 

So Ruff and Regier don't deserve any recognition for taking the team on the best 10-year run in its history -- a run where we did literally everything but win a Stanley Cup?  Because, why?  You hated the last four years of their time here?

 

The Connolly comparison makes no sense.  I'm praising Ruff and Regier for taking the team on the most successful decade in its history with the deck stacked against them in every way (no "maybes" or "ifs" about that).  You're talking about it like they accomplished nothing.

[WildCard]

So Ruff and Regier don't deserve any recognition for taking the team on the best 10-year run in its history -- a run where we did literally everything but win a Stanley Cup?  Because, why?  You hated the last four years of their time here?

 

The Connolly comparison makes no sense.  I'm praising Ruff and Regier for taking the team on the most successful decade in its history with the deck stacked against them in every way (no "maybes" or "ifs" about that).  You're talking about it like they accomplished nothing.

Yeah they deserve recognition, I just don't think they deserve to be in a Hall of Fame. Both teams do this: retire jerseys and put people in the Hall that would never make it elsewhere just so we can say "Hey, well, it's good in Buffalo's world!"

 

I don't understand why you keep bringing up the last 4 years here. I get that they were their worst. I'm not solely judging them on it, but it can't be ignored. 16 years doing anything and not winning a Cup isn't something to put on a pedestal. You think the Habs, Yankees, SF or NY Giants would put these guys in their Hall? No way

 

The Connolly comparison makes sense IMO because you want to claim R&R would have been much better if they weren't limited, and so could have Tim Connolly. 

[Robviously]

Yeah they deserve recognition, I just don't think they deserve to be in a Hall of Fame. Both teams do this: retire jerseys and put people in the Hall that would never make it elsewhere just so we can say "Hey, well, it's good in Buffalo's world!"

 

I don't understand why you keep bringing up the last 4 years here. I get that they were their worst. I'm not solely judging them on it, but it can't be ignored. 16 years doing anything and not winning a Cup isn't something to put on a pedestal. You think the Habs, Yankees, SF or NY Giants would put these guys in their Hall? No way

 

The Connolly comparison makes sense IMO because you want to claim R&R would have been much better if they weren't limited, and so could have Tim Connolly. 

I'm not claiming they would have been better at all.  I'm saying they were insanely good as is while under fairly terrible circumstances.

 

And you have to be good to last 16 years anywhere in pro sports.  That didn't happen by accident either.

 

We're going in circles and I doubt we're going to convince one another so I can leave it there.  (We're in the Ryan O'Reilly thread.)  Have a good rest of your Sunday, my friend.

[WildCard]

I'm not claiming they would have been better at all.  I'm saying they were insanely good as is while under fairly terrible circumstances.

 

And you have to be good to last 16 years anywhere in pro sports.  That didn't happen by accident either.

 

We're going in circles and I doubt we're going to convince one another so I can leave it there.  (We're in the Ryan O'Reilly thread.)  Have a good rest of your Sunday, my friend.

Agreed, though I would like to hear other's thoughts, albeit in a more appropriate thread. 

 

And you as well  :beer:

[beerme1]

Tangent off.

[LGR4GM]

I think it's pretty simple: a good number of fans resent when athletes quibble with teams over money. Think about how Byrd was vilified here for wanting to be paid commensurate with his performance.

 

This is a picture of O'Reilly after the game 7 loss to the Wild. Notice other players have already hung up their pads and bounced, while he's sitting there staring at the floor in full equipment. Anyone who thinks he's all about the money couldn't be more wrong. Reading some stuff from Avs fans, I don't know how anyone could help but love this guy. Stories about staying after games to work out, using a tire to practice his saucer passes, just pure blood and guts to go with the skill. Give him the 8 year contract and never look back.

I have never questioned ROR dedication or skill.  I was questioning how much it would cost to get and retain him.  As far as only being about money, I think ROR believes he is X and should be payed that way. Not sure I agree but at this point that is irrelevant.  I am looking forward to ROR as a Buffalo Sabre and hope he brings some good leadership to what appears to be a very strong locker room going forward.  There are a lot of lead by example guys who hate to lose.  Kind of the opposite of soft fragile DR types of players that had what one poster called "vanek face".  

As the person who questioned ROR the most on this board I just wanted to clarify how I feel.  Contrary to popular belief I am fine with his acquisition.  ROR is a good player.  

[Kelly the Dog]

Really good Q&A on the trade with an Avs beat writer.

 

http://buffalowins.net/uncategorized/1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey

[Peter]

I wrote in another thread that I thought that the Sabres had a lot more leverage to get better deals in the ROR and Lehner trades.

 

Now that we have made the ROR trade (and have given up a lot for two guys who have one year left on their deals and one of those guys has serious back issues), we have very little leverage in negotiating the ROR extension. In fact, probably no leverage whatsoever. We essentially paid a premium to the Avs to take on their risk in getting a deal done.

 

I really hope (given the above) that ROR wants to extend and stay in Buffalo, the Sabres and ROR agree to a fair value, and ROR plays up to his contract.

[Kelly the Dog]

I wrote in another thread that I thought that the Sabres had a lot more leverage to get better deals in the ROR and Lehner trades.

 

Now that we have made the ROR trade (and have given up a lot for two guys who have one year left on their deals and one of those guys has serious back issues), we have very little leverage in negotiating the ROR extension. In fact, probably no leverage whatsoever. We essentially paid a premium to the Avs to take on their risk in getting a deal done.

 

I really hope (given the above) that ROR wants to extend and stay in Buffalo, the Sabres and ROR agree to a fair value, and ROR plays up to his contract.

They had already agreed on the framework from what I heard, and they knew what he had asked the Avs for. There is virtually no chance they made the trade without knowledge from both sides this would get done.

[LGR4GM]

Really good Q&A on the trade with an Avs beat writer.

 

http://buffalowins.net/uncategorized/1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey

That article makes me feel all warm and fuzzy about ROR

They had already agreed on the framework from what I heard, and they knew what he had asked the Avs for. There is virtually no chance they made the trade without knowledge from both sides this would get done.

Correct. ROR will be getting around 7.5million for 7-8years with probably a Limited NTC

 

My personal hope is that he signs for 7 years at 7.25mil but I doubt we are that lucky.

[Taro T]

Really good Q&A on the trade with an Avs beat writer.

http://buffalowins.net/uncategorized/1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey

Fatty McGinn. Niiiiice. :lol:

[LGR4GM]

Fatty McGinn. Niiiiice. :lol:

Someone needs to make a avatar of McGinn stuffing his face with wings.  Also I think McGinn and Nick Desluariers are going to be best buds.  

[Peter]

They had already agreed on the framework from what I heard, and they knew what he had asked the Avs for. There is virtually no chance they made the trade without knowledge from both sides this would get done.

I really hope you are correct. I would have preferred having NO risk and a deal before making the trade - especially given ROR's contract history with the Avs. Without a prior deal, the Sabres have put themselves at risk. There is nothing to stop ROR or his agent from demanding more at the last minute (just like our recent trade partners appear to have done).

 

Again, I hope you are correct and that ROR plays up to his contract.

Edited June 29, 2015 by Peter

[Eleven]

Really good Q&A on the trade with an Avs beat writer.

 

http://buffalowins.net/uncategorized/1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=1200-words-on-the-ryan-oreilly-and-jamie-mcginn-deal-with-avs-writer-milehighhockey

 

 

If his purpose is to shut down the other team's #1 center, as the Colorado blogger indicates, umm...

 

I don't think the Colorado blogger has it right, though.  Ryno creates opportunities.  He's a 1 or 2.  Girgensons, a natural 3, is the guy who's going to shut down the other team's 1.

[Brawndo]

I'm surprised that during Bylsma's Interview with Kathryn Tappen right after Eichel was announced that he did not thank Mike Babcock,for turning down the Sabres HC Position.

[K-9]

I have never questioned ROR dedication or skill.  I was questioning how much it would cost to get and retain him.  As far as only being about money, I think ROR believes he is X and should be payed that way. Not sure I agree but at this point that is irrelevant.  I am looking forward to ROR as a Buffalo Sabre and hope he brings some good leadership to what appears to be a very strong locker room going forward.  There are a lot of lead by example guys who hate to lose.  Kind of the opposite of soft fragile DR types of players that had what one poster called "vanek face".  

As the person who questioned ROR the most on this board I just wanted to clarify how I feel.  Contrary to popular belief I am fine with his acquisition.  ROR is a good player.  

So, ROR will be fine, then?

 

GO SABRES!!!

If his purpose is to shut down the other team's #1 center, as the Colorado blogger indicates, umm...

 

I don't think the Colorado blogger has it right, though.  Ryno creates opportunities.  He's a 1 or 2.  Girgensons, a natural 3, is the guy who's going to shut down the other team's 1.

The fact that he can shut down a #1 can make for some interesting line matching possibilities. 

 

GO SABRES!!!

[thewookie1]

I think it's pretty simple: a good number of fans resent when athletes quibble with teams over money. Think about how Byrd was vilified here for wanting to be paid commensurate with his performance.

 

This is a picture of O'Reilly after the game 7 loss to the Wild. Notice other players have already hung up their pads and bounced, while he's sitting there staring at the floor in full equipment. Anyone who thinks he's all about the money couldn't be more wrong. Reading some stuff from Avs fans, I don't know how anyone could help but love this guy. Stories about staying after games to work out, using a tire to practice his saucer passes, just pure blood and guts to go with the skill. Give him the 8 year contract and never look back.

 

 

I agree 100%, give the guy his 8 yr 7.5 mil per and he'll anchor the 1st line until Eichel is ready, then he'll move to the wing probably as Reinhart slides into the 2nd line Center role.

 

That image reminds me of the Lundquist one from the Finals last year. Those are the types of players who win you Cups, the one who no matter what the score or series is at, will play their off until the final buzzer. I think in a way what Murry meant by replicating LA's style wasn't exactly the obvious puck possession strategy visible play you can see on TV. In a way I think he meant more along the lines of LA's never say die attitude. The team that no matter the series score, will always be a threat to win even when down 3-0 and/or rather 1st in the league or 16th with the final wild card we'll be feared by all teams who may meet us in the playoffs. 

 

I can think of at very least 4 players already on this team with that personality trait.

 

O'Reilly, Girgensons, Kane, and Ristolainen. Gionta & Gorges probably. Eichel is very likely to be like this as well. Ristolainen going up to GMTM and wanting to win/questioning the tank must of really impressed GMTM because he never forgets to mention him in interviews when asked about defense. That was our biggest problem since 2007, we had the skill and the talent but the sheer unwillingness to lose wasn't there; Miller had it, but he couldn't score but he certainly did his damnedest in the playoffs. Once these guys mesh, and with the other high character players inside the locker room, they should truly be a tough team to play regardless if its game 1 or game 100.

[bunomatic]

I'm surprised that during Bylsma's Interview with Kathryn Tappen right after Eichel was announced that he did not thank Mike Babcock,for turning down the Sabres HC Position.

I wonder if Babcock was lamenting a poor decision friday at the draft and looking at what GMTM has accomplished so far ? Nah. I doubt it. But maybe just a bit ?