Around the NHL: 2015-2016

[biodork]

I'm sure even Andrew Peters won a fight at some point  :P

:P

[inkman]

I'm sure even Andrew Peters won a fight at some point :P

I'm not

[WildCard]

You keep using the phrase "actual talent", as if fighting isn't a talent that has a defined role in the NHL. You want to draw a line that doesn't exist. John Scott has "actual talent", and the NHL facilitates its use.

 

Now, if the NHL suddenly decided it wanted to ban fighting and only have players in the league who can play hockey, that would make sense. But it doesn't want to ban fighting. It likes guys with John Scott's skill set.

 

You can't have an NHL All-Star game and then ban NHL players from it. The NHL has never been about purity of ice hockey. Why should the All-Star game be any different?

Because the ASG is different. Is there hitting in the ASG? Is there anything remotely resembling a truly NHL product in the ASG? No. A Skills Competition and a 3-3 OT are not designed to highlight the NHL product, just the best parts of it. It's a 2 night event that takes all of the actual hockey skill and puts it in full display without the limitations of grabbing and hitting and board play and fights. I'm sure you've watched all the videos of what these guys can do on open ice when they're just dicking around, well that's what the ASG is for. 

 

Scott should get the same amount of 3-3 minutes as he gets in the regular season, zero.

Edited January 20, 2016 by WildCard

[darksabre]

Because the ASG is different. Is there hitting in the ASG? Is there anything remotely resembling a truly NHL product in the ASG? No. A Skills Competition and a 3-3 OT are not designed to highlight the NHL product, just the best parts of it. It's a 2 night event that takes all of the actual hockey skill and puts it in full display without the limitations of grabbing and hitting and board play and fights. I'm sure you've watched all the videos of what these guys can do on open ice when they're just dicking around, well that's what the ASG is for.

"Best parts of it" is a strange phrase. If the best parts of the game are on display at the ASG then why does no one watch it?

[WildCard]

"Best parts of it" is a strange phrase. If the best parts of the game are on display at the ASG then why does no one watch it?

I watch it, I like it. I don't know why other people don't watch it. I get 82+ games a year of hitting/checking with a normal roster and normal guys like Des and Scott. I like having 1 game where my fantasy roster can get together and show everyone the insane stuff they can do, like Kane juggling through pucks or Subban skating circles around a forward. It's fun

[qwksndmonster]

Best parts of it? Oh please. It's a pond hockey game.  Actually, they try less than most pond hockey players.

[WildCard]

Best parts of it? Oh please. It's a pond hockey game.  Actually, they try less than most pond hockey players.

Hence the 3-3 OT with a prize, which I was previously looking forward to. The MLB got it right with their ASG, and now it's a huge event that everyone loves watching. Not saying the NHL should do the same, but there are ways to give meaning to an ASG.

[LTS]

:lol:

 

I do expect ratings to be significantly higher this year because people want to support Scott in this matter. The league will be VERY confused next year when the ratings are even worse than normal - a 4 team 3v3 tourney that ISN'T on a pond? Who wants to watch that if there ISN'T a sideshow attached?

 

I can just picture a disheveled Bill Daly turning to Gary Bettman after reviewing the ratings for next year's game stating "with God as my witness, I thought turkeys would watch this :censored: ."

 

Gotta disagree here.  I'd be amazed if the vast Internet wastoids actually expend effort to tune into a game. The amount of energy it took to vote for John Scott is far less than it take to actually watch the game.  I'm not going to go out and find supporting evidence right now but I'm going to bet we can all agree that People + Internet = Stupid.

 

Simple facts in this.  The NHL decided to allow fan voting and over the past few years has seen evidence where something like this would happen. They chose NOT to do anything about it. Why?  Well, it sure gets everyone talking, even those who don't follow hockey.

 

The only people who care if John Scott plays in the ASG are fans who are not going to stop watching the NHL.  The vast majority of people won't care and won't remember this by the start of March.  However, they'll have been exposed to the NHL brand in some way and it might add a viewer or two.

 

As far as what John Scott should have done... it's his decision.  Are there any statements made by teammates or other players saying he should decline the honor?  

 

Fans voted. He's giving the fans what they "wanted".  

 

But at least we have something to talk about.

[shrader]

Hence the 3-3 OT with a prize, which I was previously looking forward to. The MLB got it right with their ASG, and now it's a huge event that everyone loves watching. Not saying the NHL should do the same, but there are ways to give meaning to an ASG.

 

Everyone loves watching the MLB all star game?  Check out the numbers here.  You'll see a very clear downward trend in every single column (well, except year, but I would hope there'd be an upward trend there :lol: ).

 

All star games are a novelty that people used to watch because it was their one opportunity to see many players that they wouldn't otherwise see all year.  That novelty is gone.

[Weave]

The All Star game isn't about representing hockey and all of its skills.  It isn't about representing "the best" of the game either.  Hell, it isn't even about representing the top players on each team.  It is about one thing, and one thing only, showcasing the players they can most effectively market.  

 

The fan vote backfired on them because they assumed the fans would vote for the players that are marketed the most heavily.  The ballots were supposed to justify their marketing.

[darksabre]

I watch it, I like it. I don't know why other people don't watch it. I get 82+ games a year of hitting/checking with a normal roster and normal guys like Des and Scott. I like having 1 game where my fantasy roster can get together and show everyone the insane stuff they can do, like Kane juggling through pucks or Subban skating circles around a forward. It's fun

Fun? Fun like "Hey, here's what these guys can do when we aren't actively suppressing them"?

[WildCard]

Everyone loves watching the MLB all star game?  Check out the numbers here.  You'll see a very clear downward trend in every single column (well, except year, but I would hope there'd be an upward trend there :lol: ).

 

All star games are a novelty that people used to watch because it was their one opportunity to see many players that they wouldn't otherwise see all year.  That novelty is gone.

Well, that's actually pretty funny, because that's twice the amount of viewers who watched the wild card games, and only 2 million less than the average viewer amount for the 7 game, KC - SF WS. So I'd say yes, the MLB ASG is hugely popular

Fun? Fun like "Hey, here's what these guys can do when we aren't actively suppressing them"?

I don't catch your drift

Edited January 20, 2016 by WildCard

[darksabre]

Well, that's actually pretty funny, because that's twice the amount of viewers who watched the wild card games, and only 2 million less than the average viewer amount for the 7 game, KC - SF WS. So I'd say yes, the MLB ASG is hugely popular

 

I don't catch your drift

The ASG is a direct juxtaposition of the NHL game. A supposed celebration of hockey talent produced by a league that allows its most talented players to be held back by egregious interference, reckless injury and a game that seeks to ever reduce scoring.

[WildCard]

The ASG is a direct juxtaposition of the NHL game. A supposed celebration of hockey talent produced by a league that allows its most talented players to be held back by egregious interference, reckless injury and a game that seeks to ever reduce scoring.

I can't argue with that, especially when I and many others on here have advocated the elimination of such interference

[shrader]

The All Star game isn't about representing hockey and all of its skills.  It isn't about representing "the best" of the game either.  Hell, it isn't even about representing the top players on each team.  It is about one thing, and one thing only, showcasing the players they can most effectively market.  

 

The fan vote backfired on them because they assumed the fans would vote for the players that are marketed the most heavily.  The ballots were supposed to justify their marketing.

 

It's not even about that since the roster rules don't allow for them getting the most marketable guys out there.  The sole purpose of the game is to give the majority of the league a break while still lining the owners pockets with a so called showcase event.

 

Well, that's actually pretty funny, because that's twice the amount of viewers who watched the wild card games, and only 2 million less than the average viewer amount for the 7 game, KC - SF WS. So I'd say yes, the MLB ASG is hugely popular

 

Aren't a bunch of the wild card games on during the day time and also at the same time as another game is being played?  Your comparison is apples to oranges.  The all star game is prime time and there is zero competition from the rest of MLB on that day.  I'm also not so sure how to look at average numbers over the world series given that there is bound to be a lull for games 2-4 depending on the results and also that they're played on different nights with differing competition each night.

 

I'm a little confused by your definition of "hugely popular".  What your numbers likely say is that of the people watching the world series, a good number of them also watch the all star game.  So it may be popular among baseball viewers, but it's not popular in a broader sense.  They can't even win the night during a slow summer schedule and their numbers are headed south each year.

[WanderingEye]

I don't mind the skills competition, it's the actual game which is a complete and utter bore to me. Disinterested players going through the motions as Doc Emrick spouts off one cliche after another. Their attempt to change the format is enough to convince me to give it another chance at least.

 

No, Domi should not have gone. There are several better forwards that in a meritorious system would have gone before Domi. AND, considering this is the NHL Doan probably would have been the replacement in this particular case. (Though I would have replaced Scott w/ Domi or Duclair had he been banned from the game.)

And the league could've & should've put OEL in ahead of Burns or Giordano - oddly, all 3 D have another teammate in the game as well. Then, had they decided later they wanted to shaft Scott, thec2nd highest vote getter could've been named captain. They couldn't even get their intended hosing of him right to even that degree. Boneheads.

I'll give you Giordano but if you're talking guys who "deserve" to be there, Brent Burns definitely does regardless of there being another Sharks player in the game. 18 goals and 41 points, second in d-man scoring only to Karlsson.

[Doohicksie]

The All Star game isn't about representing hockey and all of its skills. It isn't about representing "the best" of the game either. Hell, it isn't even about representing the top players on each team. It is about one thing, and one thing only, showcasing the players they can most effectively market.

It's about putting Honda's sponsorship of the NHL on display by giving an unneeded car to the MVP.

[WildCard]

Aren't a bunch of the wild card games on during the day time and also at the same time as another game is being played?  Your comparison is apples to oranges.  The all star game is prime time and there is zero competition from the rest of MLB on that day.  I'm also not so sure how to look at average numbers over the world series given that there is bound to be a lull for games 2-4 depending on the results and also that they're played on different nights with differing competition each night.

 

I'm a little confused by your definition of "hugely popular".  What your numbers likely say is that of the people watching the world series, a good number of them also watch the all star game.  So it may be popular among baseball viewers, but it's not popular in a broader sense.  They can't even win the night during a slow summer schedule and their numbers are headed south each year.

There are also plenty of MLB playoff games that occur during the night or on Sunday afternoons when literally no other sport is on. The comparison is valid, there are plenty of prime-time games, the MLB does not exclusively set it's playoff games to day games. 

 

Hugely popular would be limited to those within the baseball world, of course. I'm not arguing the expansion and popularity of the MLB brand or baseball as a sport outside of it's currently existing sphere, merely that those who care about the sport will watch it.

 

For comparison, the 2015 NHL ASG drew 1.2 million viewers, nearly 10 million less than MLB's. The Stanely Cup clinching game drew 7.6 million, whereas baseball's WS drew 13 million. So the gap in viewers is 2 million for MLB, and over 6 million for hockey. The MLB ASG is popular among it's viewers

http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/01/nhl-all-star-game-ratings-fewer-viewers-trails-2012-2011-nbcsn/

http://variety.com/2015/tv/news/stanley-cup-final-ratings-bachelorette-ratings-1201520669/

Edited January 20, 2016 by WildCard

[shrader]

It's about putting Honda's sponsorship of the NHL on display by giving an unneeded car to the MVP.

 

Scott might actually need one if he's on a two-way contract. :lol:

[MattPie]

There are also plenty of MLB playoff games that occur during the night or on Sunday afternoons when literally no other sport is on. The comparison is valid, there are plenty of prime-time games, the MLB does not exclusively set it's playoff games to day games. 

 

Hugely popular would be limited to those within the baseball world, of course. I'm not arguing the expansion and popularity of the MLB brand or baseball as a sport outside of it's currently existing sphere, merely that those who care about the sport will watch it.

 

For comparison, the 2015 NHL ASG drew 1.2 million viewers, nearly 10 million less than MLB's. The Stanely Cup clinching game drew 7.6 million, whereas baseball's WS drew 13 million. So the gap in viewers is 2 million for MLB, and over 6 million for hockey. The MLB ASG is popular among it's viewers

http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2015/01/nhl-all-star-game-ratings-fewer-viewers-trails-2012-2011-nbcsn/

http://variety.com/2015/tv/news/stanley-cup-final-ratings-bachelorette-ratings-1201520669/

 

I'm convinced, good work. I'd guess that the baseball ASG A: looks like regular baseball as team chesistry isn't as important to playing normal-looking baseball and B: that weird home-field advantage thing for the WS is riding on it.

Edited January 20, 2016 by MattPie

[JJFIVEOH]

Let the coaches and GM's pick the rosters and go back to the old way. It used to be an honor to be named to the ASG. If one team has 8 players, so be it. If a team has zero players, they should improve next year so the can have an AS representing their teams. 

Edited January 20, 2016 by JJFIVEOH

[pi2000]

Let the coaches and GM's pick the rosters and go back to the old way. It used to be an honor to be named to the ASG. If one team has 8 players, so be it. If a team has zero players, they should improve next year so the can have an AS representing their teams. 

 

[TrueBlueGED]

Let the coaches and GM's pick the rosters and go back to the old way. It used to be an honor to be named to the ASG. If one team has 8 players, so be it. If a team has zero players, they should improve next year so the can have an AS representing their teams.

Even then you're still going to get a bunch of "name" guys getting in on reputation rather than current play.

[Taro T]

Gotta disagree here.  I'd be amazed if the vast Internet wastoids actually expend effort to tune into a game. The amount of energy it took to vote for John Scott is far less than it take to actually watch the game.  I'm not going to go out and find supporting evidence right now but I'm going to bet we can all agree that People + Internet = Stupid.

 

Simple facts in this.  The NHL decided to allow fan voting and over the past few years has seen evidence where something like this would happen. They chose NOT to do anything about it. Why?  Well, it sure gets everyone talking, even those who don't follow hockey.

 

The only people who care if John Scott plays in the ASG are fans who are not going to stop watching the NHL.  The vast majority of people won't care and won't remember this by the start of March.  However, they'll have been exposed to the NHL brand in some way and it might add a viewer or two.

 

As far as what John Scott should have done... it's his decision.  Are there any statements made by teammates or other players saying he should decline the honor?  

 

Fans voted. He's giving the fans what they "wanted".  

 

But at least we have something to talk about.

How many people here typically watch the ASG & how many were planning on watching this one? WC is on record as saying he'd watch it, not many others were planning on it. WE are that hard core NHL following & we (in vast majority) don't give a rat's bippy about the ASG.

 

Though the novelty of the 3v3 might have spurred a slight increase in ratings, the games will likely be just as bad as the 5v5 ASG's. So after the hard core fans that believe Scott was getting jobbed have seen that this format is just as lame as before, they won't bother tuning in next year anymore than they did last time, or for the one before that, or the on before that, ad infinitum. (Or at least back to the '90's.)

 

The ASG is not professional hockey - there is even less contact than in beer league. Most hardcore fans don't watch because the game isn't pro hockey. Many here weren't even going to check a few minutes of the game due to the shabby treatment of Scott. That would have left the hardcore fans that would give this gimmick a chance, their 1st chance to see the gimmick in action next year. 1 viewing should be enough to let them see whether it's as dumb as many expect it to be.

 

Past ASG ratings indicate that casual fans aren't attracted to the game enough to overcome the disdain hardcore fans feel towards it. I'd expect the Scott controversy will draw some more casual fans in but probably not enough to overcome the quantity of fans that were going to boycott the game.

[MattPie]

How many people here typically watch the ASG & how many were planning on watching this one? WC is on record as saying he'd watch it, not many others were planning on it. WE are that hard core NHL following & we (in vast majority) don't give a rat's bippy about the ASG.

 

Though the novelty of the 3v3 might have spurred a slight increase in ratings, the games will likely be just as bad as the 5v5 ASG's. So after the hard core fans that believe Scott was getting jobbed have seen that this format is just as lame as before, they won't bother tuning in next year anymore than they did last time, or for the one before that, or the on before that, ad infinitum. (Or at least back to the '90's.)

 

The ASG is not professional hockey - there is even less contact than in beer league. Most hardcore fans don't watch because the game isn't pro hockey. Many here weren't even going to check a few minutes of the game due to the shabby treatment of Scott. That would have left the hardcore fans that would give this gimmick a chance, their 1st chance to see the gimmick in action next year. 1 viewing should be enough to let them see whether it's as dumb as many expect it to be.

 

Past ASG ratings indicate that casual fans aren't attracted to the game enough to overcome the disdain hardcore fans feel towards it. I'd expect the Scott controversy will draw some more casual fans in but probably not enough to overcome the quantity of fans that were going to boycott the game.

 

I'd watch it if I had cable and was around in the past. I enjoy the skills more than the game though.