MattPie Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I'm working on it, damn, patience. Just do it. It's not as black and white as that, but I like where you're going. Agreed, working in terms cap% is the only way to look at this.
LGR4GM Posted May 19, 2015 Author Report Posted May 19, 2015 I am doing it. If ROR is worth 8mil against a 71million dollar cap what if we adjusted other players numbers for the inflation, where would he fall on the NHL salary list then. I actually don't care if this proves or disproves my point. As for a percentage of the cap itself. That is another perfectly logical way to look at this. Would someone like to crunch those numbers for say the top 20-25 players? 8mil is 11.27% of the Salary Cap
deluca67 Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Agreed. Silfverberg was a much more polished product than Grigs is now. A name I don't see thrown around a lot in trade proposals is Johan Larsson. His value is at an all time high right now, and would be a logical piece to put in an O'Reilly deal. On Hockey Hotline they made an interesting point on Larsson, does Mike Babcock's success with European players in Detroit make the Sabres more inclined to keep a player like Larsson?
Samson's Flow Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I am doing it. If ROR is worth 8mil against a 71million dollar cap what if we adjusted other players numbers for the inflation, where would he fall on the NHL salary list then. I actually don't care if this proves or disproves my point. As for a percentage of the cap itself. That is another perfectly logical way to look at this. Would someone like to crunch those numbers for say the top 20-25 players? I would think percentage of the total cap at the time of signing (or PotTCatToS for short) would be much easier than calculating an adjusted salary for everyone. It would get the same point across. $8MM against a $71MM cap this year projected for O'Reilly would come out to 11.26% of the total cap. I would guess the signing of Toews and Kane would provide the high end and give a relative value for each player calculated.
Derrico Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I am doing it. If ROR is worth 8mil against a 71million dollar cap what if we adjusted other players numbers for the inflation, where would he fall on the NHL salary list then. I actually don't care if this proves or disproves my point. As for a percentage of the cap itself. That is another perfectly logical way to look at this. Would someone like to crunch those numbers for say the top 20-25 players? 8mil is 11.27% of the Salary Cap But there is still the big point that salaries =/= quality of player. Circumstances play a huge roll.
MattPie Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 But there is still the big point that salaries =/= quality of player. Circumstances play a huge roll. Agreed, this is mostly a number that applies to UFAs, and even then you have the BRichards Effect where there's only one guy in UFA that year. It gets dicey comparing UFAs to RFAs that sign with their team. For example, Crosby would have made more money had he left Pittsburgh when his contract came up.
Derrico Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Agreed, this is mostly a number that applies to UFAs, and even then you have the BRichards Effect where there's only one guy in UFA that year. It gets dicey comparing UFAs to RFAs that sign with their team. For example, Crosby would have made more money had he left Pittsburgh when his contract came up. Exactly. I love the trademark by the way :lol:
qwksndmonster Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 On Hockey Hotline they made an interesting point on Larsson, does Mike Babcock's success with European players in Detroit make the Sabres more inclined to keep a player like Larsson? If Babcock gets hired before the trade goes down I'm sure he'll give GMTM his input. Something like: The promising young players I'd really like to keep are: blah blah. The young players I'm okay with dangling in a trade are: blah blah. The young players that I don't wanna give up, but would to acquire player X are blah blah blah.
LGR4GM Posted May 19, 2015 Author Report Posted May 19, 2015 (edited) I tossed Patrice Bergeron on here because he is probably one of the best defensive forwards in the league and he also gives you a go low end for top players. This is the adjusted Salaries for 20(22) NHL players. This would be against a 71 million dollar cap. The year in parenthesis indicates the year in which the contract was signed so it was valued against that year's cap. Kane/Toews = 10,815,000 (2014) Ovechkin = 11,446,154 (2008) Malkin = 10,402,500 (2013) Crosby = 9,526,500 (2012) Subban = 9,270,000 (2014) Perry = 9,444,375 (2013) Lundqvist = 9,307,500 (2013) Giroux = 9,061,125 (2013) E. Staal = 9,900,000 (2009) Getzlaf = 9,033,750 (2013) Kessel = 8,760,000 (2013) S. Weber = 8,603,571 (2012) Nash = 9,048,000 (2010) Suter/Parise = 8,254,615 (2012) Stamkos = 8,212,500 (2011) Spezza = 8,400,000 (2008) Datsyuk = 7,725,000 (2014) Bobrovsky = 6,159,375 (2013) B. Ryan = 7,250,000 (2015) Bergeron = 6,695,000 (2014) Edited May 19, 2015 by LGR4GM
inkman Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I don't trade more than Grigs, #21 and a throw in prospect (like Ruhwedel, Leduc or at most Carrier)
LastPommerFan Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 (edited) I am rounding the percentages between that year a contract was signed and compared to todays cap how much that player/contract is worth. So for instance... Alexander Ovechkin was awarded 9,538,462 Caphit in 2008. The difference between the 2008 cap and 2015's is 20% so in today's money, Ovechkin is worth 11,446,154 Any problems with this methodology? Ovi was an RFA and signed a 13 year deal. These need to be factored into the calculation. Crosby signed a 12 year, massively front loaded deal, again, not possible today, so that needs to be factored in. Stamkos was an RFA. I'm thinking maybe put a 20% surcharge on the guys who signed deals as RFAs, and maybe recalculate the numbers for guys with front loaded deals. So Crosby's true salary in 2012 dollars would have been $11M in 2012 UFA $ ( 3 $3M years at the end that I am removing) so with the new cap he's a $12M player (round numbers, math done in my head.) Edited May 19, 2015 by Whiskey Bottle of Emotion
Hoss Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Liver - the cap inflation we're all talking about isn't $71M... It's the anticipated large jump in the next few years. $8M under a $71M cap isn't that bad, but it'll be even better once the cap jumps further.
LGR4GM Posted May 19, 2015 Author Report Posted May 19, 2015 Liver - the cap inflation we're all talking about isn't $71M... It's the anticipated large jump in the next few years. $8M under a $71M cap isn't that bad, but it'll be even better once the cap jumps further. Why do you think the cap is going to have a huge jump in the near future?
Hoss Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Why do you think the cap is going to have a huge jump in the near future? It's been speculated on for a few years. http://mweb.cbssports.com/nhl/eye-on-hockey/23250882/salary-cap-could-reportedly-rise-to-80-million-by-201718
LGR4GM Posted May 19, 2015 Author Report Posted May 19, 2015 It's been speculated on for a few years. http://mweb.cbssports.com/nhl/eye-on-hockey/23250882/salary-cap-could-reportedly-rise-to-80-million-by-201718 I just wonder about that because the NHL already signed their big tv contracts for the next decade in the US and Canada. Also with the Canadian dollar slipping. Not saying it won't just not sure I want to trust that it does.
Samson's Flow Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I just wonder about that because the NHL already signed their big tv contracts for the next decade in the US and Canada. Also with the Canadian dollar slipping. Not saying it won't just not sure I want to trust that it does. Especially with the weak Canadian dollar, there was rumors that this year's cap might not go up at all. I would agree with you that the cap might not have the automatic increase seen in the past few years.
Hoss Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 I just wonder about that because the NHL already signed their big tv contracts for the next decade in the US and Canada. Also with the Canadian dollar slipping. Not saying it won't just not sure I want to trust that it does. The TV money hasn't kicked in yet. When it does that's when the cap is expected to rise.
LastPommerFan Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Oil will go back to 70 by then and the economy to the North will pick back up. THE CANADIAN DOLLAR WILL BE FINE!!
Derrico Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Oil will go back to 70 by then and the economy to the North will pick back up. THE CANADIAN DOLLAR WILL BE FINE!! :w00t:
beerme1 Posted May 19, 2015 Report Posted May 19, 2015 Very interesting comments by you all but again, more so now, I ask has anyone asked for Babs opinion?
LGR4GM Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Posted May 20, 2015 Might be the most spirited hockey debate we've had in years.
SwampD Posted May 20, 2015 Report Posted May 20, 2015 Might be the most spirited hockey debate we've had in years. I wish I cared about the topic because it really was a good discussion.
Drunkard Posted May 20, 2015 Report Posted May 20, 2015 Ryan O'Reilly has all the greatest qualities of Teddy Bruschi, Chuck Norris, and Jesus. I wish he was my Dad. The man simply oozes compete and a blue collar work ethic with his defensive responsibility. Pegula should meddle and ensure we get him at any cost, even if we have to give the team to him upon his retirement from the game.
X. Benedict Posted May 20, 2015 Report Posted May 20, 2015 Ryan O'Reilly has all the greatest qualities of Teddy Bruschi, Chuck Norris, and Jesus. I wish he was my Dad. The man simply oozes compete and a blue collar work ethic with his defensive responsibility. Pegula should meddle and ensure we get him at any cost, even if we have to give the team to him upon his retirement from the game. Wow. Bruschi-Chirst Superstar Texas Ranger.
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