Tim Murray: Lottery Presser

[darksabre]

It's working.

 

There, I just said it.

 

Edmonton. 

 

There, it's not working. 

[LGR4GM]

The system didn't work. No system that allows a team this many #1 picks is working. You can't just say it's working when it very obviously isn't. 

What will the league do if next year the Oilers just miss the playoffs and then win a lottery slot for 1st 2nd or 3rd?

[Robviously]

29 other GMs didn't vote against the lottery changes, finish last, and lose the lottery, so it's hard to say how all of them would have reacted. Secondly, nothing indicates Murray isn't thrilled to have Eichel...he'd just rather have McDavid, like 29 other GMs would. After all, he did call Eichel a franchise changing player in the lead up to the lottery.

 

Sure, but the debate is about professionalism being related to team building.

I'd say being a jerk to the media after a close loss isn't the same as losing a 20% chance to draft 1st when you know the no.2 pick will also be a superstar in the league.  It's a poor comparison.

 

Last night's outcome was predictable and Murray wasn't ready.  Every time I've seen Belichek in a situation like that, he's done the smart thing and given a bunch of bland, predictable statements.  Which is all you really need to do.

 

You're also comparing a guy who has been a GM for ~15 months to a first-ballot HOF coach in the NFL.  Like I mentioned last night, If Murray wants to spout off, he should wait until he's accomplished something in the league.

[TrueBlueGED]

What will the league do if next year the Oilers just miss the playoffs and then win a lottery slot for 1st 2nd or 3rd?

I hope it happens. Then I hope they win two more times and maybe, just maybe, at that point the league will realize the lottery is dumb.

Edited April 19, 2015 by TrueBluePhD

[darksabre]

What will the league do if next year the Oilers just miss the playoffs and then win a lottery slot for 1st 2nd or 3rd?

 

Probably nothing. But I know I'll be apoplectic. The lottery is a joke. 

I hope it happens. Then I hope they win two more times and maybe, just maybe, at that point the league will realize the lottery is dumb.

 

Bingo. 

[TrueBlueGED]

I'd say being a jerk to the media after a close loss isn't the same as losing a 20% chance to draft 1st when you know the no.2 pick will also be a superstar in the league. It's a poor comparison.

 

Last night's outcome was predictable and Murray wasn't ready. Every time I've seen Belichek in a situation like that, he's done the smart thing and given a bunch of bland, predictable statements. Which is all you really need to do.

 

You're also comparing a guy who has been a GM for ~15 months to a first-ballot HOF coach in the NFL. Like I mentioned last night, If Murray wants to spout off, he should wait until he's accomplished something in the league.

It is a poor comparison. Just as saying a GM's PR capabilities in a moment of disappointment are a red flag for his team building capability is a bad argument. A bad comparison for a bad argument.

[Robviously]

It is a poor comparison. Just as saying a GM's PR capabilities in a moment of disappointment are a red flag for his team building capability is a bad argument. A bad comparison for a bad argument.

Wondering about his competence when he crumpled under pressure and said the exact wrong things with the worst possible demeanor in a completely predictable situation seems pretty fair to me.  It speaks to his brains, judgment, and professionalism.  

 

There was an 80% chance we weren't winning the lottery.  He's the face of the franchise and he should have been completely prepared to say all the right things.  He wasn't.  This definitely reflects poorly on him.

[darksabre]

Wondering about his competence when he crumpled under pressure and said the exact wrong things with the worst possible demeanor in a completely predictable situation seems pretty fair to me.  It speaks to his brains, judgment, and professionalism.  

 

There was an 80% chance we weren't winning the lottery.  He's the face of the franchise and he should have been completely prepared to say all the right things.  He wasn't.  This definitely reflects poorly on him.

 

It only reflects poorly on the NHL. If Arizona had won the lottery these comments don't even happen. But Edmonton sneaking in again is a travesty. Take a look around the rest of the NHL world right now and you'll see one common complaint: "How the hell is Edmonton picking first again?". 

 

This is all about Edmonton. 

[LGR4GM]

Wondering about his competence when he crumpled under pressure and said the exact wrong things with the worst possible demeanor in a completely predictable situation seems pretty fair to me.  It speaks to his brains, judgment, and professionalism.  

 

There was an 80% chance we weren't winning the lottery.  He's the face of the franchise and he should have been completely prepared to say all the right things.  He wasn't.  This definitely reflects poorly on him.

what exactly did he say that you hated. exact quotes.

[dudacek]

what exactly did he say that you hated. exact quotes.

 

 

Yeah, me too.

Sorry Rob. I get your point and agree Murray wasn't politically correct and didn't choose his words perfectly.

 

But he hardly slammed Eichel. He said he was "more ready than 99% of the 18-year-olds to ever play in the NHL," said "maybe Sidney Crosby was more ready," said he was "special," and "anyone could tell he was special." In a previous interview he said he was "a number-one centre on a Stanley Cup team."

 

That's hardly "McDavid is my precious the league sucks for stealing him from us and leaving us with this bum Eichel."

Edited April 19, 2015 by dudacek

[LGR4GM]

“We’ve said along there’s two top-end, impact players, if not franchise players, in this draft,” Murray said inside the Toronto Ritz-Carlton. “They both play the right position (center), in my opinion, for rebuilding. As disappointed as we are in not having the No. 1 pick, we’re extremely happy to be able to pick two still.”

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/sabres-nhl/second-coming-sabres-fall-to-no-2-in-draft-eichel-on-teams-radar-20150418

[darksabre]

“We’ve said along there’s two top-end, impact players, if not franchise players, in this draft,” Murray said inside the Toronto Ritz-Carlton. “They both play the right position (center), in my opinion, for rebuilding. As disappointed as we are in not having the No. 1 pick, we’re extremely happy to be able to pick two still.”

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/sabres-nhl/second-coming-sabres-fall-to-no-2-in-draft-eichel-on-teams-radar-20150418

 

So to reiterate, "Thank god there were two generational talents in this draft or I would be even more pissed off."

[LGR4GM]

Some clarification on Tim Murray's thoughts about life

 

Is Buffalo’s goal to make the playoffs next season?

“I would like to think it is, yes,” he said. “Can we get the things done this summer, can we attract the right players, can we make the right trades? I can’t answer that today, but I can tell you we’ve done our homework, we’ve laid the groundwork.”

This is a Tim Murray quote btw

Edited April 19, 2015 by LGR4GM

[K-9]

And he also knows that 29 teams would be thrilled to have him.  Except Buffalo has the one GM that made last night about himself and his frustration, and not about the player we're going to land and the team's future.  If you're Jack Eichel, and you've been hyped for years, that would be a bizarre change of pace.

So Murray is boxed in and tied to his remarks last night no matter what he says about how great it will be to draft Eichel moving forward. Got it.

 

How about we put you in the same box moving forward?

 

GO SABRES!!!

[Taro T]

The system didn't work. No system that is designed to prevent 1 team from repeatedly picking 1st that allows a team this many #1 picks is working. You can't just say it's working when it very obviously isn't.

 

Fixed it for you.

 

If the point of the system is to let a horrible team end up getting rewarded with the concensus best player on multiple occassions because they're horrible (regardless of whether it's due to incompetance, design, circumstances beyond control, or a combination); then it is working.

 

But, by implementing a lottery to keep teams from using the Nordique/Av model of team building, it is apparent that the league would prefer somebody not wearing blue and orange get the 1st pick. A team wearing blue and orange got the 1st pick - AGAIN. Therefore, the system didn't work. It's too bad; that might have been the death knell for Gary Bettman's dream of hockey in the non-California desert.

[darksabre]

Fixed it for you.

 

If the point of the system is to let a horrible team end up getting rewarded with the concensus best player on multiple occassions because they're horrible (regardless of whether it's due to incompetance, design, circumstances beyond control, or a combination); then it is working.

 

But, by implementing a lottery to keep teams from using the Nordique/Av model of team building, it is apparent that the league would prefer somebody not wearing blue and orange get the 1st pick. A team wearing blue and orange got the 1st pick - AGAIN. Therefore, the system didn't work. It's too bad; that might have been the death knell for Gary Bettman's dream of hockey in the non-California desert.

 

I think you're half right with your fix. The system is designed to prevent the worst team from getting repeated #1 picks. Not one team, just the worst team. So that a team cannot intentionally be the worst team repeatedly.

 

The problem here is that it might actually be harder to repeatedly be the worst team than to just be a bad team. Edmonton wouldn't have had all these #1 picks if they'd been consistently the 30th place team. But by being consistently just kinda bad, they actually ended up gaming the system even more. I don't think that was the league's intent. 

 

And now they've changed the rules again, to punish teams that finish in last place, and reward teams like Edmonton who might finish anywhere between 24th and 29th. 

 

This is a mess. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Liger,

 

Rob posted a link to a SN video of the Murray presser on the top of page 2.

 

He did indeed say that he was disappointed for our fans.  The context being ... 2 years of bad play and the fact that many Sabre fans went to Erie to watch Connor play.

 

-----

 

For what it's worth I'm with you Rob.  I have been accused of being a contrarian recently, but I don't care.

 

Our GM sounds like an idiot most of the time.  He probably isn't an idiot and I hope he can build a good team, but the Sabres better get someone else to do the talking, or coach this guy on what to say and how to say it.

 

Those things he said yesterday are just idiotic.  And if he is thinking this will fire Jack up, Jack doesn't need that.

[Randall Flagg]

So you are just butt hurt (to use your word) over who won, not whether or not the system worked, right?

 

I wonder if all the teams that are still playing give a rat's fart about all of this nonsense.

There was a quote I saw yesterday from an executive of a playoff team talking about how unfair it is that Edmonton won again, so at least one team still playing cares.

[LGR4GM]

Liger,

 

Rob posted a link to a SN video of the Murray presser on the top of page 2.

 

He did indeed say that he was disappointed for our fans.  The context being ... 2 years of bad play and the fact that many Sabre fans went to Erie to watch Connor play.

 

-----

 

For what it's worth I'm with you Rob.  I have been accused of being a contrarian recently, but I don't care.

 

Our GM sounds like an idiot most of the time.  He probably isn't an idiot and I hope he can build a good team, but the Sabres better get someone else to do the talking, or coach this guy on what to say and how to say it.

 

Those things he said yesterday are just idiotic.  And if he is thinking this will fire Jack up, Jack doesn't need that.

He said "I feel for the fans"

 

That is not the same as "I am disappointed for the fans"

 

Now that I have context for the actual comment... I really don't care.  No one will care in June.  

[Sabres Fan in NS]

He said "I feel for the fans"

 

That is not the same as "I am disappointed for the fans"

 

Now that I have context for the actual comment... I really don't care.  No one will care in June.  

 

You are correct, but don't the two statements mean pretty much the same thing.

 

I agree no one will really care, but this is a pattern where our GM says silly things.  At some point the odds are that he will really go overboard and then we'll remember.

[LGR4GM]

You are correct, but don't the two statements mean pretty much the same thing.

 

I agree no one will really care, but this is a pattern where our GM says silly things.  At some point the odds are that he will really go overboard and then we'll remember.

No.  One indicates he understands that fans may in fact be disappointed because they hoped for McDavid and saw him more often.

 

The other indicates Murray is also disappointed. 

 

One shows sympathy for the fans, the other indicates Murrays feelings.  Personally I think Murray thinks that fans may be less aware of Eichel and that was a partial motivator.  Either way by June, no one will care or remember.  Jack certainly won't, Murary won't, and regular fans won't.

[Robviously]

what exactly did he say that you hated. exact quotes.

He said THREE really stupid things:

1. "I feel for the fans...." -- These would be the same fans who celebrated clinching 30th because it meant Eichel.  The fans aren't upset; the fans are excited.  This is Murray whining and trying to use the fans as cover for that.  

2. His whole WJC analogy.  Being cut from the team and missing a chance to play for your country is NOT the same thing as landing the lesser of two generational talents coming out in this year's draft.  This analogy fails on every level.

3. "We'll make the best of it." -- This is just a sh*tty thing to say.  Everyone drafts who is available to them, and the GM is not supposed to mutter "we'll make the best of it" because the guy he daydreams about won't be there.

[Randall Flagg]

The only whining I hear is from the guy who needs something else to be a downer about now that two seasons in a row we didn't make the magical run out of last he spent months insisting would happen. :angel:

[Robviously]

Yeah, me too.

Sorry Rob. I get your point and agree Murray wasn't politically correct and didn't choose his words perfectly.

 

But he hardly slammed Eichel. He said he was "more ready than 99% of the 18-year-olds to ever play in the NHL," said "maybe Sidney Crosby was more ready," said he was "special," and "anyone could tell he was special." In a previous interview he said he was "a number-one centre on a Stanley Cup team."

 

That's hardly "McDavid is my precious the league sucks for stealing him from us and leaving us with this bum Eichel."

Never said he slammed him, but he damned him with faint praise.

 

He also made last night all about him and his feelings rather than the team, the city, and the bright future we have.  He failed miserably as the face of our franchise last night and the proof is that no one is actually happy with what he said.  The BEST thing anyone can say about it is "oh, he was just upset."  He just did a terrible job.  And, yes, now this does make me wonder just how often he runs his mouth and says something stupid.

 

Imagine how much better that all goes if he took last night as an opportunity to talk up all the young players we already have and how he can't wait to add to that.  It would have been really easy to have an insanely positive press conference.  And with an 80% chance we weren't drafting first, he should have been ready to do that.

 

He either wasn't ready or just choose to handle this horribly.  I'm not sure which is worse.

[K-9]

He said THREE really stupid things:

1. "I feel for the fans...." -- These would be the same fans who celebrated clinching 30th because it meant Eichel.  The fans aren't upset; the fans are excited.  This is Murray whining and trying to use the fans as cover for that.  

2. His whole WJC analogy.  Being cut from the team and missing a chance to play for your country is NOT the same thing as landing the lesser of two generational talents coming out in this year's draft.  This analogy fails on every level.

3. "We'll make the best of it." -- This is just a sh*tty thing to say.  Everyone drafts who is available to them, and the GM is not supposed to mutter "we'll make the best of it" because the guy he daydreams about won't be there.

There's still plenty of room in the box for you to add more stupid things Murray says that you can forever hold him to. Because, you know, his entire career in hockey can be confined to stupid comments made in a 10 minute presser.

 

GO SABRES!!!