Better call Saul

[PromoTheRobot]

Very good episode. Very sad watching Jimmy mess w/ Irene. Been trying to place where I've seen Irene before. Was she the flight attendant for Sandpiper Air on Wings? She sounds like her but hard to say for sure 25 years later. If she is, either time or makeup have not been kind.

 

Separate note:

I'm wondering if at the end of next season Chuck winds up hanging himself in his closet. Binge watched some BB over the weekend suffering through a massive summer cold. When Walt told Saul about his apparent impending divorce the reply back was to the effect of "just don't hang yourself in a closet." The sort of throw away line that Gilligan seems to like to build around.

But you know what? Jimmy has a point with Irene. She's clueless about the lawsuit and willing to follow the lawyer's lead without question while her friends are being denied a million in settlement money. These are people who could be dead by the time the lawyers settle and all they get is a few thousand more for waiting. If anyone is evil it's the law firms. Sure Jimmy's being a conniving dick, and has his self-interest at heart, but he isn't wrong.

[qwksndmonster]

But you know what? Jimmy has a point with Irene. She's clueless about the lawsuit and willing to follow the lawyer's lead without question while her friends are being denied a million in settlement money. These are people who could be dead by the time the lawyers settle and all they get is a few thousand more for waiting. If anyone is evil it's the law firms. Sure Jimmy's being a conniving dick, and has his self-interest at heart, but he isn't wrong.

Which has always been true of the things Jimmy does. Jimmy is a firm believer that the ends justify the means. He's now losing his empathy and accepting that his plans are going to have collateral damage.

 

What makes this so shocking is that Jimmy is the one doing it. In Breaking Bad Jimmy did a whole lot of advising other people to do horrible things. This is the worst thing we've ever seen Jimmy OR Saul do. It makes me wonder how far he's going to be gone by the time we get to Breaking Bad.

Edited June 14, 2017 by qwksndmonster

[sabills]

Man, Jimmy/Saul is just such a real character compared with others on TV. He's not a monster, and he's not excruciatingly unlucky, and he's not a complete dolt. We're watching a guy who's being destroyed from within and without slowly but surely by a combination of greed and love in equal measure. 

[Taro T]

But you know what? Jimmy has a point with Irene. She's clueless about the lawsuit and willing to follow the lawyer's lead without question while her friends are being denied a million in settlement money. These are people who could be dead by the time the lawyers settle and all they get is a few thousand more for waiting. If anyone is evil it's the law firms. Sure Jimmy's being a conniving dick, and has his self-interest at heart, but he isn't wrong.

Why is someone or some entity necessarily evil? (Big hint; your use of the word "if" is telling. :) )

 

Each entity is acting in their own best interest & justifying to themselves their interests are aligned with the majority of the plaintiffs. Irene appears to not desperately need the money now and because that's her base frame of reference doesn't realize some of her friends MIGHT need it now. She's gotten factual & correct advice from very high priced & well respected (w/in the legal field) lawyers that if she waits it out ALL her friends will make substantially more than what is currently on the table.

 

And considering it's 2002 & savings accounts are accruing next to nothing, the NPV of waiting iS greater than accepting the settlement. Irene is trusting the experts & isn't fully cognizant that some of her friends have a much steeper discount rate. Jimmy, because for the next year he has almost no way to honestly earn what he was earning, also desperately needs the money. He's telling himself that he's helping all the plaintiffs but he really is destroying Irene (her damage is collateral, but real & was deemed acceptable when Jimmy dropped his "IED" on her).

 

The reason Jimmy is "wrong" but DM & HHM aren't to the same degree is HE is intentionally falsely representing himself to Irene & her friends & more importantly falsely representing IRENE. See, she's getting brand new mall shoes,; see, she's so lucky that she wins bingo in 5 calls. (Surprised Jimmy didn't have her win in 4. Guess he figured that would be TOO obvious. ;)) She doesn't need the money & now she'll NEVER settle is what the friends were thinking, but their ire & Jimmy's "advice" moved her to accept the settlement. But her relationship with those people is likely forever tarnished.

 

Yes the corporate lawyers will make more by waiting, but so will the plaintiffs. Their advice is factually correct & with her being their only real point of contact (she CAN/ IS WILLING to wait for the greater payday) & their advice (based on the correct or incorrect assumption that the others are in the same boat) is probably sound as well.

 

Again, watching Jimmy destroy her is sad.

[PromoTheRobot]

Why is someone or some entity necessarily evil? (Big hint; your use of the word "if" is telling. :) )

 

Each entity is acting in their own best interest & justifying to themselves their interests are aligned with the majority of the plaintiffs. Irene appears to not desperately need the money now and because that's her base frame of reference doesn't realize some of her friends MIGHT need it now. She's gotten factual & correct advice from very high priced & well respected (w/in the legal field) lawyers that if she waits it out ALL her friends will make substantially more than what is currently on the table.

 

And considering it's 2002 & savings accounts are accruing next to nothing, the NPV of waiting iS greater than accepting the settlement. Irene is trusting the experts & isn't fully cognizant that some of her friends have a much steeper discount rate. Jimmy, because for the next year he has almost no way to honestly earn what he was earning, also desperately needs the money. He's telling himself that he's helping all the plaintiffs but he really is destroying Irene (her damage is collateral, but real & was deemed acceptable when Jimmy dropped his "IED" on her).

 

The reason Jimmy is "wrong" but DM & HHM aren't to the same degree is HE is intentionally falsely representing himself to Irene & her friends & more importantly falsely representing IRENE. See, she's getting brand new mall shoes,; see, she's so lucky that she wins bingo in 5 calls. (Surprised Jimmy didn't have her win in 4. Guess he figured that would be TOO obvious. ;)) She doesn't need the money & now she'll NEVER settle is what the friends were thinking, but their ire & Jimmy's "advice" moved her to accept the settlement. But her relationship with those people is likely forever tarnished.

 

Yes the corporate lawyers will make more by waiting, but so will the plaintiffs. Their advice is factually correct & with her being their only real point of contact (she CAN/ IS WILLING to wait for the greater payday) & their advice (based on the correct or incorrect assumption that the others are in the same boat) is probably sound as well.

 

Again, watching Jimmy destroy her is sad.

Yes that's bad. But you have a law firm (two actually) that are playing the long game in a settlement when their clients don't know how much longer they are going to live. So you have law firms acting in their own interest, completely ignoring the needs of their elderly clients. That's not evil? Edited June 14, 2017 by PromoTheRobot

[Taro T]

Yes that's bad. But you have a law firm (two actually) that are playing the long game in a settlement when their clients don't know how much longer they are going to live. So you have law firms acting in their own interest, completely ignoring the needs of their elderly clients. That's not evil?

Do you know what the "needs" of those elderly clients are? Some probably do "need" the money, but they don't appear to have told that to Irene prior to the start of the episode. Some probably do "want" the money now. And some might be looking to get their grandkids started with/getting a leg up. For that 3rd group, settling now is absolutely the worst choice. How many are in each group? We don't know. Gilligan & his other writers kept that to themselves.

 

Also, there are companies that buy settlements & in something that's this close to a lock, there are those that will buy impending judgements as well. So, for those that have been too proud to tell Irene "hey, we're really hurting, can you accept what's on the table" there are options to get money now as well which won't hose the rest of the class out of additional revenues.

 

The ONLY one from the plaintiff's team that is directly (& unabashedly) hosing anyone is Jimmy because he's desperate & more importantly when you're Slippin' Jimmy you slip, it's what you do. ;)

Edited June 15, 2017 by Taro T

[Taro T]

Very good episode. Very sad watching Jimmy mess w/ Irene. Been trying to place where I've seen Irene before. Was she the flight attendant for Sandpiper Air on Wings? She sounds like her but hard to say for sure 25 years later. If she is, either time or makeup have not been kind.

Separate note:

I'm wondering if at the end of next season Chuck winds up hanging himself in his closet. Binge watched some BB over the weekend suffering through a massive summer cold. When Walt told Saul about his apparent impending divorce the reply back was to the effect of "just don't hang yourself in a closet." The sort of throw away line that Gilligan seems to like to build around.

So much for that call. :doh:

 

But in a wierd way good to see Jimmy get Irene her friends back.

[qwksndmonster]

I'm at a loss for words.

[bunomatic]

Chuckys revenge 

[sabills]

Still can not muster up much sympathy for Chuck.

[spndnchz]

No credit to Marcellosaurus for that one? :p

Yep. Current episodes are in early 2003. Series started in '02. (Not counting the b&w bits.)

BB started in '08 & ended in '10.

Found in the on demand show description: 6 years before he meets Walter White

[nfreeman]

I caught up last night.  Really good last couple of episodes, although I would've preferred more Mike and less Chuck losing his marbles in the finale.

 

I also think they should've provided some numbers in the whole Jimmy/Irene/settlement plotline -- i.e. the amount to be gained by waiting another year or 2 wasn't fleshed out at all, other than Jimmy claiming it was negligible. 

 

Do we think Gus knows about Nacho and the meds?

[bunomatic]

I caught up last night.  Really good last couple of episodes, although I would've preferred more Mike and less Chuck losing his marbles in the finale.

 

I also think they should've provided some numbers in the whole Jimmy/Irene/settlement plotline -- i.e. the amount to be gained by waiting another year or 2 wasn't fleshed out at all, other than Jimmy claiming it was negligible. 

 

Do we think Gus knows about Nacho and the meds?

Gus did give him that look at the end of that scene there. That was the feeling I got watching that play out. I'm not sure he could come to that conclusion from seeing Nacho collect the fallen pills.

[sabills]

I caught up last night.  Really good last couple of episodes, although I would've preferred more Mike and less Chuck losing his marbles in the finale.

 

I also think they should've provided some numbers in the whole Jimmy/Irene/settlement plotline -- i.e. the amount to be gained by waiting another year or 2 wasn't fleshed out at all, other than Jimmy claiming it was negligible. 

 

Do we think Gus knows about Nacho and the meds?

 

He knows something is up, that's for sure.

[nfreeman]

Season premiere tonight!

[Stoner]

30 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Season premiere tonight!

A very pleasant surprise that I learned over the weekend. I honestly have no idea when shows are on anymore. Fargo anyone?

[Taro T]

15 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

A very pleasant surprise that I learned over the weekend. I honestly have no idea when shows are on anymore. Fargo anyone?

No data on when/if another Fargo season is in the works, but Sunny's 13th season finally premieres on September 5 IIRC.

[shrader]

1 hour ago, Taro T said:

No data on when/if another Fargo season is in the works, but Sunny's 13th season finally premieres on September 5 IIRC.

Happy birthday to me!

[apuszczalowski]

8 hours ago, Taro T said:

No data on when/if another Fargo season is in the works, but Sunny's 13th season finally premieres on September 5 IIRC.

And it's been confirmed that the 'Golden God' will be back too in most episodes. Also sounds like Mindy Kaling from the office and her show on fox will be joining the show. Not sure if it's full time or part time.

I was hoping that since AP Bio was such a horrible pile of crap that Dennis would be back, looks like we get lucky even though NBC must be so desperate that the renewed AP Bio......

 

[apuszczalowski]

On 6/21/2017 at 7:35 AM, nfreeman said:

I caught up last night.  Really good last couple of episodes, although I would've preferred more Mike and less Chuck losing his marbles in the finale.

 

I also think they should've provided some numbers in the whole Jimmy/Irene/settlement plotline -- i.e. the amount to be gained by waiting another year or 2 wasn't fleshed out at all, other than Jimmy claiming it was negligible. 

 

Do we think Gus knows about Nacho and the meds?

I think that seeing Chuck losing his marbles is more important to the show then Mike, from the previews for this season it seems that Chicks death might be the big push that turns Jimmy to Saul.

[Stoner]

The first episode was meh somehow. I can't put my finger on it.

[inkman]

Man 5 episodes in and no one has rekindled this thread. Shame!  Our first Saul sighting? (My memory sucks) I love this show and it's taking off. Seeing the groundwork for the lab, introduced tion to Gene (who I love as mikey wags inbillions), Kim acting all disjointed and seemingly taking Jimmy's brother death way worse than he (although I think we know the meltdown is coming). Love this damn show!

Edited September 4, 2018 by inkman

[bunomatic]

I'm with ya Ink but I missed the two previous shows to last nights so I'll have to catch up somehow. 

[Taro T]

6 hours ago, inkman said:

Man 5 episodes in and no one has rekindled this thread. Shame!  Our first Saul sighting? (My memory sucks) I love this show and it's taking off. Seeing the groundwork for the lab, introduced tion to Gene (who I love as mikey wags inbillions), Kim acting all disjointed and seemingly taking Jimmy's brother death way worse than he (although I think we know the meltdown is coming). Love this damn show!

Pretty cool seeing Saul get ready for his transition to Cinnabon.  Looking forward to Franchesca (sp?) getting that phone call.  Wondering what it'll be.  Expecting to see it sometime in the season finale.

Interesting he got rolled at the Dog House.

Kim does seem to be cracking.  Still expecting her storyline to be the most tragic.

What was up w/ Howard?  Did Chuck's demise do this to him directly from the guilt or indirectly from all the client rear end smooching finally wearing him down?

[shrader]

Things seem to be escalating really quickly now.  It makes me think we may see an even more crazy ending to this season.  It's tough to top last season's.

Edited September 5, 2018 by shrader